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  • FIRST POST
    • marie3196658
    • By marie3196658 14th May 18, 3:19 PM
    • 17Posts
    • 3Thanks
    marie3196658
    Help, been sold a stolen car
    • #1
    • 14th May 18, 3:19 PM
    Help, been sold a stolen car 14th May 18 at 3:19 PM
    i bought a car in November 2017 and it has been found that the car has been stolen. false number plates put on with matching VIN numbers on the windscreen and inside the drivers door panel. we found out because we were having a problem trying to obtain a V5 for the car (after not receiving it from the change over from the buyer).
    we are now without a car and £15000 out of pocket. can anybody give any advice of the best way forward to try and get our money back or even the car. the insurance company that insured the car at the time of it being stolen have already paid out for the car and will take possession of the vehicle. i have been intouch with them and i am waiting a reply to see if we can get the car back at all.
    we paid cash after receiving a good enough 'excuse' why he couldn't receive money through a bank transfer, so not covered on any debit or credit card insurance
    we bought the car from an advert on Auto Trader and did the additional checks, but of course we were doing the checks on a false number plate hence why it came back all clear and no suspicions were raised when we bought the car.
    any advice would be much appreciated
    Last edited by marie3196658; 14-05-2018 at 3:22 PM. Reason: spelling errors
Page 2
    • hollydays
    • By hollydays 14th May 18, 9:19 PM
    • 16,377 Posts
    • 12,438 Thanks
    hollydays
    For that amount of loss I'd employ a private investigator
    • marie3196658
    • By marie3196658 14th May 18, 9:52 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    marie3196658
    The car did have a v5c but the seller didnt send off the paperwork for me to get a log book for the car. I had the little green slip which I later used to apply for a manual log book and had one sent to me it was only when the correct car got sold that the issue was raised. I did also do the hpi checks and nothing came up because I repeat again the number plates were false
    • NotRichAtAll
    • By NotRichAtAll 14th May 18, 9:58 PM
    • 748 Posts
    • 627 Thanks
    NotRichAtAll
    So have you involved the old bill? am bloody sure i would of by now i'd be staking the area out looking for the toe rag
    • waamo
    • By waamo 14th May 18, 11:12 PM
    • 4,252 Posts
    • 5,583 Thanks
    waamo
    You did an HPI check. Sending off the paperwork is irrelevant. Did you meet the t&c's for their guarantee?
    This space for hire.
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 14th May 18, 11:35 PM
    • 1,779 Posts
    • 2,249 Thanks
    twhitehousescat
    The car did have a v5c but the seller didnt send off the paperwork for me to get a log book for the car. I had the little green slip which I later used to apply for a manual log book and had one sent to me it was only when the correct car got sold that the issue was raised. I did also do the hpi checks and nothing came up because I repeat again the number plates were false
    Originally posted by marie3196658

