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    • Sehmett
    • By Sehmett 11th May 18, 2:16 AM
    • 3Posts
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    Sehmett
    Reference checks
    • #1
    • 11th May 18, 2:16 AM
    Reference checks 11th May 18 at 2:16 AM
    Hi everyone!
    I have a question regarding reference checks. My new employer asked me to provide contact details for references. I gave them contact details of my managers and HR in all previous companies i worked for. As I am aware now, they chose to contact different people (they just got some names from websites of companies where I worked) and I wasn't informed about it. Are they allowed to do it?
Page 1
    • _shel
    • By _shel 11th May 18, 5:13 AM
    • 1,404 Posts
    • 2,462 Thanks
    _shel
    • #2
    • 11th May 18, 5:13 AM
    • #2
    • 11th May 18, 5:13 AM
    Hi everyone!
    I have a question regarding reference checks. My new employer asked me to provide contact details for references. I gave them contact details of my managers and HR in all previous companies i worked for. As I am aware now, they chose to contact different people (they just got some names from websites of companies where I worked) and I wasn't informed about it. Are they allowed to do it?
    Originally posted by Sehmett
    Yes, they can ask anyone they want. They went to who they felt was best in the companies you worked in.
    • stclair
    • By stclair 11th May 18, 10:39 PM
    • 6,494 Posts
    • 3,442 Thanks
    stclair
    • #3
    • 11th May 18, 10:39 PM
    • #3
    • 11th May 18, 10:39 PM
    Most companies will only give a factual now a days.
    Im an ex employee RBS Group
    However Any Opinion Given On MSE Is Strictly My Own
    • Brynsam
    • By Brynsam 12th May 18, 1:12 AM
    • 1,559 Posts
    • 1,135 Thanks
    Brynsam
    • #4
    • 12th May 18, 1:12 AM
    • #4
    • 12th May 18, 1:12 AM
    Yes, they can ask anyone they want. They went to who they felt was best in the companies you worked in.
    Originally posted by _shel
    ...or chose other names in case you'd set up the people you'd named to give you glowing but inaccurate references (no, I'm not suggesting you did - but you'd be surprised how often it happens).
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 12th May 18, 1:34 AM
    • 2,640 Posts
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    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • #5
    • 12th May 18, 1:34 AM
    • #5
    • 12th May 18, 1:34 AM
    ...or chose other names in case you'd set up the people you'd named to give you glowing but inaccurate references (no, I'm not suggesting you did - but you'd be surprised how often it happens).
    Originally posted by Brynsam
    They didn't choose who they went to at all. They would just have addressed it to HR, in the normal, proper way. It's up to the old company's HR department to contact anyone else if they see the need, or can be bothered.

    It does amaze me how many people seem to still live in the 1950s and think references should come from named people; they might as well carry around a lot of glowing "testimonials" headed "To whom it may concern" and written by someone who met them twice when they were 17. References haven't worked like that for years.
    • keepcalmandstayoutofdebt
    • By keepcalmandstayoutofdebt 12th May 18, 8:14 AM
    • 3,363 Posts
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    keepcalmandstayoutofdebt
    • #6
    • 12th May 18, 8:14 AM
    • #6
    • 12th May 18, 8:14 AM
    Hi everyone!
    I have a question regarding reference checks. My new employer asked me to provide contact details for references. I gave them contact details of my managers and HR in all previous companies i worked for. As I am aware now, they chose to contact different people (they just got some names from websites of companies where I worked) and I wasn't informed about it. Are they allowed to do it?
    Originally posted by Sehmett
    More importantly, how did you come to find out about it? It seems like a lot of trouble to look up other information.

    For all you know your named contacts may have turned around and said "I am not authorised to give a reference", and so directed on, in today's time I can actually see this being more the case.

    Are you still working there - is that allowed.
    "If you are caught in a rainstorm, once you accept that you'll receive a soaking, the only thing left to do is enjoy the walk"
    • Fireflyaway
    • By Fireflyaway 12th May 18, 9:07 AM
    • 1,919 Posts
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    Fireflyaway
    • #7
    • 12th May 18, 9:07 AM
    • #7
    • 12th May 18, 9:07 AM
    I've applied for a few jobs recently that have asked for a specific name on a reference. It's hard, not everyone gets on with their line manager, thats why I wanted to leave!
    Having had to apply for many references for people I hired in my last job, the majority provided a standard response of job title and length of service so I wouldn't worry. If the reference did come back uncomplimentary ask to see it.
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 12th May 18, 10:36 AM
    • 2,640 Posts
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    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • #8
    • 12th May 18, 10:36 AM
    • #8
    • 12th May 18, 10:36 AM
    I've applied for a few jobs recently that have asked for a specific name on a reference. It's hard, not everyone gets on with their line manager, thats why I wanted to leave!
    Having had to apply for many references for people I hired in my last job, the majority provided a standard response of job title and length of service so I wouldn't worry. If the reference did come back uncomplimentary ask to see it.
    Originally posted by Fireflyaway
    Even if you name your manager, they will still almost certainly address the request to HR (assuming they know what they are doing). It's then up to HR to decide whether they contact that person or not.

    In any properly run company any manager receiving a reference request knows that the response need to comply with company policy and will take it to HR if somehow it ends up on their desk by mistake. Managers shouldn't be sending out unvetted responses to reference requests.

