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  • FIRST POST
    • Bakes1295
    • By Bakes1295 7th May 18, 3:01 PM
    • 3Posts
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    Bakes1295
    iPhone 7 - Consumer Rights
    • #1
    • 7th May 18, 3:01 PM
    iPhone 7 - Consumer Rights 7th May 18 at 3:01 PM
    Hi All,

    I have an iPhone 7 which is 18 months old. It is currently in contract with EE. On saturday, it just stopped working completely. I took it back to Apple who tested it and said the ‘logic board’ had broken and no one would be able to repair the phone, it would only be a replacement. I have gone back to carphone warehouse who are not interested in helping at all. Apple have written a report for me that says the following: ‘this fault is not through any fault of the user and is a hardware issue. It appears to have been getting worse over a period of time due to battery performance. The user has done nothing wrong to affect this’.

    Where do I stand with this? Carphone are completely uninterested in helping and said all I can do is pay off my contract and get a new phone or just buy a new one outright. Any help would be great! Thanks everyone
Page 1
    • takman
    • By takman 7th May 18, 4:18 PM
    • 3,319 Posts
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    takman
    • #2
    • 7th May 18, 4:18 PM
    • #2
    • 7th May 18, 4:18 PM
    There is nothing you can do to make them give you a new phone. As it's more than 6 months since you bought the phone you would need a report that says the fault was inherent (There from when it was bought), the report doesn't say this.

    All the report says is that the phone has broken due to a hardware fault but that doesn't make them liable just because it wasn't your fault.
    • Browntoa
    • By Browntoa 7th May 18, 4:21 PM
    • 33,050 Posts
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    Browntoa
    • #3
    • 7th May 18, 4:21 PM
    • #3
    • 7th May 18, 4:21 PM
    Replacement is correct
    I'm the Board Guide of the Referrers ,Telephones, Pensions , Shop Don't drop ,over 50's and Discount Code boards which means I volunteer to help get your forum questions answered and keep the forum runnning smoothly .However, please remember, board guides don't read every post. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.
    • neilmcl
    • By neilmcl 7th May 18, 4:26 PM
    • 10,953 Posts
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    neilmcl
    • #4
    • 7th May 18, 4:26 PM
    • #4
    • 7th May 18, 4:26 PM
    There is nothing you can do to make them give you a new phone. As it's more than 6 months since you bought the phone you would need a report that says the fault was inherent (There from when it was bought), the report doesn't say this.

    All the report says is that the phone has broken due to a hardware fault but that doesn't make them liable just because it wasn't your fault.
    Originally posted by takman
    The reports from Apple says enough. You don't have to have a report using the actual words "inherent fault", so long as it implies that it it's down to manufacturing or design issue rather than user inflicted will be enough.

    OP, I'd send an LBA along with your "report" to CPW asking for a suitable remedy, ie, a replacement, as is your rights under the Consumer Rights Act 2015.
    • ididntgetwhereiamtoday
    • By ididntgetwhereiamtoday 7th May 18, 4:31 PM
    • 1,117 Posts
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    ididntgetwhereiamtoday
    • #5
    • 7th May 18, 4:31 PM
    • #5
    • 7th May 18, 4:31 PM
    Car phone warehouse are owned by Currys. So it is hardly surprising they do not want to know. I would persist with the consumer law angle. 18 months is not a reasonable life span for a high end smart phone.
    I didn't get where i am today by not reading moneysavingexpert.com
    • takman
    • By takman 7th May 18, 11:40 PM
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    takman
    • #6
    • 7th May 18, 11:40 PM
    • #6
    • 7th May 18, 11:40 PM
    The reports from Apple says enough. You don't have to have a report using the actual words "inherent fault", so long as it implies that it it's down to manufacturing or design issue rather than user inflicted will be enough.

