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  • FIRST POST
    • CO NO
    • By CO NO 14th May 18, 6:48 AM
    • 10Posts
    • 0Thanks
    CO NO
    Is the Land Registry to be trusted?
    • #1
    • 14th May 18, 6:48 AM
    Is the Land Registry to be trusted? 14th May 18 at 6:48 AM
    I thought it would be useful to search the internet for my home address and discovered that my property had been sold last year. This was news to me! There appears to be a mix up between locally similar named properties. The property to which the change of interests refers is correctly marked on the Land Registry map but with the wrong name. Another neighbouring property on this map is also incorrectly spelt. This makes 3 errors locally. Is this a growing problem? Who is responsible for checking the validity of information in the LR Databases? Is it LR or the conveyancing Solicitor? Which Ministry does the LR come under?

    Any information and advice appreciated.
Page 1
    • 00ec25
    • By 00ec25 14th May 18, 7:24 AM
    • 6,650 Posts
    • 6,244 Thanks
    00ec25
    • #2
    • 14th May 18, 7:24 AM
    • #2
    • 14th May 18, 7:24 AM
    There is an official rep from the Land Registry on these boards...

    as for your factual questions, such as who do they come "under" - ever heard of Google?
    • da_rule
    • By da_rule 14th May 18, 7:54 AM
    • 2,715 Posts
    • 2,394 Thanks
    da_rule
    • #3
    • 14th May 18, 7:54 AM
    • #3
    • 14th May 18, 7:54 AM
    If you!!!8217;re worried it might be worth paying the £3 to download your title register so that you can check that everything is in order.

    In relation to the information, from what I understand the companies that produce the maps (Zoopla etc) use the public database information released by the Land Registry. Therefore it may be that they have misinterpreted something when they!!!8217;ve input the information.

    You can also set up property alerts on your property if you!!!8217;re worried that it might be susceptible to fraud.
    • Davesnave
    • By Davesnave 14th May 18, 7:55 AM
    • 25,565 Posts
    • 93,561 Thanks
    Davesnave
    • #4
    • 14th May 18, 7:55 AM
    • #4
    • 14th May 18, 7:55 AM
    Because you have "Land Registry" in your title, their rep is almost bound to see it and respond.

    As the above poster says, they have their own dedicated thread, which could be permanently at the top of the first page, but MSE have not arranged things that way.

    Spellings change, addresses alter and duplications occur. My own house and another 150m away had exactly the same address for 24 years until someone noticed. Even now, the council which ordered this to change cannot get their own collective heads around it.

    In short, people make mistakes, so we can't trust them not to do that, but we can expect the LR to follow the law and act impartially.
    If you are finding huge gaps between your paragraphs, MSE know about the problem. However, they aren't necessarily doing anything about it. More changes on the way?
    https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5844460
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 14th May 18, 8:19 AM
    • 8,045 Posts
    • 8,313 Thanks
    davidmcn
    • #5
    • 14th May 18, 8:19 AM
    • #5
    • 14th May 18, 8:19 AM
    I thought it would be useful to search the internet for my home address and discovered that my property had been sold last year. This was news to me! There appears to be a mix up between locally similar named properties. The property to which the change of interests refers is correctly marked on the Land Registry map but with the wrong name. Another neighbouring property on this map is also incorrectly spelt
    Originally posted by CO NO
    The fact it's correctly marked on the map is the important thing - that's what identifies the legal extent of the property, not the postal address.

    If the only error is the spelling of the names, do you mean just on the map? If so that's an error in the Ordnance Survey map. If you mean on the Land Registry's database, I think the LR are meant to try to align those with the Royal Mail's address database (have you checked the Royal Mail's website to see if they've got it right?).

    Also bear in mind that owners might change their house name without informing any of the authorities! Neither the LR nor the solicitors will be coming round to check the sign on the gate.

    Which Ministry does the LR come under?
    They do tell you on their website:

    HM Land Registry is part of the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy (BEIS). Chief Executive and Chief Land Registrar Graham Farrant is responsible to Secretary of State Greg Clark and Minister Lord Henley.
    • kingstreet
    • By kingstreet 14th May 18, 9:53 AM
    • 33,702 Posts
    • 18,273 Thanks
    kingstreet
    • #6
    • 14th May 18, 9:53 AM
    • #6
    • 14th May 18, 9:53 AM
    the Royal Mail's address database (have you checked the Royal Mail's website to see if they've got it right?)
    Originally posted by davidmcn
    The bane of my life.

