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  • FIRST POST
    • Jon 01
    • By Jon 01 9th Jul 18, 1:27 PM
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    Jon 01
    Car Warranty and the competency of a dealer?
    • #1
    • 9th Jul 18, 1:27 PM
    Car Warranty and the competency of a dealer? 9th Jul 18 at 1:27 PM
    Afternoon all,

    We bought a 5 year old 208 auto about 6 weeks back. 27k on the clock.

    We've found it has a couple of problems. One, the hill start assist doesn't always work, you take your foot off the brake and it rolls back.

    It has Eco start/stop to switch the engine off when waiting at lights ect. This hardly ever works.

    I've spoken to the original owner and it's had these issues since about 9 months from new. He took it back to the main dealer a number of times and they said they'd fixed it, but after a week or so their 'fix' stopped working.
    As he bought it for his wife ( and I gather he's loaded) after the 5th or 6th try he just sold it on and bought her something else.

    I've been in contact with Peugeot customer care and they say as it's more then 3 years old, it's tough...
    Now surely a warranty shouldn't be down to the competency of the main dealer? If they are unable or unwilling to fix an issues is just ok to wait for the warranty to expire and then start to change for something that should have been resolved 4 years ago?

    The main dealer that couldn't fix it is over 100 miles away from me so I can't easily take back there.
    The third party dealer I bought it from I guess is liable, but as a fix is main dealer only it's down to
    Peugeot anyway.
    I've also spoke with a local garage that specializes in this kind thing and they've stopped even trying to fix Peugeot auto with these faults as it's a hiding to nowhere.


    Anyone know if Peugeot can just wash their hands on this???

    Thanks
Page 1
    • SuperHan
    • By SuperHan 9th Jul 18, 1:55 PM
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    SuperHan
    • #2
    • 9th Jul 18, 1:55 PM
    • #2
    • 9th Jul 18, 1:55 PM
    Afternoon all,

    We bought a 5 year old 208 auto about 6 weeks back. 27k on the clock.

    We've found it has a couple of problems. One, the hill start assist doesn't always work, you take your foot off the brake and it rolls back.

    It has Eco start/stop to switch the engine off when waiting at lights ect. This hardly ever works.

    I've spoken to the original owner and it's had these issues since about 9 months from new. He took it back to the main dealer a number of times and they said they'd fixed it, but after a week or so their 'fix' stopped working.
    As he bought it for his wife ( and I gather he's loaded) after the 5th or 6th try he just sold it on and bought her something else.

    I've been in contact with Peugeot customer care and they say as it's more then 3 years old, it's tough...
    Now surely a warranty shouldn't be down to the competency of the main dealer? If they are unable or unwilling to fix an issues is just ok to wait for the warranty to expire and then start to change for something that should have been resolved 4 years ago?

    The main dealer that couldn't fix it is over 100 miles away from me so I can't easily take back there.
    The third party dealer I bought it from I guess is liable, but as a fix is main dealer only it's down to
    Peugeot anyway.
    I've also spoke with a local garage that specializes in this kind thing and they've stopped even trying to fix Peugeot auto with these faults as it's a hiding to nowhere.


    Anyone know if Peugeot can just wash their hands on this???

    Thanks
    Originally posted by Jon 01

    First of all, you need to find out whether the original warranty is transferrable and if so, the correct steps have been taken to transfer it to you.


    If it's not transferrable, then as the previous owner has no desire to pursue then there's nothing you can do.


    If there is - then you may be able to enforce it as the issue was raised in the warranty period and hasn't been repaired, but this will depend on the terms of the warranty.