    OP, I'd send an LBA along with your "report" to CPW asking for a suitable remedy, ie, a replacement, as is your rights under the Consumer Rights Act 2015.
    Originally posted by neilmcl
    But it doesn't imply that it was a manufacturing or design issue. It simply says the user is not at fault and has got worse over a period of time. Many things break earlier than expected due to no fault of the user but it doesn't mean it was manufactured wrong.
    • neilmcl
    • By neilmcl 8th May 18, 7:33 AM
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    neilmcl
    • #7
    • 8th May 18, 7:33 AM
    • #7
    • 8th May 18, 7:33 AM
    But it doesn't imply that it was a manufacturing or design issue. It simply says the user is not at fault and has got worse over a period of time. Many things break earlier than expected due to no fault of the user but it doesn't mean it was manufactured wrong.
    Originally posted by takman
    If something prematurely breaks down and it's not caused by the owner, whether it be excessive wear & tear or misuse then by default it's a manufacturing issue, either faulty item inherent to it's manufacture or design. It does not conform to contract, it fails the durability test, simple as!
    Last edited by neilmcl; 08-05-2018 at 7:37 AM.
    • shaun from Africa
    • By shaun from Africa 8th May 18, 9:32 AM
    • 9,960 Posts
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    shaun from Africa
    • #8
    • 8th May 18, 9:32 AM
    • #8
    • 8th May 18, 9:32 AM
    But it doesn't imply that it was a manufacturing or design issue. It simply says the user is not at fault and has got worse over a period of time. Many things break earlier than expected due to no fault of the user but it doesn't mean it was manufactured wrong.
    Originally posted by takman
    If something breaks earlier than expected and the user has done nothing wrong, how can it be anything other than a breach of contract?
    The quality of goods includes their state and condition; and the following aspects (among others) are in appropriate cases aspects of the quality of goods—

    (a) fitness for all the purposes for which goods of that kind are usually supplied;
    (b) appearance and finish;
    (c) freedom from minor defects;
    (d) safety;
    (e) durability.
    If something breaks easily during it's normal use it can't be classed as durable or fit for its intended purpose.
    • MEM62
    • By MEM62 8th May 18, 11:36 AM
    • 1,572 Posts
    • 1,193 Thanks
    MEM62
    • #9
    • 8th May 18, 11:36 AM
    • #9
    • 8th May 18, 11:36 AM
    I have an iPhone 7 which is 18 months old.
    Originally posted by Bakes1295
    On saturday, it just stopped working completely.
    Originally posted by Bakes1295
    Your phone is out of warranty as Apple only guarantee it for 12 months. Unless EE offered you some kind of enhanced warranty scheme (and it is unlikely that your airtime provider will offer any guarantee period that exceeds that offered by the phone's manufacturer) I cannot see what recourse you would expect.
    • takman
    • By takman 8th May 18, 11:53 AM
    • 3,319 Posts
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    takman
    If something prematurely breaks down and it's not caused by the owner, whether it be excessive wear & tear or misuse then by default it's a manufacturing issue, either faulty item inherent to it's manufacture or design. It does not conform to contract, it fails the durability test, simple as!
    Originally posted by neilmcl
    If something breaks earlier than expected and the user has done nothing wrong, how can it be anything other than a breach of contract?

    If something breaks easily during it's normal use it can't be classed as durable or fit for its intended purpose.
    Originally posted by shaun from Africa
    But who decides how long the phone should last and that it isn't durable. I'm not saying either of you are wrong i just haven't seen any cases where someone has got a refund simple because the item didn't last long enough (without any proof of an inherent fault).
    • pmduk
    • By pmduk 8th May 18, 11:58 AM
    • 8,339 Posts
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    pmduk
    You'll never get Apple to confirm in writing that the expected life of an iPhone battery is more than 12 months.
    • neilmcl
    • By neilmcl 8th May 18, 12:17 PM
    • 10,953 Posts
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    neilmcl
    Your phone is out of warranty as Apple only guarantee it for 12 months. Unless EE offered you some kind of enhanced warranty scheme (and it is unlikely that your airtime provider will offer any guarantee period that exceeds that offered by the phone's manufacturer) I cannot see what recourse you would expect.
    Originally posted by MEM62
    The recourse that's open to him under their statutory consumer rights!
    • neilmcl
    • By neilmcl 8th May 18, 12:21 PM
    • 10,953 Posts
    • 7,774 Thanks
    neilmcl
    But who decides how long the phone should last and that it isn't durable. I'm not saying either of you are wrong i just haven't seen any cases where someone has got a refund simple because the item didn't last long enough (without any proof of an inherent fault).
    Originally posted by takman
    In law it follows the reasonable person test, ie, what a reasonable person would expect the life expectancy of an item to be. A reasonable person would not expect an Iphone to break on it's own after only 18 months.

    Again, on the balance of probabilities there is sufficient "proof" that the fault is inherent in the absence of anything the user has done.
    Last edited by neilmcl; 08-05-2018 at 12:23 PM.
    • shaun from Africa
    • By shaun from Africa 8th May 18, 12:21 PM
    • 9,960 Posts
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    shaun from Africa
    I cannot see what recourse you would expect.
    Originally posted by MEM62
    A suitable recourse as provided by the Consumer rights act.

