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  • FIRST POST
    • Jaffapig
    • By Jaffapig 10th Jul 18, 7:51 PM
    • 62Posts
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    Jaffapig
    Council tax when occupying two properties?
    • #1
    • 10th Jul 18, 7:51 PM
    Council tax when occupying two properties? 10th Jul 18 at 7:51 PM
    Hi, I hope this is the right board for this Q.

    A quick one - what are the rules for paying council tax when you are occupying two properties at the same time (within the same council)?

    Basically I may have up to a two month overlap between handing the keys back on my rental property and moving into the house I'm purchasing. Not sure what to budget for council tax.

    Will I need to pay tax on both properties?
Page 1
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 10th Jul 18, 7:56 PM
    • 4,567 Posts
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    Cakeguts
    • #2
    • 10th Jul 18, 7:56 PM
    • #2
    • 10th Jul 18, 7:56 PM
    Your not occupying two properties at the same time you are only going to be occupying one. It is no different to someone who owns two houses in the same borough you pay council tax on both of them.
    • Slithery
    • By Slithery 10th Jul 18, 7:58 PM
    • 783 Posts
    • 1,204 Thanks
    Slithery
    • #3
    • 10th Jul 18, 7:58 PM
    • #3
    • 10th Jul 18, 7:58 PM
    Also if you're claiming single-person discount you will only get this for one of the properties - the other will be full price.
    • Jaffapig
    • By Jaffapig 10th Jul 18, 8:05 PM
    • 62 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Jaffapig
    • #4
    • 10th Jul 18, 8:05 PM
    • #4
    • 10th Jul 18, 8:05 PM
    Ok thanks both that answers that! No discounts to take advantage of unfortunately.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 10th Jul 18, 8:28 PM
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    G_M
    • #5
    • 10th Jul 18, 8:28 PM
    • #5
    • 10th Jul 18, 8:28 PM
    You may find the opposite.

    Some councils charge extra for a 2nd home.
    There again,some allow a discount for an 'empty' property (check definition of empty).


    Check your council's website - it should explain.
    • Jaffapig
    • By Jaffapig 10th Jul 18, 8:39 PM
    • 62 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Jaffapig
    • #6
    • 10th Jul 18, 8:39 PM
    • #6
    • 10th Jul 18, 8:39 PM
    Some councils charge extra for a 2nd home
    Originally posted by G_M
    oh gosh!

    Ok will do, thank you.
    • Jaffapig
    • By Jaffapig 10th Jul 18, 8:48 PM
    • 62 Posts
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    Jaffapig
    • #7
    • 10th Jul 18, 8:48 PM
    • #7
    • 10th Jul 18, 8:48 PM
    Oh turns out we can get an exemption if the property is unfurnished, which one of the properties will be at any one time
    • CIS
    • By CIS 10th Jul 18, 9:37 PM
    • 10,570 Posts
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    CIS
    • #8
    • 10th Jul 18, 9:37 PM
    • #8
    • 10th Jul 18, 9:37 PM
    Oh turns out we can get an exemption if the property is unfurnished, which one of the properties will be at any one time
    Originally posted by Jaffapig

    Are you in England, Wales or Scotland ?
    I no longer work in Council Tax Recovery but instead work as a self employed Council Tax specialist. My views are my own reading of the law and you should always check with the local authority in question.
    • CIS
    • By CIS 10th Jul 18, 9:39 PM
    • 10,570 Posts
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    CIS
    • #9
    • 10th Jul 18, 9:39 PM
    • #9
    • 10th Jul 18, 9:39 PM
    In respect of the council tax premium on an empty property it can only apply where it's been empty 12 months or more (Scotland and Wales) or 24 months in England so unless the property was already empty for a period before you took the tenancy then there won't a premium.
    I no longer work in Council Tax Recovery but instead work as a self employed Council Tax specialist. My views are my own reading of the law and you should always check with the local authority in question.
    • saajan_12
    • By saajan_12 11th Jul 18, 1:33 PM
    • 1,302 Posts
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    saajan_12
    Taking each property individually, you are liable for any & all council tax while you own / rent it.

    However, there may be discounts e.g. if a property is empty & substantially unfurnished. Be careful as these discounts are often time limited, and eventually can go from a discount to a premium.

    So the bill may be 0 for some / all of the overlap, but if there's any CT due then you will be liable, it doesn't revert to anyone else (unless you're in a special case of SPT on the rental, then it reverts to the landlord once you move out).
    • CIS
    • By CIS 11th Jul 18, 1:46 PM
    • 10,570 Posts
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    CIS
    Basically I may have up to a two month overlap between handing the keys back on my rental property and moving into the house I'm purchasing. Not sure what to budget for council tax.
    What will be the position regarding the tenancy at the point you leave - will it still be within the fixed period or will the fixed period have already expired ? If the fixed term will have expired by the date you vacate will the tenancy roll on under a contractual term or will it have defaulted to a statutory periodic tenancy ?
    I no longer work in Council Tax Recovery but instead work as a self employed Council Tax specialist. My views are my own reading of the law and you should always check with the local authority in question.
    • Jaffapig
    • By Jaffapig 11th Jul 18, 6:47 PM
    • 62 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Jaffapig
    Right I'll try and respond to a few comments at once.

    We are in Wales.

    The house we're buying has likely been vacant for some time if that makes a difference - probably wouldn't try to claim it is unoccupied when in our possession, we'll likely move in v quickly after receiving keys. Will see if we can get any leeway on the empty rental property.