    if you used the referance number on the V5 when doing ther HPI check , then I suspect you are covered , I have NOT studied terms/conditions , you should now
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • seashore22
    • By seashore22 15th May 18, 8:37 AM
    • 1,152 Posts
    • 2,583 Thanks
    seashore22
    i bought a car in November 2017 and it has been found that the car has been stolen. false number plates put on with matching VIN numbers on the windscreen and inside the drivers door panel. we found out because we were having a problem trying to obtain a V5 for the car (after not receiving it from the change over from the buyer).
    we are now without a car and £15000 out of pocket. can anybody give any advice of the best way forward to try and get our money back or even the car. the insurance company that insured the car at the time of it being stolen have already paid out for the car and will take possession of the vehicle. i have been intouch with them and i am waiting a reply to see if we can get the car back at all.
    we paid cash after receiving a good enough 'excuse' why he couldn't receive money through a bank transfer, so not covered on any debit or credit card insurance
    we bought the car from an advert on Auto Trader and did the additional checks, but of course we were doing the checks on a false number plate hence why it came back all clear and no suspicions were raised when we bought the car.
    any advice would be much appreciated
    Originally posted by marie3196658
    As an aside, paying by bank transfer is the same as paying in cash. It gives you no protection when things like this happen.
    • hollydays
    • By hollydays 15th May 18, 8:39 AM
    • 16,377 Posts
    • 12,438 Thanks
    hollydays
    if you used the referance number on the V5 when doing ther HPI check , then I suspect you are covered , I have NOT studied terms/conditions , you should now
    Originally posted by twhitehousescat
    Logic says that's unlikely.
    • marie3196658
    • By marie3196658 15th May 18, 10:23 AM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    marie3196658
    they said that they leased the car since new and decided to buy off the lease company to sell on and get an updated model.
    it is all an absolute mess that seems nothing can be done about it. there is compensation for everything other than being a victim of crime in these circumstances.
    • J B
    • By J B 15th May 18, 10:25 AM
    • 2,923 Posts
    • 1,053 Thanks
    J B
    Have you gone to the police?
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 15th May 18, 11:05 AM
    • 2,640 Posts
    • 4,180 Thanks
    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    they said that they leased the car since new and decided to buy off the lease company to sell on and get an updated model.
    it is all an absolute mess that seems nothing can be done about it. there is compensation for everything other than being a victim of crime in these circumstances.
    Originally posted by marie3196658
    You have carelessly, let's be honest, handed over £15,000 to a con man.

    Where is the compensation supposed to come from for this? From the tax payer? If so, should everyone who suffers any loss due to crime be compensated by the tax payer, regardless of their degree of negligence? Can we do away with insurance against theft?

    That's never really been part of our system. It would be a huge change to make it so. It's not that simple an issue.

    I should point out, as well, that the reason the default position in this case is to believe you is because there's no reason for you to lie. There's no proof you handed over £15,000 to anyone. If there was any way you could be compensated for that £15,000, especially without anyone having been convicted, the number of false claims would be astronomical.
    Last edited by ScorpiondeRooftrouser; 15-05-2018 at 3:14 PM.
    • CardinalWolsey
    • By CardinalWolsey 15th May 18, 12:28 PM
    • 292 Posts
    • 275 Thanks
    CardinalWolsey
    As an aside, paying by bank transfer is the same as paying in cash. It gives you no protection when things like this happen.
    Originally posted by seashore22
    It gives no official protection, but it does mean you have a sort code and account number that the money went in to. Banks have to perform "Know Your Customer" checks, as well as having Anti-Money Laundering processes in place. You're at a lot better starting point than just handing cash over.
    • arcon5
    • By arcon5 15th May 18, 8:41 PM
    • 13,627 Posts
    • 8,642 Thanks
    arcon5
    You have carelessly, let's be honest, handed over £15,000 to a con man.

    Where is the compensation supposed to come from for this? From the tax payer? If so, should everyone who suffers any loss due to crime be compensated by the tax payer, regardless of their degree of negligence? Can we do away with insurance against theft?

    That's never really been part of our system. It would be a huge change to make it so. It's not that simple an issue.

    I should point out, as well, that the reason the default position in this case is to believe you is because there's no reason for you to lie. There's no proof you handed over £15,000 to anyone. If there was any way you could be compensated for that £15,000, especially without anyone having been convicted, the number of false claims would be astronomical.
    Originally posted by ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    Careless how?
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 16th May 18, 9:49 AM
    • 2,640 Posts
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    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    Careless how?
    Originally posted by arcon5
    Is that a serious question? Giving £15,000 in cash to any private individual for a car is careless. Giving £15,000 in cash to someone you don't even have a verified name and address for or when you haven't seen a V5 is very careless. Doing it when both are true is insane.
    Last edited by ScorpiondeRooftrouser; 16-05-2018 at 9:52 AM.
    • AndyMc.....
    • By AndyMc..... 16th May 18, 10:01 AM
    • 2,358 Posts
    • 1,436 Thanks
    AndyMc.....
    Is that a serious question? Giving £15,000 in cash to any private individual for a car is careless. Giving £15,000 in cash to someone you don't even have a verified name and address for or when you haven't seen a V5 is very careless. Doing it when both are true is insane.
    Originally posted by ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    Iíve they havenít seen the V5, how do they know this?

