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  • FIRST POST
    • Collectorfox
    • By Collectorfox 17th May 18, 10:27 AM
    • 2Posts
    • 0Thanks
    Collectorfox
    Can investment bank claw back Dividend they paid to me in error?
    • #1
    • 17th May 18, 10:27 AM
    Can investment bank claw back Dividend they paid to me in error? 17th May 18 at 10:27 AM
    Back in March HSBC Direct Invest allowed the payment of a dividend into my account. It was for shares I own in a company on the AIM market where it was ex dividend but the company announced right at the last moment that it was not going to pay it. However it was paid in to my account and there it has stayed since.

    However today I got a letter from HBSC saying that 'We are sorry to advise that due to the late market notification, this event was cancelled by the company in the market, meaning that you were not entitled to the dividend'. It goes on to state that they will be clawing the money back at the end of this month.

    Can they do that?
Page 1
    • doubletop40
    • By doubletop40 17th May 18, 10:56 AM
    • 277 Posts
    • 769 Thanks
    doubletop40
    • #2
    • 17th May 18, 10:56 AM
    • #2
    • 17th May 18, 10:56 AM
    Yes. Its not your money.


    You could argue, but you will lose.
    • AimHigh
    • By AimHigh 17th May 18, 10:58 AM
    • 130 Posts
    • 49 Thanks
    AimHigh
    • #3
    • 17th May 18, 10:58 AM
    • #3
    • 17th May 18, 10:58 AM
    Why would you want to keep it?

    If you paid money into the wrong person's account by accident then you'd certainly expect it back?
    • george4064
    • By george4064 17th May 18, 11:13 AM
    • 1,019 Posts
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    george4064
    • #4
    • 17th May 18, 11:13 AM
    • #4
    • 17th May 18, 11:13 AM
    As others have said, just give it back. You!!!8217;ll never win if you fight.
    "If you arenít willing to own a stock for ten years, donít even think about owning it for ten minutesĒ Warren Buffett

    Save £12k in 2016 - #045 £10,358.81/£12,000 (86%)
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    • AnotherJoe
    • By AnotherJoe 17th May 18, 11:21 AM
    • 10,556 Posts
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    AnotherJoe
    • #5
    • 17th May 18, 11:21 AM
    • #5
    • 17th May 18, 11:21 AM
    As long as you agree that for all future cases where you accidentally pay someone money, they can keep it, then I don't see an issue with you keeping this dividend.
    • Collectorfox
    • By Collectorfox 17th May 18, 11:32 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Collectorfox
    • #6
    • 17th May 18, 11:32 AM
    • #6
    • 17th May 18, 11:32 AM
    Gosh you guys are harsh! But yes the money has stayed in the account as I figured the error would come to light one day. Just curious with regard to time passed etc but thanks for your comments.
    • le loup
    • By le loup 17th May 18, 12:41 PM
    • 3,852 Posts
    • 3,836 Thanks
    le loup
    • #7
    • 17th May 18, 12:41 PM
    • #7
    • 17th May 18, 12:41 PM
    Theft, i.e. keeping money that does not belong to you is also a bit harsh.
    • adonis10
    • By adonis10 17th May 18, 12:48 PM
    • 1,576 Posts
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    adonis10
    • #8
    • 17th May 18, 12:48 PM
    • #8
    • 17th May 18, 12:48 PM
    Theft, i.e. keeping money that does not belong to you is also a bit harsh.
    Originally posted by le loup
    Is it theft given that the OP did not initiate the transfer?
    • Malthusian
    • By Malthusian 17th May 18, 12:58 PM
    • 4,639 Posts
    • 7,415 Thanks
    Malthusian
    • #9
    • 17th May 18, 12:58 PM
    • #9
    • 17th May 18, 12:58 PM
    Is it theft given that the OP did not initiate the transfer?
    Originally posted by adonis10

    No, but it would be theft by finding if he kept it.
    • Paul_DNAP
    • By Paul_DNAP 17th May 18, 1:52 PM
    • 256 Posts
    • 324 Thanks
    Paul_DNAP
    Of course, if it was a sum of money you don't have instant access to then they would have to listen to a reasonable offer of how you can pay it back to replace their preferred immediate reversal, but best to get things squared up as soon as possible if you can.
    I wonder, hypothetically speaking, if you'd put it away in a five year fixed bond and you had to pay a penalty to get it back then they'd offer (or could you force them) to pay the penalty for you?
    (Although I could be wrong, I often am.)
    • Malthusian
    • By Malthusian 17th May 18, 2:58 PM
    • 4,639 Posts
    • 7,415 Thanks
    Malthusian
    I wonder, hypothetically speaking, if you'd put it away in a five year fixed bond and you had to pay a penalty to get it back then they'd offer (or could you force them) to pay the penalty for you?
    Originally posted by Paul_DNAP
    Given this is a dividend from an AIM company, which suggests a) low yield b) the OP will have a relatively small proportion of his assets invested in it (hopefully), the dividend is unlikely to be a huge sum of money for the OP, and it would take some extremely crass mismanagement for them to be unable to lay their hands on enough cash to repay it without paying a penalty. It wouldn't be HSBC's problem.

    The simplest solution for HSBC in that scenario would simply be to record their cash balance as negative and wait for further dividends to come in or for the OP to make a withdrawal, at which point the money would be recovered. HSBC may have a clause in the T&Cs which says that if the cash balance is negative, they can sell down the OP's assets without permission to correct it. If not, they just have to wait.

    If the OP withdrew all their money off the platform (including the dividend) in the hope that HSBC wouldn't be able to recover the mistaken payment, that would be blatant theft by finding.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 17th May 18, 3:05 PM
    • 94,465 Posts
    • 62,401 Thanks
    dunstonh
    If you refuse to repay and keep money that you know is yours then it could lead to you being charged with retaining wrongful credit' under the Theft Act 1968.

    So, its not harsh to mention it.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • IanManc
    • By IanManc 17th May 18, 5:15 PM
    • 647 Posts
    • 1,148 Thanks
    IanManc
    Given this is a dividend from an AIM company, which suggests a) low yield b) the OP will have a relatively small proportion of his assets invested in it (hopefully), the dividend is unlikely to be a huge sum of money for the OP, and it would take some extremely crass mismanagement for them to be unable to lay their hands on enough cash to repay it without paying a penalty. It wouldn't be HSBC's problem.

    The simplest solution for HSBC in that scenario would simply be to record their cash balance as negative and wait for further dividends to come in or for the OP to make a withdrawal, at which point the money would be recovered. HSBC may have a clause in the T&Cs which says that if the cash balance is negative, they can sell down the OP's assets without permission to correct it. If not, they just have to wait.

    If the OP withdrew all their money off the platform (including the dividend) in the hope that HSBC wouldn't be able to recover the mistaken payment, that would be blatant theft by finding.
    Originally posted by Malthusian
    No, but it would be theft by finding if he kept it.
    Originally posted by Malthusian
    It wouldn't be theft by finding, blatant or otherwise.
    • John-K
    • By John-K 17th May 18, 6:15 PM
    • 654 Posts
    • 1,020 Thanks
    John-K
    It wouldn't be theft by finding, blatant or otherwise.
    Originally posted by IanManc
    It would certainly be theft though.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/6966683.stm
    • IanManc
    • By IanManc 17th May 18, 6:24 PM
    • 647 Posts
    • 1,148 Thanks
    IanManc
    It would certainly be theft though.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/6966683.stm
    Originally posted by John-K
    Yes, it would be retaining wrongful credit, as Dunstonh noted in Post 12, which I thanked.
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