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    • Belgrave
    • By Belgrave 15th May 18, 7:32 PM
    • 6Posts
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    Belgrave
    Appealing a decision
    • #1
    • 15th May 18, 7:32 PM
    Appealing a decision 15th May 18 at 7:32 PM
    Hi all, anyone know the chances of having a decision overturned by Aldmore? They refused after DIP and valuation. I answered all their further questions before they authorised the valuation. Valuation was fine, then they dragged their heels for a few weeks, then said no. Am furious as they had all the info before the valuation and even clarified it before then too. Was told all along would only go to valuation if they were happy with everything to protect us from paying whopping valuation fee if not likely to make an offer.

    Have appealed as was clear they misunderstood my earning figures which are higher than they thought. Have also paid off chunk of credit card debt since the original application. (They knew all about the cc debt before valuation and knew debt consolidation was part of the reason for the mortgage. No defaults on anything).

    Anyone had experience of this?

    thanks.
    Last edited by Belgrave; 15-05-2018 at 7:47 PM.
Page 1
    • ACG
    • By ACG 15th May 18, 8:06 PM
    • 17,818 Posts
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    ACG
    • #2
    • 15th May 18, 8:06 PM
    • #2
    • 15th May 18, 8:06 PM
    Was it declined because of affordability?
    If so and you can show they have misunderstood then you should be fine.

    I have had cases overturned with them in the past.
    I am a Mortgage Adviser
    You should note that this site doesn't check my status as a mortgage adviser, so you need to take my word for it. This signature is here as I follow MSE's Mortgage Adviser Code of Conduct. Any posts on here are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as financial advice.
    • Belgrave
    • By Belgrave 15th May 18, 8:21 PM
    • 6 Posts
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    Belgrave
    • #3
    • 15th May 18, 8:21 PM
    • #3
    • 15th May 18, 8:21 PM
    Thanks ACG. They said it looked like I was living on credit as my earnings were so low and the credit cards were so high, however my company (am self employed) owes me a fairly big sum so I've been taking that bit by bit annually on top of the earnings, hence the low earned salary. The middle man I was dealing with at Aldemore said not to put that on the original application but on the appeal I've asked for the info to be given to the underwriter as it doubles my annual income and explains the low earnings. Also the company is in the slight negative on the balance sheet but only because it owes me from the historic loan and of course I'm not an unfriendly creditor, put the loan to me to one side and the balance sheet is well in the positive. Have explained that, as well as fact that credit cards haven't been used since I used them for one-off purchase to buy the car last year (all credit cards are currently on 0%) which I can prove with statements. I was obviously borderline for them to have gone to valuation so am hoping I've given them enough to persuade them.
    • ACG
    • By ACG 15th May 18, 8:26 PM
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    ACG
    • #4
    • 15th May 18, 8:26 PM
    • #4
    • 15th May 18, 8:26 PM
    So you are taking your wages via paye/dividends and from a directors loan account?

    As far as I am aware, Aldermore will not accept "income" from a directors loan account, even on appeal.
    I am a Mortgage Adviser
    You should note that this site doesn't check my status as a mortgage adviser, so you need to take my word for it. This signature is here as I follow MSE's Mortgage Adviser Code of Conduct. Any posts on here are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as financial advice.
    • Belgrave
    • By Belgrave 15th May 18, 8:35 PM
    • 6 Posts
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    Belgrave
    • #5
    • 15th May 18, 8:35 PM
    • #5
    • 15th May 18, 8:35 PM
    Thanks ACG, that's a concern, yes some is from the DLA. I also forgot to include 1600 per year child benefit which hopefully might help tip a balance if we're borderline. Along with fact I've reduced the cc debt by 25% this week. Not sounding hopeful though, on what you say...
    • ACG
    • By ACG 15th May 18, 9:02 PM
    • 17,818 Posts
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    ACG
    • #6
    • 15th May 18, 9:02 PM
    • #6
    • 15th May 18, 9:02 PM
    I think they may now accept CB, they never used to but I am sure that changed.

    The credit card balance, they can update so that should help.

    But the Directors loan account is not income. To think about it another way, if you lent me the money and I paid you back each month, would you include that as income?

    There are lenders who will potentially work off PAYE + Net profit, Aldermore may actually be one of them.

    I am being a little vague with Aldermore as it has been a while since I have used them. I used to use them almost weekly but other lenders have overtaken them in the adverse/self employed world now so they are only any good for adverse/self employed above 85% LTV.

