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  • FIRST POST
    • Cuilean
    • By Cuilean 8th Jul 18, 7:25 PM
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    Cuilean
    Tenant damaged house with satellite TV installation
    • #1
    • 8th Jul 18, 7:25 PM
    Tenant damaged house with satellite TV installation 8th Jul 18 at 7:25 PM
    As an unintentional landlord (I've inherited a property and its tenant from my late grandfather), I'm not sure how to proceed with this.

    Our tenant moved out at the end of her tenancy. We provided her with a working satellite dish and faceplate to plug in to. The rental agreement says she's not to install an aerial, satellite dish or cable equipment. A separate clause says she's not to make changes or alterations to the property without consent, and that she'll be liable to pay costs for removal or damage repair, regardless of whether she got our permission to do an installation or not.

    Without telling us, our tenant (Or someone she hired) took down our existing satellite dish, put up a new one, and after running cable across the back of the house, drilled a wobbly inch square hole from the exterior to the interior, on the other side of the living room. The hole has not been sealed externally. Internally, we have a matching inch square hole about a metre up the wall with two metres of cable dangling from it, and a chunk of missing wallpaper.

    She was specifically told at the start of the tenancy she was not to drill holes in the walls, simply because they have an internal concrete render which is a nightmare to drill into (I think she has discovered this, given the size of the hole )

    The letting agent did a checkout inspection and said he was happy with what he saw, but I disagree. She's damaged walls internally and externally, and since the wall was papered, it's not a simple case of polyfilla and paint.

    The daft thing is, if she'd asked if she could move the satellite point, I'd have said yes, on the proviso that it was done by a professional, and with a faceplate, not a trailing cable!

    My ideal solution is for the wall gap to be repaired professionally, and the trailing cable to be replaced with a faceplate to hide the torn wallpaper. It's probably easier than removing everything and reinstating things as they were, since the original satellite cables have been cut and left dangling from the bracket. The whole installation needs tidying up, and I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for her to pay for it. Could someone with landlord experience advise?
    Cuilean 2005. Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental.
Page 1
    • unforeseen
    • By unforeseen 8th Jul 18, 7:29 PM
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    unforeseen
    • #2
    • 8th Jul 18, 7:29 PM
    • #2
    • 8th Jul 18, 7:29 PM
    But you weren't the LL when it was probably done so have no comeback on the tenant.

    You inherited the property in the state it was in at that time. That is your baseline to work from.
    • Cuilean
    • By Cuilean 8th Jul 18, 7:42 PM
    • 676 Posts
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    Cuilean
    • #3
    • 8th Jul 18, 7:42 PM
    • #3
    • 8th Jul 18, 7:42 PM
    But you weren't the LL when it was probably done so have no comeback on the tenant.

    You inherited the property in the state it was in at that time. That is your baseline to work from.
    Originally posted by unforeseen
    My sister and I are named on the agreement as landlords, even though my grandfather owned the property. We took over my grandfather's affairs with a power of attorney when he developed dementia, and let the agent know. The tenant moved in not long after we were awarded PoA, so I guess the agent took the opportunity to re-word the contract with our names.

    Naively, we never asked to see the contract, and only received a copy of it last week when the solicitor handling the estate demanded it. We'd left the agent to deal with things. If I could kick myself any harder over this, I'd need hospitalisation
    Cuilean 2005. Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental.
    • Gwendo40
    • By Gwendo40 8th Jul 18, 7:44 PM
    • 159 Posts
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    Gwendo40
    • #4
    • 8th Jul 18, 7:44 PM
    • #4
    • 8th Jul 18, 7:44 PM
    Sometimes I think the website should be renamed Money Grasping Expert.

    I think if I'd been fortunate enough to inherit a property I'd be willing to let such a trivial issue go but perhaps that just me.
    • Cuilean
    • By Cuilean 8th Jul 18, 7:54 PM
    • 676 Posts
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    Cuilean
    • #5
    • 8th Jul 18, 7:54 PM
    • #5
    • 8th Jul 18, 7:54 PM
    Sometimes I think the website should be renamed Money Grasping Expert.

    I think if I'd been fortunate enough to inherit a property I'd be willing to let such a trivial issue go but perhaps that just me.
    Originally posted by Gwendo40
    Thank you, your opinion is very helpful.

    It's not the financial aspect of things. It's the moral aspect of it. I wouldn't rent a property and go drilling holes in it without expecting there to be some sort of comeback. But perhaps that's just me.
    Cuilean 2005. Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental.
    • Pixie5740
    • By Pixie5740 8th Jul 18, 8:01 PM
    • 12,907 Posts
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    Pixie5740
    • #6
    • 8th Jul 18, 8:01 PM
    • #6
    • 8th Jul 18, 8:01 PM
    I once let a Sky "engineer" drill holes in the wall of a flat I was renting because my landlord was a knob and I knew she hadn't protected my deposit. Bad Pixie.

    I digress...