    With regards our tenancy. Not quite sure how that is going to play out yet. The fixed term ends at the end of September. We hope to give landlord notice by the end of this month that we won't be renewing. We are prepared to pay rent till the end of the fixed term despite living elsewhere but would ask the landlord if should he find someone who'd like to move in earlier to end our contract and return the proportional amount of rent. But we don't have much hope as they strike me as preferring to make things easier for themselves, i.e. no rush to find a new tenant knowing we're on the hook for rent until then.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 11th Jul 18, 8:16 PM
    • 44,728 Posts
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    G_M
    Moving on from the council tax issue:
    With regards our tenancy. ....The fixed term ends at the end of September. We hope to give landlord notice by the end of this month that we won't be renewing.
    Probably no need - by definition, when a fixed term ends the contract ends irrespective of notice (provide you move out)

    We are prepared to pay rent till the end of the fixed term ( - you have no choice!) despite living elsewhere but would ask the landlord if should he find someone who'd like to move in earlier to end our contract and return the proportional amount of rent.
    Yup! The key word there is 'ask'.

    But we don't have much hope as they strike me as preferring to make things easier for themselves, i.e. no rush to find a new tenant knowing we're on the hook for rent until then.
    Originally posted by Jaffapig
    The use of your phrase 'on the hook' somehow implies the landlord would be exploiting you (fishing hook, reeling you in etc).

    This is unfair. You and the landlord agreed a contract for a fixed period of time. If the roles were reversed, and the landlord wished to evict you and move back in himself, you would probably consider this unfair. Would the LL say "this tenant has got us 'on the hook'?"
    • Jaffapig
    • By Jaffapig 11th Jul 18, 8:53 PM
    • 62 Posts
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    Jaffapig
    No I know, I do understand. I am just left a bit bitter because they refused to allow us to have any rolling tenancy, only a 12 month was allowed when the last fixed term came to an end which is very inflexible when you're looking for a house. This has forced us into a position where we are now fighting to buy a house by X time as we can't afford to have to sign another lengthy term. Due to the last house falling through we have had to rush this sale, we didn't feel we had time to be savvy with our most recent offer and have probably paid more as a result of not having the flexibility just so we can secure a proceedable home quickly. I admit I will not miss renting as I have always felt at the mercy of the landlord. It's great that the landlord has security but we are the ones who foot the bill for that. This one we have now is actually generally nice and reasonable but he has sadly been the exception.

    Oop didn't see your bits in red at first: we want to give him notice out of courtesy rather than from a legal standing.
    Last edited by Jaffapig; 11-07-2018 at 8:56 PM.
    • Slithery
    • By Slithery 11th Jul 18, 9:45 PM
    • 783 Posts
    • 1,204 Thanks
    Slithery
    I am just left a bit bitter because they refused to allow us to have any rolling tenancy, only a 12 month was allowed when the last fixed term came to an end which is very inflexible when you're looking for a house.
    Originally posted by Jaffapig
    You should have posted here back then. We'd all have told you that it's your statuary right to go on to a rolling tenancy. The LL/agents wishes can't change what the law entitles you to.
    Last edited by Slithery; 11-07-2018 at 10:05 PM.
    • Jaffapig
    • By Jaffapig 11th Jul 18, 9:51 PM
    • 62 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Jaffapig
    Excuse me while I weep a little. I did not know that. I don't need the detail now of course but how is that?
    • Slithery
    • By Slithery 11th Jul 18, 10:06 PM
    • 783 Posts
    • 1,204 Thanks
    Slithery
    Ending/renewing an AST

    Has links to the relevant section of the 1988 Housing Act.

    Lettings agents try to strongarm unknowing tenants into signing a new tenancy as they can then charge both the tenant and the landlord for the privilege, whereas if it rolls over into an SPT they can't charge either of you as no new paperwork needs to be drawn up.

    Of course the downside of going onto a periodic tenancy is that you can be served with an S21 - the letting agent will then charge the LL even more money for finding new tenants as well as drawing up their new tenancy. Unfortunately a lot of LL's aren't as savvy with the law as they should be so do whatever their agent advises, but approaching them directly and explaining the situation will usually solve this.
    Last edited by Slithery; 11-07-2018 at 10:33 PM.
    • Jaffapig
    • By Jaffapig 11th Jul 18, 10:40 PM
    • 62 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Jaffapig
    Well I wish we'd known this as there was no letting agent involved and I think faced with facts the landlord would have accepted it, I don't think he'd have been petty and go rid of us. It's a shame we didn't realise but I hope this has enlightened someone else and it helps them in future fortunately this only affetcs as to the tune of 2 months and not e.g 6!
    • Slithery
    • By Slithery 11th Jul 18, 10:53 PM
    • 783 Posts
    • 1,204 Thanks
    Slithery
    Well then have you asked your LL if they would be willing to let you out of your tenancy early?

    A tenancy can be ended at any time if both the LL and tenant agree, with no need to serve out the remaining term. For example you may be able to persuade them to let you go early for say half a months rent if they're not willing to do it for nothing. It's all negotiable, just make sure that you get an agreement in writing if you do go down this route.
    Last edited by Slithery; 11-07-2018 at 11:02 PM.
    • silvercar
    • By silvercar 12th Jul 18, 8:59 AM
    • 37,380 Posts
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    silvercar
    Well I wish we'd known this as there was no letting agent involved and I think faced with facts the landlord would have accepted it, I don't think he'd have been petty and go rid of us. It's a shame we didn't realise but I hope this has enlightened someone else and it helps them in future fortunately this only affetcs as to the tune of 2 months and not e.g 6!
    Originally posted by Jaffapig
    Don't dwell on this too much. It may have been that the landlord would have given you notice, had you refused to sign for another year.

    At least you now know that if your current purchase goes wrong you won't have to sign for another year.
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