    Do you have a broker? I would expect them to sort this out if there is a way.
    I am a Mortgage Adviser
    You should note that this site doesn't check my status as a mortgage adviser, so you need to take my word for it. This signature is here as I follow MSE's Mortgage Adviser Code of Conduct. Any posts on here are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as financial advice.
    • Belgrave
    • By Belgrave 15th May 18, 9:38 PM
    • 6 Posts
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    Belgrave
    • #7
    • 15th May 18, 9:38 PM
    • #7
    • 15th May 18, 9:38 PM
    Thanks ACG, that's super helpful. I'm not using a broker, it was a broker friend who recommended Aldemore so they've been guiding me doing it direct and were gobsmacked when we got the no after the DIP and valuation, particularly as we answered at least 8 questions from the underwriter before they authorised the valuation. No new info came to light after the valuation so the apparent u-turn was an unpleasant surprise (and it took three weeks from the valuation for them to give the decision).

    Are you able to say which other lenders deal with self-employed? My LTV is 33% and I'm doing this on a holiday let flat I own outright. Which btw makes their decision more baffling as it's a commercial buy to let mortgage so no minimum income requirement.

    Really appreciate the viewpoints.
    Last edited by Belgrave; 15-05-2018 at 9:45 PM.
    • ACG
    • By ACG 16th May 18, 9:17 AM
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    ACG
    • #8
    • 16th May 18, 9:17 AM
    • #8
    • 16th May 18, 9:17 AM
    Ah, sorry I assumed it was a residential.
    I agree, it does seem a little odd. The only thing I would say is if in their calculation, the rent does not hit 150% of the monthly repayment at whatever calculation they use they do then start to assess affordability.

    Aldermore used to be a cracking lender, then a few of the top brass left and it just seemed to go down hill.

    BTLs (more so holiday lets) are not really my bag. At 33% LTV I would expect there to be some lenders. Unfortunately I can not name lenders on a forum as I could be leading you to the wrong lender (believe it or not, that opens me up to a complaint from you) but also I genuinely do not know. This would be one of those where I Would have to pick up the phone to account managers and start from scratch.

    Speak to your friend or the underwriter to see if switching products would help to prevent the need for affordability calculations. Some times 5 year fixed rates or term variable products can help with the calculation.
    I am a Mortgage Adviser
    You should note that this site doesn't check my status as a mortgage adviser, so you need to take my word for it. This signature is here as I follow MSE's Mortgage Adviser Code of Conduct. Any posts on here are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as financial advice.
    • Belgrave
    • By Belgrave 16th May 18, 10:34 AM
    • 6 Posts
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    Belgrave
    • #9
    • 16th May 18, 10:34 AM
    • #9
    • 16th May 18, 10:34 AM
    Thanks again ACG. The rent more than meets their criteria, way over the 150% (as applied for interest only), and it's on a 5-year fixed. So I'm not sure why the u-turn, particularly as there was no new info to what they had prior to their initial quite detailed underwriting and instructing the valuation.

    Very frustrating. I'll see what they say in light of the DLA and CB figures I gave them, as you say they may not count them as income but given no minimum income requirement then it should at least demonstrate to them I'm not living on credit as they thought when just going on the low earned income figures alone.

    I really appreciate all you've advised, thank you. I'll let you know what they say!
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 16th May 18, 12:49 PM
    • 61,016 Posts
    • 54,213 Thanks
    Thrugelmir
    The rent more than meets their criteria, way over the 150% (as applied for interest only),
    Originally posted by Belgrave
    A holiday let is somewhat more subjective. As obviously not a fixed term tenancy with a guaranteed income stream (if the tenant pays).

    Possibly it's the combination of factors that have resulted in a decline.
    Financial disasters happen when the last person who can remember what went wrong last time has left the building.
    • Belgrave
    • By Belgrave 16th May 18, 2:14 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Belgrave
    Hi Thrugelmir, yes Aldemore are one of the few who will consider lending on a holiday let property, they value it at the fixed term rental value. What's confusing me is they had all the details about the various factors (comparatively high cc debt due to car purchase, company figures, low earnings because of supplement from DLA etc) and they clarified them all before authorising the valuation. Then three weeks later they declined stating the simple headlines of all the info they had at the start.
    Last edited by Belgrave; 16-05-2018 at 2:33 PM.
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