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  • FIRST POST
    • tazwhoever
    • By tazwhoever 30th Apr 18, 8:30 PM
    • 1,030Posts
    • 236Thanks
    tazwhoever
    Do I need a new PC?
    • #1
    • 30th Apr 18, 8:30 PM
    Do I need a new PC? 30th Apr 18 at 8:30 PM
    Have my PC since 2008, Windows 7 32bit home, MS Office 2010 running VM internet.

    Looking at the OS running life and age of PC, should I be thinking about upgrading my PC or let it run for few more years?

    Thanks
Page 4
    • EveryWhere
    • By EveryWhere 7th May 18, 6:40 AM
    • 1,025 Posts
    • 492 Thanks
    EveryWhere
    Looking at your specs although an SSD and bits will breathe a bit more life into it your processor might only be 1.8GHz so is relatively slow and so then becomes the bottleneck in your new system. It might actually work perfectly well for you but wanted to make you aware.

    What VM BB package do you have as the Network card is limited to 100Mbit max so if you have a faster VM service you will not benefit from it on this. I am not sure that many people really need much more than 100Mbit service anyway but just food for thought.



    Yes the Service Tag would be useful and allow us to get the original spec.

    However you have not included other things the OP would need in order to complete his upgrade. As a regular PC upgrader then you would maybe have these to hand but the OP won't therefore will need to have these on his shopping list too.

    1 - Sata Cable - to allow the new SSD to be hooked up to the MB as well as the existing Hard drive
    2 - Check to see if the power supply has an additional SATA power supply if not then get a SATA power splitter
    3 - A USB Drive or DVD of Windows 7 Home Premium 64bit to install a fresh.
    4 - A SSD to 3.5" tray adaptor so that your SSD is securely held in place.
    5 - Possibly a Torx screwdriver, some Dell\HPs have torx screws which make it a pain if you don't have the right tool
    6 - Compressed air - after 10 years there is going to be a lot of dust in the machine - give it a clean whilst you are it will give better cooling and cause the cooling fans to spin slower so it will be quieter

    None of which cost much money but without the first three you can't do your upgrade. I know if I was the OP then I would somewhat miffed to start my upgrade only to figure out I couldn't do it.

    His existing onboard card should also play quite a lot of the HD files, he has not reported a problem with it yet but again it depends on the codec used to compress the video file. A 20 graphics card will not play the latest H265 encoding either.
    Originally posted by ChuckMountain
    Seriously, you really need to stop with your tendency to overcomplicate things.
    No one asked about HEVC/4 k video, but here you are again, obfuscating.

    The OP will be able to do the upgrade with just the items I have mentioned earlier and actually it's a bit irritating trying to assist without having someone making irrelevant and incorrect comments over one's shoulder.

    Initially the OP will simply swap drives, so no need for extra cables and since SSD have no moving parts, there is no need for it to be "held securely in place". Waste of time and money. A loop of sticky tape will do it.

    Once again, they won't be limited to Windows 7 HP, but you don't appear capable of understanding that, since I've already stated it at least twice.
    Either way, media will be supplied as needed.

    So the initially upgrades need nothing more than stated. Quick and easy.
    Refitting the old HDD may need another cable or two, but that can be done later.

    Please stop with the voice of doom....it's annoying.

    your processor might only be 1.8GHz so is relatively slow and so then becomes the bottleneck in your new system
    So you don't know that it is the E2160, but yet once again you introduce the voice of negativity. You didn't even ask about the spec beforehand.
    Either way, for just over 30, it will be a noticable improvement over the current performance.
    • ChuckMountain
    • By ChuckMountain 7th May 18, 8:43 AM
    • 177 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    ChuckMountain
    Please stop with the voice of doom....it's annoying.
    Originally posted by EveryWhere
    Oh get over yourself already, this is not a personal dig, just another view
    You have given the OP some of the steps needed but you haven't given them all, its like telling somebody to fix their own boiler yet not telling the exact parts or that they should have certain tools.

    Seriously, you really need to stop with your tendency to overcomplicate things.
    Originally posted by EveryWhere
    No I am trying to be practical for somebody that has not attempted it before. Give them the right information. You have given him a link for the memory but not stated which ones he needs out of the long list. It might be obvious to you or I but not to somebody that does not know.

