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  • FIRST POST
    • MoneySavingMission
    • By MoneySavingMission 7th May 18, 9:11 PM
    • 217Posts
    • 26Thanks
    MoneySavingMission
    moonlight tenant gone!
    • #1
    • 7th May 18, 9:11 PM
    moonlight tenant gone! 7th May 18 at 9:11 PM
    Hi
    I need some guidance re a moonlighting tenant. I'm the landlord, I don't want to put detail on an open forum, can someone experienced in the legal situation of this please pm me?
Page 3
    • MoneySavingMission
    • By MoneySavingMission 8th May 18, 2:40 PM
    • 217 Posts
    • 26 Thanks
    MoneySavingMission
    I was also confused by the term moonlighting. I thought that meant someone who had two jobs.

    Is the tenant in arrears? If so, by how much? If not, have they broken any terms of their contract (e.g. is there a term that they can't leave it unoccupied for more than a set time).
    Originally posted by thelem
    Yes, it's in the contact 'tenant to tell landlord if absent from accommodation for a period of more than 14 days' Impossible to know when they moved out for certain - police did say a few weeks ago.

    Yes, ok it's a Short Assured Tenancy. Also surprised, at the attack of some posters.
    • agrinnall
    • By agrinnall 8th May 18, 2:47 PM
    • 21,021 Posts
    • 16,807 Thanks
    agrinnall
    I was also confused by the term moonlighting. I thought that meant someone who had two jobs.
    Originally posted by thelem
    I suspect that the OP has used the term as a short cut to mean "done a moonlight flit", but because the OP can't be bothered to give us the proper background I'm not getting involved.
    • moneyistooshorttomention
    • By moneyistooshorttomention 8th May 18, 3:27 PM
    • 16,624 Posts
    • 45,892 Thanks
    moneyistooshorttomention
    The reason you're getting mixed opinions is because on the one hand, the law affords your tenant a LOT of protection that comes at your expense; on the other hand, the tenant is highly unlikely to make use of any of it. So you have a choice to make between following the law and thereby incurring significant extra expense but no risk, or taking shortcuts that will probably be absolutely fine but run the risk of landing you in hot water. Posters here vary significantly in their levels of risk aversion. Those who've seen a few of my posts will be unsurprised to hear me say I'd personally go for option #2; I'm equally unsurprised by some of the people recommending option #1
    Originally posted by ThePants999
    Par for the course - living in Britain 2018 (some parts more than others) and there will be people who are "scared of their own shadow" on the one hand and terrified to do anything that might amount to "putting a foot out of place" on the one hand and those thinking "I'll just go in for commonsense - and there shouldnt be a problem" on the other hand).

    Yep....personally - some of us do believe in being straight down the line fair (to both parties) and that may or may not coincide with how the law is currently (ie in the exact year concerned).

    NB; Some of us instantly took the term "moonlighting" exactly as meant. The term does, strictly, refer to jobs - but some of us realised that it meant = doing a moonlight flit (ie in this context).
    Last edited by moneyistooshorttomention; 08-05-2018 at 3:32 PM.
    ****************
    • ThePants999
    • By ThePants999 8th May 18, 5:47 PM
    • 1,260 Posts
    • 1,588 Thanks
    ThePants999
    Indeed. And it amuses me a bit that there's a strong correlation between the sorts of people that say "it's obvious you need to follow the letter of the law" and the people who say "being a landlord is running a business, so you should know this stuff like the back of your hand and live by it" - because I suspect that it's rather common for one-man businesses in other sectors to take certain commonsense legal shortcuts from time to time
    • G_M
    • By G_M 8th May 18, 8:04 PM
    • 45,334 Posts
    • 54,347 Thanks
    G_M
    I don't believe there's any further information to impart.

    The OP has had the law explained; been pointed at sources of information; been advised of practical short-cuts; had the risks associated with those shortcuts spelt out; and has heard from people with varying viewpoints (as is normal on a public forum).

    All that remains is for the OP to make a decision, take the appropriate action, and then come back and tell us how it all pans out...........
    • MoneySavingMission
    • By MoneySavingMission 24th May 18, 10:57 PM
    • 217 Posts
    • 26 Thanks
    MoneySavingMission
    I served the official papers to the property - no short-cuts. By the Law. Now i'm out of pocket for legal costs and a for lengthy period and renovation budget for damage. Never mind rogue landlords, it's rogue tenants and lots of them!

    thanks to those who offered some kind help on this forum.
    • deannatrois
    • By deannatrois 25th May 18, 1:23 AM
    • 5,619 Posts
    • 7,900 Thanks
    deannatrois
    Next time (if you plan to rent out again) don't just rely on credit checks.

    1)Look at social media.
    2)If you can, ask for copies of bank statements so you can evaluate the tenants ability to pay rent and spending habits.
    3)Visit where they are living now (make some excuse of needing to talk over tenancy) to see if they look after the property they are living in.

    Credit checks only show if they have a bankruptcy or CCJ. Landlord references may not be truthful (particularly so if they are a tenant the LL wants rid of).