    Has the tenant's deposit been returned to her? If not have you asked her to repair the damage or for the money to be deducted from the deposit? I'm not sure that you have a cast iron case but the scheme's adjudicator might side with you.
    • Pixie5740
    • By Pixie5740 8th Jul 18, 8:02 PM
    • 12,907 Posts
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    Pixie5740
    • #7
    • 8th Jul 18, 8:02 PM
    • #7
    • 8th Jul 18, 8:02 PM
    I am slightly confused about how you know she was explicitly told not drill holes in the wall if you left everything to the agent. Who uttered these words to the tenant?
    • Cuilean
    • By Cuilean 8th Jul 18, 8:20 PM
    • 676 Posts
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    Cuilean
    • #8
    • 8th Jul 18, 8:20 PM
    • #8
    • 8th Jul 18, 8:20 PM
    I once let a Sky "engineer" drill holes in the wall of a flat I was renting because my landlord was a knob and I knew she hadn't protected my deposit. Bad Pixie.

    I digress...

    Has the tenant's deposit been returned to her? If not have you asked her to repair the damage or for the money to be deducted from the deposit? I'm not sure that you have a cast iron case but the scheme's adjudicator might side with you.
    Originally posted by Pixie5740
    Thank you, that gave me a laugh. I hope the tenant doesn't think I'm a knob. She made a lot of requests, and I said yes to all of them, apart from the TV bracket one.

    You make an interesting point about whether the tenant was told not to drill holes. She emailed the agent to ask about wall mounting TVs, who forwarded her email to me (Minus her contact details). I replied to the agent via email, but then followed up with a phone call to him, where the agent told me he'd explained this to the tenant, and she was disappointed because she really wanted to wall mount all her TVs, but accepted my reasons. This indicated to me that she had been told by the agent, but I see now where you're coming from. Do I trust the agent to have actually told her?

    My plan for Monday was indeed to ring the aforementioned agent and ask for deductions from the deposit money. However, as a relative noob to this game, I wasn't sure how to get the ball rolling. Hence the "Help me, MSE, you're my only hope" post
    Cuilean 2005. Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental.
    • tacpot12
    • By tacpot12 8th Jul 18, 8:40 PM
    • 1,367 Posts
    • 1,177 Thanks
    tacpot12
    • #9
    • 8th Jul 18, 8:40 PM
    • #9
    • 8th Jul 18, 8:40 PM
    I think it is reasonable to ask for the cost of the repairs to be deducted from the deposit. The tenancy agreement was very clear on the point. This is not a case where fair wear and tear is applicable. .
    • diggingdude
    • By diggingdude 8th Jul 18, 9:40 PM
    • 385 Posts
    • 491 Thanks
    diggingdude
    sounds a fair deduction to me, if nothing else the hole in the wall inside etc needs fixing which costs and she needs to pay
    House Deposit - Target 20000 April 2019
    Current Savings - 10225 13121.22 14621.22 16021 17296
    • pinkshoes
    • By pinkshoes 8th Jul 18, 10:04 PM
    • 15,972 Posts
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    pinkshoes
    Was the deposit protected?

    If yes, get a quote to have it fixed and deduct from deposit.
    Should've = Should HAVE (not 'of')
    Would've = Would HAVE (not 'of')

    No, I am not perfect, but yes I do judge people on their use of basic English language. If you didn't know the above, then learn it! (If English is your second language, then you are forgiven!)
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 8th Jul 18, 10:19 PM
    • 18,358 Posts
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    AdrianC
    Was the deposit protected?

    If yes, get a quote to have it fixed and deduct from deposit.
    Originally posted by pinkshoes
    I hope there's photographic check-in and -out records for when the ex-tenant inevitably takes it to arbitration.

    Reluctantly, OP, I think you're going to have to take this one on the chin.


    The main question has to be why, if there was already a dish installed and wired, the tenant removed it and fitted another so badly. If there was a problem with the existing dish, why not simply raise it with the landlord/agent? And why, if replacing the dish, would the wiring need to be replaced...?
    • takman
    • By takman 8th Jul 18, 10:46 PM
    • 3,647 Posts
    • 3,276 Thanks
    takman
    As an unintentional landlord (I've inherited a property and its tenant from my late grandfather), I'm not sure how to proceed with this.
    Originally posted by Cuilean
    A bit off topic but your not really an unintentional landlord when the tenant moved in after you were given POA and your even named on the documents!.

    If you didn't want to be a landlord you could have stopped the tenant from moving in.