    No one asked about HEVC/4 k video, but here you are again, obfuscating.
    Originally posted by EveryWhere
    No one asked about HD video either, and he may well get away with playing some anyway with his current setup.

    The OP will be able to do the upgrade with just the items I have mentioned earlier and actually it's a bit irritating trying to assist without having someone making irrelevant and incorrect comments over one's shoulder.
    Originally posted by EveryWhere
    So you are the only person allowed to give advice now regardless of whether other people think it is good, bad or incomplete My comments are still very much relevant you might disagree but there you go.

    Initially the OP will simply swap drives, so no need for extra cables and since SSD have no moving parts, there is no need for it to be "held securely in place". Waste of time and money. A loop of sticky tape will do it.
    Originally posted by EveryWhere
    So at the point where OP wants to access old files he needs a cable. We don't know if the OP has velcro, again something you are assuming. What might seem like second nature to a PC upgrader is going to be a learning curve for a new person.

    Once again, they won't be limited to Windows 7 HP, but you don't appear capable of understanding that, since I've already stated it at least twice.
    Either way, media will be supplied as needed.
    Originally posted by EveryWhere
    Sorry you are going to need run that past me a third time. What do you not understand about a licence key being specific to a version of Windows i.e. if you are licensed for W7 Home Premium that is all you are going to get. If it was Vista then an upgrade doesn't make any difference to the key.

    How will media be supplied to the OP??

    If you buy Windows 7 Pro (or any other version) then fine you may well get media\download link but that is an additional cost.

    So the initially upgrades need nothing more than stated. Quick and easy.
    Refitting the old HDD may need another cable or two, but that can be done later.
    Originally posted by EveryWhere
    So why not mention that at the start. You need a new cable pretty quickly in the grand scheme of things to access the data on the old drive.

    OP you might want to have a look at this dusty video ....

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tWq2e6YY8I

    Another video showing you the inside (this one eventually confirms there is an additional power adaptor for the SATA connector so hopefully you don't need a splitter)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJYR4CBM4rE

    So you don't know that it is the E2160, but yet once again you introduce the voice of negativity. You didn't even ask about the spec beforehand.
    Either way, for just over 30, it will be a noticable improvement over the current performance.
    Originally posted by EveryWhere
    That was the standard spec at the time but I am trying to be realistic. It's still a ten year old machine with probably a slow processor
    Last edited by ChuckMountain; 07-05-2018 at 8:45 AM.
    • EveryWhere
    • By EveryWhere 7th May 18, 7:19 PM
    • 1,025 Posts
    • 492 Thanks
    EveryWhere
    I'm not going to quote the incredible load of waffle above.
    It has already been written that the OP will be guided step by step throughout the process.
    Giving a novice a mass of information all at once is not a good idea.

    Keep it simple. Step by step. BIOS update, install RAM, swap HDD for SSD, install Windows 7 Professional 64 bit using DELL media or equivalent.. Machine up and running.
    Re-connect old HDD, enable in BIOS etc

    Yes, the seller of RAM on eBay has different combos for sale. If the OP decides to go forward, then a discussion of which RAM to purchase can take place.
    Cheapest option in 2 x 1 GB for 3.99. Taking the RAM to 4 GB. Total spend for upgrade around 30.
    Of course they can install 6 GB or 8GB, but that is perhaps overkill for "homework and Internet".
    4GB together with SSD will make the machine a pleasure to use.

    Fit a 20 graphics card and the kids can plug the PC into a flat screen TV to watch high quality media via the TV.

    Step by step. No need to bombard with conjecture and negativity. The whole thing can be done in a day, even by a novice.
    • tazwhoever
    • By tazwhoever 7th May 18, 8:04 PM
    • 1,030 Posts
    • 236 Thanks
    tazwhoever
    Just had a look at refurbished desktops, are the three dell computers any good for the price? I price seems OK for the more up to date PC. Which is better?

    https://maximumcomputers.co.uk/shop/ssd-solid-state-drive-pcs/

    Thanks for all your advice so far.
    • EveryWhere
    • By EveryWhere 7th May 18, 8:48 PM
    • 1,025 Posts
    • 492 Thanks
    EveryWhere
    Just had a look at refurbished desktops, are the three dell computers any good for the price? I price seems OK for the more up to date PC. Which is better?

    https://maximumcomputers.co.uk/shop/ssd-solid-state-drive-pcs/

    Thanks for all your advice so far.
    Originally posted by tazwhoever

    No, no, no, no, no....

