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  • FIRST POST
    • Mike53
    • By Mike53 15th May 18, 11:00 PM
    • 7Posts
    • 3Thanks
    Mike53
    Parking charge for parking across line
    • #1
    • 15th May 18, 11:00 PM
    Parking charge for parking across line 15th May 18 at 11:00 PM
    I am disabled with a blue disabled badge. All disabled spaces outside the shop I was visiting were occupied so I parked across 2 normal spaces to ensure I had room to get back in my car without being constrained by another car. I displayed my blue badge. I was not aware that this was an offence liable for a fine, so did not think to read the notices in the car park. There were plenty of other spaces for others to park in.
    UKPC have rejected my appeal against the 60 charge. I now have 2 option, pay the 60 chage or appeal further to POPLA. However if my appeal fails the charge is increased to 100.
    I realise that technically I was in breach of their parking conditions, but are my disability reasons sufficient mitigation for the POPLA appeal to be successful? I do not want to end up having to pay 100.
    Can you help please?
    Last edited by Mike53; 15-05-2018 at 11:12 PM.
Page 1
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 16th May 18, 8:32 AM
    • 3,944 Posts
    • 4,740 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    • #2
    • 16th May 18, 8:32 AM
    • #2
    • 16th May 18, 8:32 AM
    1) It isnt an offence
    2) It isnt a fine, just an invoice

    POPLA do not do mitigation. However you can state that this was a reasonable adjustment, the operator was well aware of the need for an adjustment, and so in law there was no cause to issue a PCN.

    See what others think.
    • Half_way
    • By Half_way 16th May 18, 8:43 AM
    • 4,344 Posts
    • 6,154 Thanks
    Half_way
    • #3
    • 16th May 18, 8:43 AM
    • #3
    • 16th May 18, 8:43 AM
    who's car park was it?
    From the Plain Language Commission:

    "The BPA has surely become one of the most socially dangerous organisations in the UK"
    • Mike53
    • By Mike53 16th May 18, 9:02 AM
    • 7 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Mike53
    • #4
    • 16th May 18, 9:02 AM
    • #4
    • 16th May 18, 9:02 AM
    This is an out of town retail park car park. The ticket was issued by UKPC so I assume it is owned or run by them.
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 16th May 18, 9:28 AM
    • 3,944 Posts
    • 4,740 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    • #5
    • 16th May 18, 9:28 AM
    • #5
    • 16th May 18, 9:28 AM
    Youd be wrong, then. The newbies thread even says it is highly unusual for the PPC to have any interest in the land at all.
    Have you complained to the shops? Not one, lots...
    • Castle
    • By Castle 16th May 18, 11:22 AM
    • 2,010 Posts
    • 2,714 Thanks
    Castle
    • #6
    • 16th May 18, 11:22 AM
    • #6
    • 16th May 18, 11:22 AM
    This is an out of town retail park car park. The ticket was issued by UKPC so I assume it is owned or run by them.
    Originally posted by Mike53
    Was the ticket left on the car and/or sent through the post?
    • Mike53
    • By Mike53 16th May 18, 12:52 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Mike53
    • #7
    • 16th May 18, 12:52 PM
    • #7
    • 16th May 18, 12:52 PM
    The ticket was left on the car. I have had nothing in the post, but received a response to my appeal by email.
    We complained in the Range, the shop we parked outside. The manager advised that the car park was nothing to do with them, but was aware that recently more people have received parking tickets there.
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 16th May 18, 2:26 PM
    • 10,684 Posts
    • 11,066 Thanks
    KeithP
    • #8
    • 16th May 18, 2:26 PM
    • #8
    • 16th May 18, 2:26 PM
    What was the date of the parking incident?

    UKPC no longer have access to DVLA keeper data so they are unable to transfer liability from the driver to the keeper.

    Hopefully your initial appeal was as the keeper and gave no clues to the driver's identity. (In an ideal world you would not have appealed at all and UKPC would have no way of getting in touch with you).

    If they don't know the driver, then your PoPLA appeal should major on 'the NtD/NtK is not PoFA compliant therefore the keeper is not liable'.
    .
    • Ralph-y
    • By Ralph-y 16th May 18, 2:27 PM
    • 2,862 Posts
    • 3,592 Thanks
    Ralph-y
    • #9
    • 16th May 18, 2:27 PM
    • #9
    • 16th May 18, 2:27 PM
    did you tell them who you are in the appeal ?

    is so exactly what did you say ?

    Ralph
    • Mike53
    • By Mike53 16th May 18, 3:01 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Mike53
    This happened on 1st May. In the appeal I gave my name and email address. I told them more or less what I wrote above. I parked the way I did as I am disabled and need space to get in/out of the car. The designated disabled spaces were occupied.
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 16th May 18, 3:12 PM
    • 10,684 Posts
    • 11,066 Thanks
    KeithP
    So you have told them who was driving. That's a shame.
    But they don't have a postal address for the driver - that might help.