    We went to 'an address ' but dont know if it was his address although it did match the log book.
    Originally posted by marie3196658
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 16th May 18, 10:15 AM
    • 2,640 Posts
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    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    I!!!8217;ve they haven!!!8217;t seen the V5, how do they know this?
    Originally posted by AndyMc.....
    Rereading they initially imply they weren't given a V5; but subsequently they seem to indicate that they were.

    So only very careless then - handing over £15,000 cash to someone they didn't know without any proof of identity.
    • AndyMc.....
    • By AndyMc..... 16th May 18, 12:16 PM
    • 2,358 Posts
    • 1,436 Thanks
    AndyMc.....
    Rereading they initially imply they weren't given a V5; but subsequently they seem to indicate that they were.

    So only very careless then - handing over £15,000 cash to someone they didn't know without any proof of identity.
    Originally posted by ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    So I guess you would have asked to see their passport, driving licence, deeds to the house and a recent utility bill.
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 16th May 18, 1:56 PM
    • 2,640 Posts
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    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    So I guess you would have asked to see their passport, driving licence, deeds to the house and a recent utility bill.
    Originally posted by AndyMc.....
    No I wouldn't have asked for that, because I wouldn't pay a private individual £15,000 in cash for a car.

    If for some reason I was going to, I would at least make sure I had been inside their house and seen some proof they were who they claimed to be, yes. I mean, even then I wouldn't, personally if I were paying £15,000 for a car, cash or not, I'd be buying from an established business, but that seems to me to be a minimum.

    Are you saying that I am unusual in this? I'm really not sure I am.
    Would you be offended if you were the seller and someone asked for this?
    • unholyangel
    • By unholyangel 16th May 18, 2:10 PM
    • 12,806 Posts
    • 10,125 Thanks
    unholyangel
    http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/ombudsman-news/55/55-ask.htm

    Did you have the car insured OP? It appears the ombudsman might side with you depending on whether you took reasonable steps and acted in good faith.

    As for no proof they paid the money to anyone....I daresay OP didn't have £15,000 sitting around the house and would have withdrawn it from a bank account shortly before completing the purchase.

    You said it was at the address on the V5.....was it just outside the house or did you actually see them enter/exit the house at any point?
    Money doesn't solve poverty.....it creates it.
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 16th May 18, 2:17 PM
    • 2,640 Posts
    • 4,180 Thanks
    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/ombudsman-news/55/55-ask.htm

    Did you have the car insured OP? It appears the ombudsman might side with you depending on whether you took reasonable steps and acted in good faith.

    As for no proof they paid the money to anyone....I daresay OP didn't have £15,000 sitting around the house and would have withdrawn it from a bank account shortly before completing the purchase.

    You said it was at the address on the V5.....was it just outside the house or did you actually see them enter/exit the house at any point?
    Originally posted by unholyangel
    If you read my comment about no proof, that is in relation to the idea of compensating people. My point is precisely that we do accept that it happened at the moment because there is nothing to gain, but if they were liable to be compensated for the full amount, we couldn't just accept it as there would be so much to gain. If such claims were possible then taking money out of the bank and making it disappear would obviously be easy.
    I have not for a moment suggested they didn't pay the £15,000 in this instance; there's no reason for them to make it up.
    • AndyMc.....
    • By AndyMc..... 16th May 18, 2:22 PM
    • 2,358 Posts
    • 1,436 Thanks
    AndyMc.....
    No I wouldn't have asked for that, because I wouldn't pay a private individual £15,000 in cash for a car.

    If for some reason I was going to, I would at least make sure I had been inside their house and seen some proof they were who they claimed to be, yes. I mean, even then I wouldn't, personally if I were paying £15,000 for a car, cash or not, I'd be buying from an established business, but that seems to me to be a minimum.

    Are you saying that I am unusual in this? I'm really not sure I am.
    Would you be offended if you were the seller and someone asked for this?
    Originally posted by ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    Iím saying youíre not much help to the op.
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