    They are not more up to date. Much the same as your PC, but with the upgrades that I have suggested.
    Your PC would be much the same with 30 worth of upgrades.

    Actually if you wanted 8GB of RAM and a 240 GB SSD, it set you back around 75 in total.
    But 4GB RAM and 120 GB SSD will be just fine for your usage.

    Example of PC in your link; https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Dell-Optiplex-780-Small-form-factor-CORE2QUAD-2-4GHz-8GIG-RAM-320GIG-HD-DVDRW/132606310088 50. Swap HDD with a 240 GB SSD cost 50 and you have the same thing for 100 in total. As opposed to 245.

    This is why you need to learn how to do these relatively simple jobs.
    • ChuckMountain
    • By ChuckMountain 8th May 18, 8:50 AM
    • 177 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    ChuckMountain
    I'm not going to quote the incredible load of waffle above.
    It has already been written that the OP will be guided step by step throughout the process.
    Giving a novice a mass of information all at once is not a good idea.
    Originally posted by EveryWhere
    And giving a novice incorrect advice really does not help the situation when they are asking why the heck it isn't working but go ahead I am sure you will get him there in the end.

    Keep it simple. Step by step. BIOS update, install RAM, swap HDD for SSD, install Windows 7 Professional 64 bit using DELL media or equivalent.. Machine up and running.
    Originally posted by tazwhoever
    No No No No, the first step in an upgrade should be a Backup ! Or are you going to explain how recovery of data works if something goes wrong which there is a chance that it will. If you are advocating not doing a backup then you should not be giving advice!

    Have my PC since 2008, Windows 7 32bit home, MS Office 2010 running VM internet.
    Thanks
    Originally posted by tazwhoever
    You seem to misunderstand the concept of Windows licencing.

    The OP has Home edition he does not have a Pro edition. You cannot use the same key for Home with a Pro media Dell or otherwise it does not work, it will not activate nor will it be licensed. Which bit do you not get? It would be like MS saying buy the cheapest key for Wiindows and use it with the media for the most expensive one.

    Yes, the seller of RAM on eBay has different combos for sale. If the OP decides to go forward, then a discussion of which RAM to purchase can take place.
    Cheapest option in 2 x 1 GB for 3.99. Taking the RAM to 4 GB. Total spend for upgrade around 30.
    Of course they can install 6 GB or 8GB, but that is perhaps overkill for "homework and Internet".
    4GB together with SSD will make the machine a pleasure to use.
    Originally posted by tazwhoever
    You need to check before recommending, might want to have a look at the service manual. The machine only has 2 memory slots so buying an additional 2 x 1GB won't work

    Step by step. No need to bombard with conjecture and negativity. The whole thing can be done in a day, even by a novice.
    Originally posted by tazwhoever
    It could however you forgot to tell them to buy a SATA cable, you got the Windows version wrong all of which would have added to the elapsed time of the build. No mention of drivers install which given they only supply Vista drivers\media on Dell still needs to be addressed.

    Prepare properly and spend less time going round in circles.

    Instead you seem to think that I am being negative and that you are the only person "qualified" to give advice and certainly don't like criticism when you are wrong !
    Last edited by ChuckMountain; 08-05-2018 at 9:06 AM.
    • ChuckMountain
    • By ChuckMountain 8th May 18, 9:27 AM
    • 177 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    ChuckMountain
    Just had a look at refurbished desktops, are the three dell computers any good for the price? I price seems OK for the more up to date PC. Which is better?

    https://maximumcomputers.co.uk/shop/ssd-solid-state-drive-pcs/

    Thanks for all your advice so far.
    Originally posted by tazwhoever
    For a similar price you could look at this, which is a newer model with a better processor (around 5 times better than your existing one on a CPU benchmark), with Windows 10 Pro and a years warranty.

    https://www.ebuyer.com/749209-refurbished-hp-elite-8200-sff-desktop-cb-pc-hp-8200-sff-i5-4-120ssd-w10pro
    • tazwhoever
    • By tazwhoever 8th May 18, 12:22 PM
    • 1,030 Posts
    • 236 Thanks
    tazwhoever
    Thanks Everywhere, I would go down to reasonable repair person. Ask him for the SSD 120GB, 4GB ram, etc from Amazon (any suggestions)?. Is there anything else I might need?