    If just asked for a specific name, name the HR department and tell anyone who asks that that's the policy. If asked who your manager was, answer truthfully; it's a different question.

    Just "not getting on with your line manager" should never lead to a negative reference. We honestly don't live in that world any more. If you have on-record disciplinary action, that's a different thing.
    • dominqueobs
    • By dominqueobs 12th May 18, 10:42 AM
    • 14 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    dominqueobs
    • #9
    • 12th May 18, 10:42 AM
    • #9
    • 12th May 18, 10:42 AM
    Just "not getting on with your line manager" should never lead to a negative reference. We honestly don't live in that world any more.
    Originally posted by ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    I've seen it happen recently. Sometimes references have a 'would you employ this person again?' question and they put no on every reference of people who raised grievances with pay or poor working conditions.
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 12th May 18, 11:00 AM
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    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    I've seen it happen recently. Sometimes references have a 'would you employ this person again?' question and they put no on every reference of people who raised grievances with pay or poor working conditions.
    Originally posted by dominqueobs
    What sort of company is doing that?

    There was someone on here before who claimed they answered "no" to that question if they didn't have any current vacancies to suit them, and couldn't understand what they were doing wrong, so in smaller companies staffed by idiots nothing would really surprise me but anywhere that knows what they are doing shouldn't be doing this.
    • dominqueobs
    • By dominqueobs 12th May 18, 11:07 AM
    • 14 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    dominqueobs
    What sort of company is doing that?

    There was someone on here before who claimed they answered "no" to that question if they didn't have any current vacancies to suit them, and couldn't understand what they were doing wrong, so in smaller companies staffed by idiots nothing would really surprise me but anywhere that knows what they are doing shouldn't be doing this.
    Originally posted by ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    NHS I don't know if they have a standard reference form but I seen a few that were the same from different NHS sites that asked questions like that with opportunities for a boss with sour grapes to throw a spanner in the works.
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 12th May 18, 11:29 AM
    • 2,640 Posts
    • 4,179 Thanks
    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    NHS I don't know if they have a standard reference form but I seen a few that were the same from different NHS sites that asked questions like that with opportunities for a boss with sour grapes to throw a spanner in the works.
    Originally posted by dominqueobs
    Sorry I am not clear....you seem to be saying the NHS were asking the question? That question is perfectly ok to be asked, but should be answered by HR in the old company based on the person's record; not on somebody's personal opinion of them.

    Who is the "they" in "they put no on every reference of people who raised grievances with pay or poor working conditions" and how are you aware that they were doing this?
    • elsien
    • By elsien 12th May 18, 11:31 AM
    • 17,123 Posts
    • 43,154 Thanks
    elsien
    Most companies will only give a factual now a days.
    Originally posted by stclair
    People keep saying that but I can only recall having one factual reference amongst the plethora of fulle ones.
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 12th May 18, 11:36 AM
    • 2,640 Posts
    • 4,179 Thanks
    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    People keep saying that but I can only recall having one factual reference amongst the plethora of fulle ones.
    Originally posted by elsien
    You personally? Can I ask how you know? I've never seen or been aware of any reference that's ever been requested or given for me. I suspect different industries may do things differently.
    • elsien
    • By elsien 12th May 18, 11:41 AM
    • 17,123 Posts
    • 43,154 Thanks
    elsien
    No, ones I've had as a recruiter. I know my last work reference given for me was a full one though because my new employer commented on how positive it was.
    Last edited by elsien; 12-05-2018 at 11:44 AM.
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
    • Ja7188
    • By Ja7188 12th May 18, 11:59 AM
    • 194 Posts
    • 186 Thanks
    Ja7188
    I suspect different industries may do things differently.
    Exactly - for example, a teaching reference will generally be quite extensive, whereas corporate organisations will often provide minimal information only.

    Personally I can't help thinking that any reference which is based on opinion, rather than fact, is pretty pointless.
    • dominqueobs
    • By dominqueobs 12th May 18, 1:59 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    dominqueobs
    Sorry I am not clear....you seem to be saying the NHS were asking the question? That question is perfectly ok to be asked, but should be answered by HR in the old company based on the person's record; not on somebody's personal opinion of them.

    Who is the "they" in "they put no on every reference of people who raised grievances with pay or poor working conditions" and how are you aware that they were doing this?
    Originally posted by ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    People move around in the NHS and not everywhere has a separate HR dept. so the requests will go to the manager who also deals with all the pay/work grievances. In a professional workplace it would be impartial and based on records, but I was just saying it does happen to people of all levels. They can just blame it on not being a team player even if they were well liked.
    • stclair
    • By stclair 12th May 18, 8:11 PM
    • 6,494 Posts
    • 3,442 Thanks
    stclair
    People keep saying that but I can only recall having one factual reference amongst the plethora of fulle ones.
    Originally posted by elsien
    I think the new GDPR as possibility put the frigtners on some companies now when it comes to referencing.

    The OP might have had a communication at work recently detailing how GDPR will affect them at work and will possibly include something with regards to references.
    Last edited by stclair; 12-05-2018 at 8:19 PM.
    Im an ex employee RBS Group
    However Any Opinion Given On MSE Is Strictly My Own
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