    From a consumer rights perspective, you can pursue the dealer who sold it to you for a repair. It's up to them how they get a repair, so if they have to take it to a main dealer then that's their issue.
    • shaun from Africa
    • By shaun from Africa 9th Jul 18, 2:49 PM
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    shaun from Africa
    • #3
    • 9th Jul 18, 2:49 PM
    • #3
    • 9th Jul 18, 2:49 PM
    It has Eco start/stop to switch the engine off when waiting at lights ect. This hardly ever works.
    Originally posted by Jon 01
    What sort of driving do you do?
    If it's lots of short journeys then the stop/start not operating is quite common as there are a few things that need to happen before the system becomes active and these will include the battery reaching a full state of charge which if you are doing lots of short trips may never happen.
    • Jon 01
    • By Jon 01 9th Jul 18, 3:23 PM
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    Jon 01
    • #4
    • 9th Jul 18, 3:23 PM
    • #4
    • 9th Jul 18, 3:23 PM
    What sort of driving do you do?
    If it's lots of short journeys then the stop/start not operating is quite common as there are a few things that need to happen before the system becomes active and these will include the battery reaching a full state of charge which if you are doing lots of short trips may never happen.
    Originally posted by shaun from Africa
    On the same trip, sometimes it works, most of the time it doesn't.
    • Jon 01
    • By Jon 01 9th Jul 18, 3:26 PM
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    Jon 01
    • #5
    • 9th Jul 18, 3:26 PM
    • #5
    • 9th Jul 18, 3:26 PM
    First of all, you need to find out whether the original warranty is transferrable and if so, the correct steps have been taken to transfer it to you.


    If it's not transferrable, then as the previous owner has no desire to pursue then there's nothing you can do.


    If there is - then you may be able to enforce it as the issue was raised in the warranty period and hasn't been repaired, but this will depend on the terms of the warranty.


    From a consumer rights perspective, you can pursue the dealer who sold it to you for a repair. It's up to them how they get a repair, so if they have to take it to a main dealer then that's their issue.
    Originally posted by SuperHan
    So as long as a dealer can avoid the issue they push it out of warranty and then charge for a fix?

    The fix in this case; new gearbox £4500, diags £150, reloading the ECU's £150

    So rather than them doing under warranty and it costing them, I now have to pay. Great scam for the dealer...
    • verityboo
    • By verityboo 9th Jul 18, 3:32 PM
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    verityboo
    • #6
    • 9th Jul 18, 3:32 PM
    • #6
    • 9th Jul 18, 3:32 PM
    On the same trip, sometimes it works, most of the time it doesn't.
    Originally posted by Jon 01
    Have you looked in the manual to see when it should and shouldn't work. In the kind of weather we are having currently it is common for it not to work as the engine has to continue powering the aircon. There will be a whole list of reasons why it doesn't cut in (such as having to charge the battery as stated above) and you cannot expect it to work/not work in an identical way on every trip

    Again it would be worth checking what the manual says about the hill start assist. On cars I have had with this feature is has not worked on gentle gradients where the car can still roll. The manual may state that the function is limited to certain gradients?

    Sounds like there is no fault but you need to understand how the 2 things work. It hasn't helped that the previous owner seems to have been clueless about how the car worked
    • Jon 01
    • By Jon 01 9th Jul 18, 5:08 PM
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    Jon 01
    • #7
    • 9th Jul 18, 5:08 PM
    • #7
    • 9th Jul 18, 5:08 PM
    Have you looked in the manual to see when it should and shouldn't work. In the kind of weather we are having currently it is common for it not to work as the engine has to continue powering the aircon. There will be a whole list of reasons why it doesn't cut in (such as having to charge the battery as stated above) and you cannot expect it to work/not work in an identical way on every trip

    Again it would be worth checking what the manual says about the hill start assist. On cars I have had with this feature is has not worked on gentle gradients where the car can still roll. The manual may state that the function is limited to certain gradients?

    Sounds like there is no fault but you need to understand how the 2 things work. It hasn't helped that the previous owner seems to have been clueless about how the car worked
    Originally posted by verityboo
    I don't use the aircon, I open the windows... The manual is less than useless as it says it 'should' work all the time, but there are circumstances when it won't, but then fails to state what those circumstances are!

    I checked with Peugeot customer care on the hill start, it should work on anything over 3% and it can not be switch off. I've been on hills that are 7% and more. Take your foot off the brake, it starts to roll back 9 out of 10 times. . .
    • NotRichAtAll
    • By NotRichAtAll 9th Jul 18, 5:24 PM
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    NotRichAtAll
    • #8
    • 9th Jul 18, 5:24 PM
    • #8
    • 9th Jul 18, 5:24 PM
    It has Eco start/stop to switch the engine off when waiting at lights etc. This hardly ever works
    this will be down to the charge in the battery, the car has to meet certain parameters for this to work, my insignia suffered the same. if your car is 5yrs old and thats the original battery on it then that is your problem. stop/start batterys can cost a couple of hundred mine was £175 at mates rates.

