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  • FIRST POST
    • Lunek
    • By Lunek 5th May 18, 9:16 PM
    • 40Posts
    • 5Thanks
    Lunek
    PLEASE HELP! Court Claim for residential parking fines!
    • #1
    • 5th May 18, 9:16 PM
    PLEASE HELP! Court Claim for residential parking fines! 5th May 18 at 9:16 PM
    Hello there,
    Iíve read the NEWBIES thread and other ones but couldnít see any similar situations.
    I received Court Claim Form for parking fines (UKPC)
    I live in a block of flats with private car park. You need the permit to park here. There are coded gates to the car park.
    My flat is from the council and when I moved in in 2016 I was told there was no permits for council tenants and that they were sorting it and I should get one within few weeks (in reality it took almost a year). I was told I will get fine if I park my car there and the same thing says in my tenancy agreement.
    I tried to keep my car elsewhere but sometimes I had no choice but to park in the car park because my children were very young at the time and often fell asleep in the car. Iím a single mum and thereís nowhere to park near my place.
    I received 5 fines in total which I ignored (I know...not wise!) Now I received Court Claim Form. I have acknowledged it online without writing any defence.
    I donít really know where to start and how I can defend myself in this case. I canít get any photos of the signage because UKPC is no longer in charge of this car park.
    I was thinking about settlement, offering them me paying for the permits from the day I moved in which would be 10 months of £25. But not sure it will work.
    Can someone Please give me some guidance ? I donít think I can handle it on my own !!!128584;
Page 4
    • Lunek
    • By Lunek 4th Aug 18, 8:19 PM
    • 40 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    Lunek
    Thanks for that but that doesn!!!8217;t give much help. I don!!!8217;t even know what I could possibly write in that witness statement. I!!!8217;ve just read my defence again and the only thing I can point out is the fact that I wasn!!!8217;t the driver of the vehicle. What proof or evidence can I possibly provide.
    The signage on the gate says: !!!8220;permit holders only!!!8221; and there was no permit on my car and my car got 6 invoices.
    The housing association completely ignored me.
    I!!!8217;m really stressed out.
    I need legal advice from someone who deals with those cases.
    • Johnersh
    • By Johnersh 4th Aug 18, 10:10 PM
    • 1,152 Posts
    • 2,185 Thanks
    Johnersh
    Now you have a copy of the sign what does it say. The postings on this forum are only as good as the info you provide.

    So insofar as I can tell, your case is:

    1. You weren't driving on ALL occasions that you were ticketed;
    2. You have no allocated parking space
    3. You were however promised a permit to parking the car park (and did eventually get one)
    4. You signed the tenancy agreement on the understanding that you would have a permit within 14 days.
    5. The PPC existed to enforce parking against non-residents and at all material times you were a resident.

    Nothing to say. Think again...
    "The best advice I ever got was that knowledge is power and to keep reading."
    DISCLAIMER: I post thoughts as & when they occur. I don't advise. You are your own person and decision-maker. I'm unlikely to respond to DMs seeking personal advice. It's ill-advised & you lose the benefit of a group "take" on events.
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 5th Aug 18, 7:07 AM
    • 2,981 Posts
    • 5,032 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    I need legal advice from someone who deals with those cases.
    Legal advice can only be given by those legally qualified AND authorised such the Law Society AND who you have paid for advice.

    As this can be expensive the next best thing is advice from people who have been here before and may be legally qualified. I'd pay close attention to Johnersh's advice above.
    If you want to win - avoid losing first. Here are a few examples
    1. Failing to Acknowledge or Defend https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5760415
    2. Template defences that say nothing https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5818671&page=5#86
    3. Forgetting about the Witness Statement
    • Lunek
    • By Lunek 9th Aug 18, 2:43 PM
    • 40 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    Lunek
    Thank you @johnersh.

    Your advice is much appreciated.