    People inventing addresses for themselves and then having documents showing three different variations instead of the Royal Mail PAF search output, which can be found here;-

    https://www.royalmail.com/find-a-postcode
    I am a mortgage broker. You should note that this site doesn't check my status as a Mortgage Adviser, so you need to take my word for it. This signature is here as I follow MSE's Mortgage Adviser Code of Conduct. Any posts on here are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as financial advice. Please do not send PMs asking for one-to-one-advice, or representation.
    • CO NO
    • By CO NO 14th May 18, 10:44 AM
    • 10 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    CO NO
    • #7
    • 14th May 18, 10:44 AM
    • #7
    • 14th May 18, 10:44 AM
    I should have added that I did indeed pay to download both the Registry Current Title PLAN and the Register EXTRACT, the latter confirms the registered owner is not myself! TITLE ABSOLUTE is not myself.

    Is there no Government Department that can be trusted?
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 14th May 18, 10:50 AM
    • 8,045 Posts
    • 8,313 Thanks
    davidmcn
    • #8
    • 14th May 18, 10:50 AM
    • #8
    • 14th May 18, 10:50 AM
    I should have added that I did indeed pay to download both the Registry Current Title PLAN and the Register EXTRACT, the latter confirms the registered owner is not myself! TITLE ABSOLUTE is not myself.
    Originally posted by CO NO
    Well, who is it then? This isn't a mix-up between freehold and leasehold titles by any chance?

    Is there no Government Department that can be trusted?
    Er, yes. At best the LR can only go on the information provided to them, and it doesn't sound like you've yet verified what the problem is.
    • CO NO
    • By CO NO 14th May 18, 10:56 AM
    • 10 Posts
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    CO NO
    • #9
    • 14th May 18, 10:56 AM
    • #9
    • 14th May 18, 10:56 AM
    The LR do not independently check the information they are given then? Both properties are Freehold. No leashold involved.
    Last edited by CO NO; 14-05-2018 at 10:58 AM. Reason: addition
    • silvercar
    • By silvercar 14th May 18, 11:01 AM
    • 37,396 Posts
    • 157,441 Thanks
    silvercar
    I should have added that I did indeed pay to download both the Registry Current Title PLAN and the Register EXTRACT, the latter confirms the registered owner is not myself! TITLE ABSOLUTE is not myself.

    Is there no Government Department that can be trusted?
    Originally posted by CO NO
    Contact the solicitor that acted for you when you bought. You paid them to register your ownership of the property.
    • CO NO
    • By CO NO 14th May 18, 11:06 AM
    • 10 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    CO NO
    I am not the buyer. My home is named on the LR REGISTER but the PLAN refers to the correct property with another but similar name. My property has not changed hands and has nothing to do with anyone else.
    Last edited by CO NO; 14-05-2018 at 11:08 AM. Reason: clarity.
    • eddddy
    • By eddddy 14th May 18, 11:06 AM
    • 6,612 Posts
    • 6,481 Thanks
    eddddy
    The bane of my life.

    People inventing addresses for themselves and then having documents showing three different variations instead of the Royal Mail PAF search output, which can be found here;-

    https://www.royalmail.com/find-a-postcode
    Originally posted by kingstreet
    I'm probably one of the culprets that you describe!

    I changed a house name 20+ years ago.
    • Council tax, planning consents etc, in new name
    • LR database shows old name
    • RM PAF has two entries - one for old name and one for new

    (It confuses TV licensing who probably use PAF. They don't believe that 2 PAF entries relate to one house, and keep sending inspectors looking for a non-existent house.)
    • GDB2222
    • By GDB2222 14th May 18, 11:06 AM
    • 14,512 Posts
    • 78,466 Thanks
    GDB2222
    I should have added that I did indeed pay to download both the Registry Current Title PLAN and the Register EXTRACT, the latter confirms the registered owner is not myself! TITLE ABSOLUTE is not myself.

    Is there no Government Department that can be trusted?
    Originally posted by CO NO

    If this is the title of the property you actually live in that's in somebody else's name, then you have a really big problem. Somebody else owns the legal title to your house (but hopefully not the beneficial interest)!

    The LR rep will probably tell you how to sort it out. That's if it can be sorted out.