    Hill assist i guess you have an electronic handbrake, the handbrake will release if the revs are (1200rpm on my insignia) its just balance with your feet on the cluch and accelerator.

    the other thing is french electrics are not the best
    • deanos
    • By deanos 9th Jul 18, 5:28 PM
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    deanos
    • #9
    • 9th Jul 18, 5:28 PM
    • #9
    • 9th Jul 18, 5:28 PM
    i have a sportage , had it for 2 years and the stop start has only kicked in about 10 times, it has hill start too and only works on a very steep gradient, my old insignia was more aggressive on hill start and seems to work on the slightest of gradient

    does the hill start work then not in the same place ?
    Last edited by deanos; 09-07-2018 at 5:31 PM.
    • Jon 01
    • By Jon 01 9th Jul 18, 5:58 PM
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    • 1,653 Thanks
    Jon 01
    i have a sportage , had it for 2 years and the stop start has only kicked in about 10 times, it has hill start too and only works on a very steep gradient, my old insignia was more aggressive on hill start and seems to work on the slightest of gradient

    does the hill start work then not in the same place ?
    Originally posted by deanos
    Sometimes it works sometimes is doesn't. The location isn't a factor.
    I've been driving autos for about 20 years and I've never found one that doesn't hold on a hill, even my old 206 some 15 years hold would hold rock steady on any hill. Surly any auto should work like that?
    • deanos
    • By deanos 9th Jul 18, 6:05 PM
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    deanos
    Im in Lincolnshire so not used to hills around here

    When i had my Insignia it would always work in the same places , so if yours does work some times and not other times in same place then indeed it sounds faulty
    • verityboo
    • By verityboo 9th Jul 18, 6:38 PM
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    verityboo
    Sometimes it works sometimes is doesn't. The location isn't a factor.
    I've been driving autos for about 20 years and I've never found one that doesn't hold on a hill, even my old 206 some 15 years hold would hold rock steady on any hill. Surly any auto should work like that?
    Originally posted by Jon 01
    Hill hold assist is where you have an electronic hand brake which hold the car for a couple of seconds when you pull away. You are now saying the auto gearbox doesn’t hold the car. It looks like Peugeot 208 models of that age had the EGC automatic gearbox which basically a robotised manual gearbox with a clutch. They do not hold the car on gradient as it would mean slipping the clutch.

    It sounds like you have driven auto cars with more traditional torque converter gearboxes which will hold on a gradient. You will need to use a different technique to drive the 208
    • Greta Sharbo
    • By Greta Sharbo 9th Jul 18, 9:13 PM
    • 207 Posts
    • 214 Thanks
    Greta Sharbo
    So as long as a dealer can avoid the issue they push it out of warranty and then charge for a fix?

    The fix in this case; new gearbox £4500, diags £150, reloading the ECU's £150

    So rather than them doing under warranty and it costing them, I now have to pay. Great scam for the dealer...
    Originally posted by Jon 01
    That's not what was said.

    You still have your consumer rights. The warranty expiring (or being unavailable for any other reason) does not remove those.
    • Jon 01
    • By Jon 01 10th Jul 18, 11:10 AM
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    Jon 01
    Hill hold assist is where you have an electronic hand brake which hold the car for a couple of seconds when you pull away. You are now saying the auto gearbox doesn’t hold the car. It looks like Peugeot 208 models of that age had the EGC automatic gearbox which basically a robotised manual gearbox with a clutch. They do not hold the car on gradient as it would mean slipping the clutch.

    It sounds like you have driven auto cars with more traditional torque converter gearboxes which will hold on a gradient. You will need to use a different technique to drive the 208
    Originally posted by verityboo
    The manual and customer care says it should hold on any gradient of 3% or more?? And sometimes it will, most of the time it won't?
    • Jon 01
    • By Jon 01 10th Jul 18, 11:16 AM
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    Jon 01
    That's not what was said.