    You'll never get Apple to confirm in writing that the expected life of an iPhone battery is more than 12 months.
    Originally posted by pmduk
    But the OP stated that the main logic board is broken.
    Even if the battery was faulty, it shouldn't have caused this.

    But who decides how long the phone should last and that it isn't durable.
    Originally posted by takman
    Ultimately it would probably come down to a judge but I can't see any sensible person agreeing that a suitable life for a phone that probably cost in excess of £500 is only 18 months.
    • unholyangel
    • By unholyangel 8th May 18, 2:05 PM
    • 12,286 Posts
    • 9,621 Thanks
    unholyangel
    OP, contact EE - its them your contract is with (well unless you got a sim only deal from them and purchased the phone from CPW separately).
    Money doesn't solve poverty.....it creates it.
    • its_all_over
    • By its_all_over 8th May 18, 8:27 PM
    • 45 Posts
    • 22 Thanks
    its_all_over
    Hi All,

    I have an iPhone 7 which is 18 months old. It is currently in contract with EE. On saturday, it just stopped working completely. I took it back to Apple who tested it and said the ‘logic board’ had broken and no one would be able to repair the phone, it would only be a replacement. I have gone back to carphone warehouse who are not interested in helping at all. Apple have written a report for me that says the following: ‘this fault is not through any fault of the user and is a hardware issue. It appears to have been getting worse over a period of time due to battery performance. The user has done nothing wrong to affect this’.

    Where do I stand with this? Carphone are completely uninterested in helping and said all I can do is pay off my contract and get a new phone or just buy a new one outright. Any help would be great! Thanks everyone
    Originally posted by Bakes1295
    I think whoever you bought the phone from is reaponsible, if they won't help you then you would have to consider taking them to the small claim court. You would need to send a letter to the head office of whoever you bought the phone from and tell them if they won't fix your phone then you will be taking them to court. I think the letter is called a letter before action so if you google that or search on the forum you should find more information on what to say in the letter.
    • robatwork
    • By robatwork 9th May 18, 10:49 AM
    • 4,290 Posts
    • 4,697 Thanks
    robatwork
    As a matter of interest (and someone who has a 2 year old iphone6+ suffering from a "known problem" https://www.apple.com/uk/support/iphone6plus-multitouch/ )

    has the question of smartphone durability been tested in court?

    I would argue a phone with a £700 new value should last more than 2.5 years with normal usage, and the above is a design flaw. Are there any test cases?

    The OP is certainly on stronger ground than me to argue non-conformance given Apple are only admitting to my issue if the phone has been mistreated.
    • unholyangel
    • By unholyangel 9th May 18, 1:47 PM
    • 12,286 Posts
    • 9,621 Thanks
    unholyangel
    As a matter of interest (and someone who has a 2 year old iphone6+ suffering from a "known problem" https://www.apple.com/uk/support/iphone6plus-multitouch/ )

    has the question of smartphone durability been tested in court?

    I would argue a phone with a £700 new value should last more than 2.5 years with normal usage, and the above is a design flaw. Are there any test cases?

    The OP is certainly on stronger ground than me to argue non-conformance given Apple are only admitting to my issue if the phone has been mistreated.
    Originally posted by robatwork
    Its well below the small claims limit so if the point has been tested, the decision won't be binding.
    Money doesn't solve poverty.....it creates it.
    • Bakes1295
    • By Bakes1295 9th May 18, 4:20 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Bakes1295
    Hi All, thanks for your responses. Apple have confirmed that if they were the retailer they would be replacing this phone under consumer law, however Carphone Warehouse is the retailer. Additionally, I know some have mentioned about Durability and the subjective ness of what time is reasonable. The phone was sold on a 24 month contract so one would assume it would be reasonable for the phone to last the length of the contract?
    • unholyangel
    • By unholyangel 9th May 18, 6:26 PM
    • 12,286 Posts
    • 9,621 Thanks
    unholyangel
    Hi All, thanks for your responses. Apple have confirmed that if they were the retailer they would be replacing this phone under consumer law, however Carphone Warehouse is the retailer. Additionally, I know some have mentioned about Durability and the subjective ness of what time is reasonable. The phone was sold on a 24 month contract so one would assume it would be reasonable for the phone to last the length of the contract?
    Originally posted by Bakes1295
    So you purchased the phone separately from the sim?
    Money doesn't solve poverty.....it creates it.
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