    Yes, its a lot of work, but you are letting them live in a property worth a lot of money, where you can lose a lot in refurbishment if they are the worst sort of tenant. Its worth time off and travelling costs to prevent thousands in refurb costs. Most tenants won't cause this but any LL needs to avoid the ones who do.

    There are ways to filter out such tenants.
    Last edited by deannatrois; 25-05-2018 at 1:26 AM.
    • westernpromise
    • By westernpromise 25th May 18, 9:31 AM
    • 4,263 Posts
    • 5,544 Thanks
    westernpromise
    Next time (if you plan to rent out again) don't just rely on credit checks.

    1)Look at social media.
    2)If you can, ask for copies of bank statements so you can evaluate the tenants ability to pay rent and spending habits.
    3)Visit where they are living now (make some excuse of needing to talk over tenancy) to see if they look after the property they are living in.

    Credit checks only show if they have a bankruptcy or CCJ. Landlord references may not be truthful (particularly so if they are a tenant the LL wants rid of).

    Yes, its a lot of work, but you are letting them live in a property worth a lot of money, where you can lose a lot in refurbishment if they are the worst sort of tenant. Its worth time off and travelling costs to prevent thousands in refurb costs. Most tenants won't cause this but any LL needs to avoid the ones who do.

    There are ways to filter out such tenants.
    Originally posted by deannatrois
    The other avenue is to let only high end properties.

    I have one rental worth about 1million and I would far rather have this than five worth 200k. You'd think the void risk would be higher with one property than five, but in 14 years I've never had one.
    Buying a house, if you believe the market has a way to fall, or if you are paying sill asking prices ( like some sheeple ) or if you are buying in London, is now a massive financial gamble!!!!! - June 8, 2012 by TheCountOfNowhere
    • mangog
    • By mangog 25th May 18, 6:08 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 113 Thanks
    mangog
    Frankly if a LL asked me for copies of my bank statements I'd tell them where to shove their house...or perhaps I'd ask to see copies of theirs, so I could be sure they could afford any necessary repairs to the property over the course of the tenancy!
    • Crashy Time
    • By Crashy Time 26th May 18, 8:14 PM
    • 6,535 Posts
    • 2,440 Thanks
    Crashy Time
    Frankly if a LL asked me for copies of my bank statements I'd tell them where to shove their house...or perhaps I'd ask to see copies of theirs, so I could be sure they could afford any necessary repairs to the property over the course of the tenancy!
    Originally posted by mangog

    Maybe the council check the landlords ability to do (pay for) basic repairs?
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 26th May 18, 9:44 PM
    • 2,640 Posts
    • 4,180 Thanks
    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    Par for the course - living in Britain 2018 (some parts more than others) and there will be people who are "scared of their own shadow" on the one hand and terrified to do anything that might amount to "putting a foot out of place" on the one hand and those thinking "I'll just go in for commonsense - and there shouldnt be a problem" on the other hand).

    Yep....personally - some of us do believe in being straight down the line fair (to both parties) and that may or may not coincide with how the law is currently (ie in the exact year concerned).

    NB; Some of us instantly took the term "moonlighting" exactly as meant. The term does, strictly, refer to jobs - but some of us realised that it meant = doing a moonlight flit (ie in this context).
    Originally posted by moneyistooshorttomention
    Some people know what the law is, and others, like you, assume it means whatever is going through their head at the moment they are speaking. You are dangerous on a site like this. You have no idea at all what you are talking about but never let it stop you spouting your opinion.
    Last edited by ScorpiondeRooftrouser; 26-05-2018 at 9:46 PM.
    • Crashy Time
    • By Crashy Time 27th May 18, 2:09 PM
    • 6,535 Posts
    • 2,440 Thanks
    Crashy Time
    What is the worst that could happen to the landlord by doing the wrong thing?
    • ancientofdays
    • By ancientofdays 27th May 18, 3:35 PM
    • 1,823 Posts
    • 22,251 Thanks
    ancientofdays
    What is the worst that could happen to the landlord by doing the wrong thing?
    Originally posted by Crashy Time
    If I recall correctly, whopping great fines.
    I was jumping to conclusions and one of them jumped back
    • Crashy Time
    • By Crashy Time 28th May 18, 9:33 AM
    • 6,535 Posts
    • 2,440 Thanks
    Crashy Time
    If I recall correctly, whopping great fines.
    Originally posted by ancientofdays

    Suppose it depends on the tenant being clued up and making a complaint? This tenant just sounds like they have somewhere better or in a different location to live.
    • deannatrois
    • By deannatrois 28th May 18, 11:09 AM
    • 5,619 Posts
    • 7,900 Thanks
    deannatrois
    It surprises me how many 'inept' tenants know what they can and can't do and exploit this. The OP can't take the risk that this tenant is like that.
    • ThePants999
    • By ThePants999 28th May 18, 1:17 PM
    • 1,260 Posts
    • 1,588 Thanks
    ThePants999
    The OP most certainly can. Risk, consequences, ya weighs it up and ya takes yer choice.

    However, the choice has already been made in this particular case, so it's moot
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