    Would the computer be up to installing Windows 10 later in future?

    Been looking at cloning HDD to SDD...I just want to transfer all information from HDD to SDD, then take out the HDD. I don't to reinstall applications, data, etc.

    Is there free cloning software that I could suggest to the repair person. I guess he would be aware, but asking for your advice.

    Thanks to the posters for your advice so far - #71 still counting!!!
    • ChuckMountain
    • By ChuckMountain 8th May 18, 12:48 PM
    • 177 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    ChuckMountain
    Thanks Everywhere, I would go down to reasonable repair person. Ask him for the SSD 120GB, 4GB ram, etc from Amazon (any suggestions)?. Is there anything else I might need?
    Originally posted by tazwhoever
    Being negative again Your local repair person will know how to upgrade your PC but they probably will want to source their own parts and they need to make a living from it so might well end up charging you between 50 and 100 labour on top of parts, which might not be as cheap as Amazon. They are providing a service so they need to guarantee that it will work afterwards.

    Check with them first as they would normally give you a quote.

    You might find it cheaper to buy a new\refurb PC in that case.

    Would the computer be up to installing Windows 10 later in future?
    Originally posted by tazwhoever
    Some people have upgraded it looking on the Internet but it is a case for hunting for the drivers and making sure that everything works correctly.

    Been looking at cloning HDD to SDD...I just want to transfer all information from HDD to SDD, then take out the HDD. I don't to reinstall applications, data, etc.

    Is there free cloning software that I could suggest to the repair person. I guess he would be aware, but asking for your advice.

    Thanks to the posters for your advice so far - #71 still counting!!!
    Originally posted by tazwhoever
    The repair person should be able to offer the complete service for you if you want.

    Cloning can be either done with relatively cheap hardware or software

    Software here (will work with USB2)

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/CORSAIR-CSSD-UPGRADEKIT-cloning-USB3-0-migration/dp/B00CI8MT9W/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1525779150&sr=8-1&keywords=hard+drive+clone+software

    Hardware option here

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/iDsonix%C2%AE-2-5-inch-3-5-inch-Dual-Disk-Function/dp/B00L3W0F40/ref=sr_1_19?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1525779807&sr= 1-19&keywords=hard+drive+clone

    Usually depending on the model you have to at least the same size SSD as the hard drive. This can push the price up as you possibly had a 320GB hard drive. You would need to buy at least the equivalent SSD.

    Software like this solves the problem

    https://www.easeus.com/partition-master/clone-larger-hdd-to-smaller-ssd.html

    If you are installing Windows for scratch you don't have this issue so can get away with a smaller SSD.
    • AndyPix
    • By AndyPix 8th May 18, 1:15 PM
    • 3,958 Posts
    • 3,337 Thanks
    AndyPix
    You seem to misunderstand the concept of Windows licencing.

    The OP has Home edition he does not have a Pro edition. You cannot use the same key for Home with a Pro media Dell or otherwise it does not work, it will not activate nor will it be licensed. Which bit do you not get?
    Originally posted by ChuckMountain
    I think it is you who are misunderstanding the concept of what Everywhere is trying to tell you ..


    Which bit did you not get ??

    The clue is in the BIOS update
    Last edited by AndyPix; 08-05-2018 at 1:18 PM.
    Running with scissors since 1978
    • ChuckMountain
    • By ChuckMountain 8th May 18, 1:33 PM
    • 177 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    ChuckMountain
    I would apply the latest firmware, to be found here and then clean install with one of these;



    I'm sure someone will lend you their copy for free.
    Originally posted by EveryWhere
    You still need a licence\product key for this software, if you have got Windows 7 Home licence this is not the same. It will more than likely prompt for you a licence key as part of the reinstall unless the bios patch is doing something untoward.

    I think it is you who are misunderstanding the concept of what Everywhere is trying to tell you ..

    Which bit did you not get ??

    The clue is in the BIOS update
    Originally posted by AndyPix
    Nope sorry not getting it.