    Go to post #3 of the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread and compile a PoPLA appeal using all the point that you can.
    Post your draft PoPLA appeal here when you are ready.
    .
    • Mike53
    • By Mike53 16th May 18, 5:12 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Mike53
    My POPLA appeal would be as follows:-

    I am appealing against this parking charge as I only parked as I did due to my disability. I have a bad back and require space to get in/out of my car. I would normally park in a designated disabled space which is wider than the normal spaces. Unfortunately on this occasion all the disabled spaces in front of the shop I was visiting were occupied, so I parked across 2 spaces to ensure there was sufficient space for me to get back in. I displayed my Blue Badge. I did not realise that this would be an issue and incur a parking charge. There were many empty spaces so I was not preventing anyone else parking. On returning 30 minutes later this parking ticket was on my windscreen. I noticed there were others cars in the car park who had also parked across the lines but these did not have a ticket. It appears I was singled out for some reason. I also noticed the parking attendant watching from a distance and laughing at my distress. The parking attendant and UKPC, who dismissed my appeal overnight, seem to have no regard for the difficulties experienced by the disabled.
    I hope you can uphold my appeal due to my extenuating circumstances.
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 16th May 18, 5:18 PM
    • 10,684 Posts
    • 11,066 Thanks
    KeithP
    Mike, have you looked at any PoPLA appeals?

    With respect, your proposal is not going to work.

    As you were told earlier today "PoPLA do not do mitigation".
    They are not interested in your excuses. Sounds harsh I know, but there is no profit in listening to sob stories.

    Please now do what I suggested earlier... Read post #3 of the NEWBIES FAQ thread. There are several sample points you can use , like poor signage, no landholder authority, etc. Read that post and the stuff linked from it.
    Last edited by KeithP; 16-05-2018 at 5:43 PM. Reason: spelling
    .
    • Mike53
    • By Mike53 16th May 18, 5:28 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Mike53
    Ok thanks. I am new to this forum so how do I find the newbies faq thread?
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 16th May 18, 5:42 PM
    • 10,684 Posts
    • 11,066 Thanks
    KeithP
    Use your browser's 'back' button once to return to the thread index page - the page where you found the 'start new thread' button last night.

    The second thread on that list is entitled:
    **NEWBIES!! PRIVATE PARKING TICKET? OLD OR NEW? **READ THESE FAQS FIRST!** Thankyou!

    Go to the third post in that thread.
    .
    • Ralph-y
    • By Ralph-y 16th May 18, 7:23 PM
    • 2,862 Posts
    • 3,592 Thanks
    Ralph-y
    oh ... and ... if you are using a phone to browse .. then a PC/laptop will improve forum navigation ....

    Ralph
    • nigelbb
    • By nigelbb 16th May 18, 7:38 PM
    • 2,032 Posts
    • 2,827 Thanks
    nigelbb
    The DVLA have banned UKPC from purchasing keeper details so provided that you did not give them your address when you appealed then there is no way that they can chase you for this "fine". Even though you gave your name & email address that will not enable them to take you to court. Just ignore them & do not email them again.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 16th May 18, 8:09 PM
    • 63,938 Posts
    • 76,567 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Have you given them your postal address? Did you appeal online, and fill it in?

    This is VERY IMPORTANT.

    If not (and we hope not) DO NOT DO ANYTHING ELSE.

    You should NEVER have appealed, they couldn't get your data as they are banned:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/uk-parking-control-dvla-suspension-misuse-of-data-a8325941.html

    Luckily if they only have an email address, they are stuffed.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • Mike53
    • By Mike53 16th May 18, 9:10 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Mike53
    Unfortunately I gave my name and postal address as well as email address when filling out the appeal to UKPC. I only looked for advice from this forum after my initial appeal to UKPC failed.
    I have looked at the NEWBIES FAQ thread now. There are a number of possible grounds for appeal.
    1. As They have my name and address and I admitted I was the driver in my appeal do they still need to issue a PTK? Can I still use the PTK argument?
    2. I may be able to argue that the signs are inadequate. I will check at the site again tomorrow. There are quite a few signs but they are quite high and lettering small so may not be readable when parking.
    3. I will definitely request them to prove they have written consent from the landlord.
    4. Anything else I have missed?
    Thank you all for your help.
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 16th May 18, 9:18 PM
    • 10,684 Posts
    • 11,066 Thanks
    KeithP
    Any NtK is irrelevant now that they know the driver's name and address.

    You need to argue that the signs are inadequate.

    You need to argue that they have no landholder authority.

    At least.
    .
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