    My sister and I are named on the agreement as landlords, even though my grandfather owned the property. We took over my grandfather's affairs with a power of attorney when he developed dementia, and let the agent know. The tenant moved in not long after we were awarded PoA, so I guess the agent took the opportunity to re-word the contract with our names.
    Originally posted by Cuilean
    • wesleyad
    • By wesleyad 9th Jul 18, 12:28 AM
    • 286 Posts
    • 245 Thanks
    wesleyad
    The main question has to be why, if there was already a dish installed and wired, the tenant removed it and fitted another so badly. If there was a problem with the existing dish, why not simply raise it with the landlord/agent? And why, if replacing the dish, would the wiring need to be replaced...?
    Originally posted by AdrianC
    Wouldn't surprise me if they took down the SKY dish and put up a larger generic one to get certain overseas channels for free
    • deannatrois
    • By deannatrois 9th Jul 18, 12:57 AM
    • 5,612 Posts
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    deannatrois
    Did the agent establish that the previous dish was in place when this tenant started her tenancy? I wonder if a previous tenant removed it and the last tenant had to put a new one in. Its what happened to me (as the incoming tenant). Just bare wires left instead of a dish. I had to get Sky to completely reinstall. This had happened before also.

    The fact that an internal concrete render was in place is actually not the tenants fault. You might have problems establishing that the tenant had no right to reinstall a satellite connection if it was removed by a previous tenant.

    To be honest, one would have thought the place might need redecorating anyway by now. You are getting an income for a house you didn't pay for, whatever the 'ethics' of the situation. It might be less hassle to just have the room repaired and painted as a fresh start now you are getting an income from it. To be honest, while restricting putting holes in walls does appear sometimes in tenancy agreements, I suspect you are not going to keep tenants for long as it will feel like they are living in a shabby hotel with little ability to make it feel like their home. Leaving wallpaper in place rather than a painted easy to repair covering was your choice. I know when I lived in a private rental it was a bind to not be able to paint my son's room in colours of his choice. It just never felt like my home. His face when I was finally able to give him a room he wanted!

    You might need to take a step back and view the rental as a business with repainting needed every few years and be practical, or sell it and pocket the money.

    I did put a tv on a wall, and did repair it before I left, it wasn't a big job. Again, not the tenants fault you have this concrete render.
    Last edited by deannatrois; 09-07-2018 at 1:07 AM.
    • unforeseen
    • By unforeseen 9th Jul 18, 5:37 AM
    • 2,957 Posts
    • 3,817 Thanks
    unforeseen
    My sister and I are named on the agreement as landlords, even though my grandfather owned the property. We took over my grandfather's affairs with a power of attorney when he developed dementia, and let the agent know. The tenant moved in not long after we were awarded PoA, so I guess the agent took the opportunity to re-word the contract with our names.

    Naively, we never asked to see the contract, and only received a copy of it last week when the solicitor handling the estate demanded it. We'd left the agent to deal with things. If I could kick myself any harder over this, I'd need hospitalisation
    Originally posted by Cuilean
    You were not the landlord UNTIL your grandfather died and you inherited. Up to that point you were an agent of your grandfather albeit with more powers than an agent would normally have. Your grandfather was still the landlord and the agent should not have named you as the landlord unless it was made clear that you were the landlords attorney. It may bring into question whether the contract and its conditions were valid or not.
    • Pixie5740
    • By Pixie5740 9th Jul 18, 6:47 AM
    • 12,907 Posts
    • 18,555 Thanks
    Pixie5740
    Thank you, that gave me a laugh. I hope the tenant doesn't think I'm a knob. She made a lot of requests, and I said yes to all of them, apart from the TV bracket one.
    Originally posted by Cuilean
    You'd have to go some way to be as big a knob as this landlord.

    https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=4815888

    You make an interesting point about whether the tenant was told not to drill holes. She emailed the agent to ask about wall mounting TVs, who forwarded her email to me (Minus her contact details). I replied to the agent via email, but then followed up with a phone call to him, where the agent told me he'd explained this to the tenant, and she was disappointed because she really wanted to wall mount all her TVs, but accepted my reasons. This indicated to me that she had been told by the agent, but I see now where you're coming from. Do I trust the agent to have actually told her?

    My plan for Monday was indeed to ring the aforementioned agent and ask for deductions from the deposit money. However, as a relative noob to this game, I wasn't sure how to get the ball rolling. Hence the "Help me, MSE, you're my only hope" post
    Originally posted by Cuilean
    You might find G_M's Guide to Deposits: Payment, protection and return useful.
    • FBaby
    • By FBaby 9th Jul 18, 7:02 AM
    • 16,939 Posts
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    FBaby
    Definitely something you can claim back from the deposit and likely to get back, but before you go down that route, make sure the process to protect the deposit was done properly or it will massively backfire.
    • rosie383
    • By rosie383 9th Jul 18, 7:38 AM
    • 4,684 Posts
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    rosie383
    Hands up who else has just spent an enjoyable half hour reading Pixie's thread about her ex-landlady???

    Pixie you're a quare geg (as we'd say in Norn Iron).
    Father Ted: Now concentrate this time, Dougal. These
    (he points to some plastic cows on the table) are very small; those (pointing at some cows out of the window) are far away...
    • ariba10
    • By ariba10 9th Jul 18, 8:28 AM
    • 5,203 Posts
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    ariba10
    I am still trying to work out how they managed to drill a square hole.
    I used to be indecisive but now I am not sure.
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