    You still have your consumer rights. The warranty expiring (or being unavailable for any other reason) does not remove those.
    Originally posted by Greta Sharbo
    I appreciate that isn't what you said. The fact that the dealer was unable or unwilling to fix the issue is the problem. I agree if the original owner had been more proactive this wouldn't be a problem down the line.
    But the fact is that the dealer choice/or was not able to preform a proper fix and that the warranty has expired Peugeot expect to make a lot of money fixing it. As the fault was there 9 months from new it was there during the warranty period and therefore should be properly fixed under that warranty?
    • verityboo
    • By verityboo 10th Jul 18, 11:38 AM
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    verityboo
    The manual and customer care says it should hold on any gradient of 3% or more?? And sometimes it will, most of the time it won't?
    Originally posted by Jon 01
    So the problem is that the rear brakes do not hold for up to 2 seconds on a slope (which is the hill hold assist). The auto gearbox will not hold on a slope. Have you checked on a VIN check site the spec of the car and whether is definitely had the feature fitted? Perhaps the brakes are a bit sticky and have held the car a couple of times and need a service?

    Have you tried asking about the issue on a Peugeot forum as such places usually have a wealth of knowledge and could probably advise if it is a common problem
    • Jon 01
    • By Jon 01 11th Jul 18, 11:08 AM
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    Jon 01
    So the problem is that the rear brakes do not hold for up to 2 seconds on a slope (which is the hill hold assist). The auto gearbox will not hold on a slope. Have you checked on a VIN check site the spec of the car and whether is definitely had the feature fitted? Perhaps the brakes are a bit sticky and have held the car a couple of times and need a service?

    Have you tried asking about the issue on a Peugeot forum as such places usually have a wealth of knowledge and could probably advise if it is a common problem
    Originally posted by verityboo
    I've spoken with an advisor at Peugeot customer care who has spoken with the brand manager for 208's. He states that all of the auto models in the range have the feature and it can not be switched off. They are not ware of any issues effecting the range (they say) and that it's a fault.

    I've checked with a local garage that specialize in fixing auto and replacing their gearboxes. They say it's needs a new box, but that they've given up even trying to fix Peugeots and even the main dealer they use can't fix some of the problems.
    • verityboo
    • By verityboo 11th Jul 18, 11:38 AM
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    verityboo
    What is the problem with the gearbox? The auto gearbox will not hold on a slope as its an automated manual
    • Jon 01
    • By Jon 01 11th Jul 18, 12:42 PM
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    Jon 01
    What is the problem with the gearbox? The auto gearbox will not hold on a slope as its an automated manual
    Originally posted by verityboo
    OK, then I'm totally confused?

    I'm only going on what the manual and CS say.
    Pdf of manual here, take a look at page 130; https://www.autoeurope.com/peugeot-fleet/documents/208.pdf

    It says it should hold for around 2 seconds, long enough to move your foot from brake to acc. But it won't. The moment you take your foot off the brake it rolls back.

    CS says it's a fault as do the local garage. Who also say the only fix is a new box???
    • verityboo
    • By verityboo 11th Jul 18, 1:20 PM
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    verityboo
    OK, then I'm totally confused?

    I'm only going on what the manual and CS say.
    Pdf of manual here, take a look at page 130; https://www.autoeurope.com/peugeot-fleet/documents/208.pdf

    It says it should hold for around 2 seconds, long enough to move your foot from brake to acc. But it won't. The moment you take your foot off the brake it rolls back.

    CS says it's a fault as do the local garage. Who also say the only fix is a new box???
    Originally posted by Jon 01
    That system on page 130 you have linked to is a feature where the brakes hold the car for up to a couple of seconds so you don't roll when pulling away.

    It makes sense if it is fitted to automatic versions of the 208 as standard because the automated manual gearbox will not allow the clutch to remain partially engaged to hold the car. (It will not hold the car or allow it to creep like a traditional torque converter auto gearbox). It also seems to be increasingly common on manual cars these days

    As it is the brakes which are not holding the car I think the garage needs to give you a very good explanation as to why the are saying you need a new gearbox?
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