    Bios upgrade or not, please tell me how you legally migrate from a Home version of Windows OS to Professional or other higher version, without buying a legitimate licence?
    Last edited by ChuckMountain; 08-05-2018 at 1:36 PM.
    • AndyPix
    • By AndyPix 8th May 18, 1:41 PM
    • 3,958 Posts
    • 3,337 Thanks
    AndyPix
    Dell stopped using license keys and instead all that is needed for OEM activation is baked into the BIOS ..


    Ill let you work the rest out for yourself
    Last edited by AndyPix; 08-05-2018 at 1:45 PM. Reason: cant spell
    Running with scissors since 1978
    • ChuckMountain
    • By ChuckMountain 8th May 18, 2:08 PM
    • 177 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    ChuckMountain
    Dell stopped using license keys and instead all that is needed for OEM activation is baked into the BIOS ..

    Ill let you work the rest out for yourself
    Originally posted by AndyPix
    All major vendors stopped using licence keys in their software as licencing was tied to the PCs, that is not the point.

    For every machine they will ship with an OEM licence Dell\HP etc. will pay Microsoft for the given version. That does not give the new owner rights to upgrade to newer (except for Win 10 upgrade program) or higher tier versions of the same operating system.

    Yes you might be able to get a disc for a Windows 7 Pro reinstallation from a friend or off the bay and possibly with a bios update it might work if this particular machine supported oem activation.

    However Dell nor the OP have paid for an upgrade therefore it would be an unlicensed copy. Possibly activated but again no legitimate licence.

    Please tell me how this is not software piracy!
    • AndyPix
    • By AndyPix 8th May 18, 2:15 PM
    • 3,958 Posts
    • 3,337 Thanks
    AndyPix
    All major vendors stopped using licence keys in their software as licencing was tied to the PCs, that is not the point.!
    Originally posted by ChuckMountain

    Sorry - you sound like you're trying to teach me about this stuff ???
    Windows licensing was always tied to an OEM PC - key or not


    As I said - I'll let you work the rest out for yourself

    You are very wordy - likely confusing the OP no end.
    Simple clear steps have been layed out for a decent pain free upgrade to his/her system
    Last edited by AndyPix; 08-05-2018 at 2:22 PM.
    Running with scissors since 1978
    • ChuckMountain
    • By ChuckMountain 8th May 18, 2:20 PM
    • 177 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    ChuckMountain
    Sorry - you sound like you're trying to teach me about this stuff ???


    You are very wordy - likely confusing the OP no end.
    Simple clear steps have been layed out for a decent pain free upgrade to his/her system


    As I said - I'll let you work the rest out for yourself
    Originally posted by AndyPix
    Simple question which you seem unable to answer.

    How does somebody legally upgrade a Windows version to a higher tier?
    • AndyPix
    • By AndyPix 8th May 18, 2:34 PM
    • 3,958 Posts
    • 3,337 Thanks
    AndyPix
    Simple question which you seem unable to answer.

    How does somebody legally upgrade a Windows version to a higher tier?
    Originally posted by ChuckMountain

    One last time ...


    I'll let you work the rest out for yourself
    Running with scissors since 1978
    • ChuckMountain
    • By ChuckMountain 8th May 18, 2:39 PM
    • 177 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    ChuckMountain
    One last time ...


    I'll let you work the rest out for yourself
    Originally posted by AndyPix
    So in other words, as you don't need to be taught anything, you either don't want to admit you don't know or admit the early suggestion was not legal from a software licensing point of view.
    • AndyPix
    • By AndyPix 8th May 18, 2:52 PM
    • 3,958 Posts
    • 3,337 Thanks
    AndyPix
    Go away and learn about the concept that is going on here - and why it is possible


    Instead of being all "microsoft policey"
    Running with scissors since 1978
    • ChuckMountain
    • By ChuckMountain 8th May 18, 3:00 PM
    • 177 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    ChuckMountain
    No, it's a free forum. I am well aware of what is going here.

    If you choose to condone software piracy that's your prerogative but must point out its against the rules of these forums.

    I'll let you work the rest out for yourself
    • AndyPix
    • By AndyPix 8th May 18, 3:12 PM
    • 3,958 Posts
    • 3,337 Thanks
    AndyPix
    Ok ill switch that on you ..


    If you are "well aware of what's going on" - then how come a bios update allows a different version of windows to be installed ? Fully legally i might add


    Whats the deal there - presuming you're well aware of course


    BTW im well aware of furum rules - thanks though
    Running with scissors since 1978
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