    On the other hand, if there's another property in the neighbourhood with the same or very similar name, that may be confusing for the postman, but there's no real financial issue.
    No reliance should be placed on the above! Absolutely none, do you hear?
    • StumpyPumpy
    • By StumpyPumpy 14th May 18, 11:15 AM
    • 1,263 Posts
    • 3,408 Thanks
    StumpyPumpy
    I should have added that I did indeed pay to download both the Registry Current Title PLAN and the Register EXTRACT, the latter confirms the registered owner is not myself! TITLE ABSOLUTE is not myself.

    Is there no Government Department that can be trusted?
    Originally posted by CO NO
    Don't worry, the Government keep making plans to sell it off, though currently they are waiting for a better opportunity to slip it unnoticed into another bill ministers are reviewing responses to the government’s consultation.

    I'm sure once it is forcibly transformed into a service run by a profit making private company able to operate in a free market with little or no oversight, the levels of trust, efficiency and helpfulness will go through the roof.

    SP
    Come on people, it's not difficult: lose means to be unable to find, loose means not being fixed in place. So if you have a hole in your pocket you might lose your loose change.
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 14th May 18, 11:19 AM
    • 8,045 Posts
    • 8,313 Thanks
    davidmcn
    OP, are you sure the same title was previously in your name?
  • Land Registry
    Others have largely covered it and as davidmcn posts house names on plans are invariably added by Ordnance Survey

    We do have some control over that but when a property is registered and the extent mapped we use the OS base map available at that time. If a house name changes or was misspelt we would not generally amend/update the title plan until the registered extent altered for some reason.

    Postal addresses are managed by the local authority for electoral roll purposes. They then notify Royal Mail and most then use their data to track and link data to a specific address.

    I'm sure OS add house names to their plans but not every single one as their purpose is to survey the area/development primarily with regards the physical features in place e.g. buildings and fences.

    In my experience if you are searching a specific address and there are two separate freehold titles and say three different house name spellings then it needs looking at to understand what has happened and why. But more importantly to have it corrected if we can.
    Last edited by Land Registry; 16-05-2018 at 5:47 AM. Reason: Last para removed as email not used
    Official Company Representative
    I am the official company representative of Land Registry. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • CO NO
    • By CO NO 14th May 18, 6:41 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    CO NO
    I'm probably one of the culprets that you describe!

    I changed a house name 20+ years ago.
    • Council tax, planning consents etc, in new name
    • LR database shows old name
    • RM PAF has two entries - one for old name and one for new

    (It confuses TV licensing who probably use PAF. They don't believe that 2 PAF entries relate to one house, and keep sending inspectors looking for a non-existent house.)
    Originally posted by eddddy
    There you go...Government Department wondering around wasting money because they don't know which way is up! We have Grenfell, Windrush etc.. What is going on?
    • Elinore
    • By Elinore 14th May 18, 6:59 PM
    • 114 Posts
    • 357 Thanks
    Elinore
    Deleted. Irritated unhelpful response.
    Last edited by Elinore; 14-05-2018 at 7:02 PM.
    • CO NO
    • By CO NO 14th May 18, 7:04 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    CO NO
    Don't worry, the Government keep making plans to sell it off, though currently they are waiting for a better opportunity to slip it unnoticed into another bill ministers are reviewing responses to the government’s consultation.

    I'm sure once it is forcibly transformed into a service run by a profit-making private company able to operate in a free market with little or no oversight, the levels of trust, efficiency and helpfulness will go through the roof.





    SP
    Originally posted by StumpyPumpy
    Rock and a harder place...again.

    Always bear in mind to err is human, but if you really want to c**k it up you need a computer!
    • G_M
    • By G_M 14th May 18, 7:39 PM
    • 44,745 Posts
    • 53,230 Thanks
    G_M
    Good grief! Get off your high horse.


    If there's an issue with your own property's register, identify what it is and contact the LR to get it corrected!


    Personally the last thing I want is for my taxes to be spent on the LR checking the names, postal addresses and ordnance survey entries for every single property in the country.


    I'd far rather the money went to the NHS, or filling pot holes, or blowing up ISIS in the middle east (just added to see the reaction!), whilst errors get sorted out when properties change hands or owners bring those errors to the LR's attention.


    Note. If you're worried about your property being sold without you knowing, sign up to the free LR property alert!
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