    I will try to put something together. It is just so time consuming as I can not understand most of the things that I am reading and having to translate it into my own language.
    And I have never been to court before and I am scared because I dont know what to expect, how to talk to them etc
    That is why I have been asking for proper help even if I have to pay for it.
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 9th Aug 18, 2:51 PM
    • 8,659 Posts
    • 8,575 Thanks
    KeithP
    This video may help:
    .
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 10th Aug 18, 6:42 AM
    • 2,981 Posts
    • 5,032 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    And I have never been to court before and I am scared because I dont know what to expect, how to talk to them etc
    If you need an interpreter, you can check to see if they will let you have one

    https://www.gov.uk/get-interpreter-at-court-or-tribunal

    Court at this level is very simple. You speak normally and it is just like a job interview. You'll be asked questions and you give your answer to the best of your knowledge.

    And like an interview you bring along paperwork to support what you are saying. People will believe you but they want the paperwork to confirm.
    If you want to win - avoid losing first. Here are a few examples
    1. Failing to Acknowledge or Defend https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5760415
    2. Template defences that say nothing https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5818671&page=5#86
    3. Forgetting about the Witness Statement
    • Lunek
    • By Lunek 14th Aug 18, 2:24 PM
    • 40 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    Lunek
    Hi. I have been researching some witness statements. Found a couple in newbies. Does it have to be long?
    Also if I say I was not the driver at all occasions do I have to explain that there was another driver on my car insurance? (I stated that in my defence) If so do I have to provide a proof of that?

    If I did not provide the name of the driver can UKPC bring this claim against the Registered Keeper by law?

    And if I say I was not the driver do I still have to argue with them about the signage and the fact that I was awaiting my permit?

    Thank you in advance
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 14th Aug 18, 5:23 PM
    • 9,968 Posts
    • 9,764 Thanks
    The Deep
    In residential cases, imo it is better for the person whose name is on the lease to fight the claim. Keepper identitiy is not an issue.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 14th Aug 18, 5:24 PM
    • 60,111 Posts
    • 73,232 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    If I did not provide the name of the driver can UKPC bring this claim against the Registered Keeper by law?
    Yes, you know that from the POFA 2012, linked in the NEWBIES thread.

    Please read the example WS in the NEWBIES thread, there are several, not just a couple.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Lunek
    • By Lunek 15th Aug 18, 1:17 AM
    • 40 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    Lunek
    Thank you for your responses.

    @Coupon-mad I know there is more than couple but only 2 are actually helpful in my case. A lot of them point out paragraphs from Claimants WS which I havent got yet.

    I would like to know whether it is relevant to mention in my WS about the poor signage? The problem is I dont have any photos apart from the ones that UKPC sent as a response to my SAR. They dont manage the car park anymore. Can I use theirs?

    Also Johnersh mentioned the issue with awaiting parking permit. Is that relevant in my case?

    Thanks and excuse all those questions. I am really trying to understand all this.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 15th Aug 18, 1:22 PM
    • 60,111 Posts
    • 73,232 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    I would like to know whether it is relevant to mention in my WS about the poor signage? The problem is I dont have any photos apart from the ones that UKPC sent as a response to my SAR. They dont manage the car park anymore. Can I use theirs?
    Yes, certainly.

    Also Johnersh mentioned the issue with awaiting parking permit. Is that relevant in my case?
    Yes, because your WS is your story, and that's part of it.

    Your WS is accompanied by evidence and other transcripts of similar court cases so read the ones hosted by the Parking Prankster online, like Pace v Noor, Link v Parkinson and Jopson v Homeguard.

    I mean read the transcripts now and understand how they were won.

    Then read Link v Blaney and see why Blaney (who used a 'lay rep'...) lost.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Lunek
    • By Lunek 16th Aug 18, 12:20 AM
    • 40 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    Lunek
    Thanks Coupon-mad. That is very helpful. I enjoyed reading them and understand it much better now. Pace v Lengyel explained very clearly about the signage.

    Yes, certainly.
    Do you mean I can use theirs?
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 16th Aug 18, 12:57 AM
    • 60,111 Posts
    • 73,232 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Yes you can use their own photos if they work in your favour/are blurred or tiny writing, which UKPC photos usually are.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

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