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  • FIRST POST
    • AdamPD
    • By AdamPD 15th Apr 18, 8:29 AM
    • 85Posts
    • 17Thanks
    AdamPD
    When sharing the expenses 50/50, isn't 50/50.
    • #1
    • 15th Apr 18, 8:29 AM
    When sharing the expenses 50/50, isn't 50/50. 15th Apr 18 at 8:29 AM
    Hi all,

    So I co own my home with my father, we split the bills 50/50, although there have been numerous times my father has "accidentally" charged me more for a bill and pocketed the cash for himself, so I make a point of going over what we have coming in, vs going out.

    We have lodgers in our home to take care of all the bills and mortgage.

    The problem I'm faced with right now and it's been an issue for a while, is when an item of expense, such as an appliance, needs to be replaced.

    When an appliance is coming to the end of it's life, I replace it before it breaks down, because we have lodgers, they need to be able to wash their clothes, cook their meals and of course keep their food frozen/fresh in the fridge freezers they each have.

    So I've basically been the one who's bought ALL the appliances in the house, the oven, the dishwasher, the washing machine, the tumble dryer, the two fridge freezers for the lodgers and my dad didn't offer to pay anything towards the cost of any of them.

    And anytime he does offer to replace something that's broken down completely, he always buys it as cheap as possible and rarely, if ever, brand new, it's always second hand crap that's dented/damaged and never lasts more than a few months.

    So now our washing machine's bearings are going, it's 8 years old, is used by 4 people, so it has done pretty well.

    But it cost me around 700 and I've mentioned four times now that it needs to be replaced, but he hasn't offered to buy one, or asked me to help him buy one, he just shrugs it off.

    And I know what's going to happen, it will break down, like the fridge freezer and he will go and spend 100 on a defunct, damaged one from a local shop which deals with damaged second hand goods, then it will last 6 months, tops a year, then he'll expect me to buy the next one.

    It just drives me nuts.
Page 1
    • Artytarty
    • By Artytarty 15th Apr 18, 8:34 AM
    • 2,159 Posts
    • 4,770 Thanks
    Artytarty
    • #2
    • 15th Apr 18, 8:34 AM
    • #2
    • 15th Apr 18, 8:34 AM
    Dad, I need you to give me 450 towards the new washing machine!!!

    Or set up an account with direct debits every month from each of you to cover such expenses.
    This situation is grossly unfair and it sounds like your father is taking advantage of your softer nature and more cautious and sensible attitude.
    Last edited by Artytarty; 15-04-2018 at 8:51 AM.
    Norn Iron Club member 473
    • Detroit
    • By Detroit 15th Apr 18, 8:48 AM
    • 748 Posts
    • 2,330 Thanks
    Detroit
    • #3
    • 15th Apr 18, 8:48 AM
    • #3
    • 15th Apr 18, 8:48 AM
    You need to sit down with your father and have a formal discussion about how you're going to manage your joint responsibilities as landlords.

    While it may seem domestic between you and your father, it is actually a business where you are charging people for a service. A professional approach should be taken.

    At the end of your discussion, you need to agree on:

    1.What facilities you are providing your lodgers

    2.What standard of facilities you will offer, which can be reflected in their payments

    3.How expenses will be financed between you any your father. Does it have to be 50/50 if your father can't afford the standards you agree upon? Could you pay more for a greater return?

    It may be helpful to actually get this down on paper to focus your thoughts.

    It seems the two of you have very different approaches to this at present, and problems are occurring every time it comes up, with you doing what you think is right, and your father the same, then getting frustrated when the other doesn't want to go along with it.

    It needs to be agreed properly, if only for the benefit of your lodgers who are entitled to a consistent approach to the facilities they are paying for.


    Put your hands up.
    • Tabbytabitha
    • By Tabbytabitha 15th Apr 18, 9:15 AM
    • 1,960 Posts
    • 3,297 Thanks
    Tabbytabitha
    • #4
    • 15th Apr 18, 9:15 AM
    • #4
    • 15th Apr 18, 9:15 AM
    I'd compromise on the cost of the equipment if you want him to go half - second hand at 100 is inadequate but 700 for a new washing machine is unnecessarily expensive. At least try to get him to pay 130/150 as half of a typical machine - if you choose to pay top dollar it's unreasonable to expect him to pay half so you should make up the difference.
    • ognum
    • By ognum 15th Apr 18, 9:25 AM
    • 4,554 Posts
    • 6,960 Thanks
    ognum
    • #5
    • 15th Apr 18, 9:25 AM
    • #5
    • 15th Apr 18, 9:25 AM
    When the rent is paid you should have a replacement / repair account and t his should be topped up each month so that you don!!!8217;t need to discuss who pays the joint repair account pays!
    • Ilona
    • By Ilona 15th Apr 18, 9:30 AM
    • 2,055 Posts
    • 7,066 Thanks
    Ilona
    • #6
    • 15th Apr 18, 9:30 AM
    • #6
    • 15th Apr 18, 9:30 AM
    Agree with Detroit, your home is a business, you and your father are joint directors. Your income comes from lodgers so if it is meant to cover all outgoing expenses you need to keep account books. There should be a business bank account where all money in and out is recorded. Any money spent on updating appliances should be discussed between the two of you and a price agreed before the item is bought. That's how I see it.

    Ilona
    I love skip diving
    • pinkshoes
    • By pinkshoes 15th Apr 18, 9:32 AM
    • 15,676 Posts
    • 21,492 Thanks
    pinkshoes
    • #7
    • 15th Apr 18, 9:32 AM
    • #7
    • 15th Apr 18, 9:32 AM
    You need to sit down and set up a maintenance budget for daily, weekly, monthly and yearly expenses.

    e.g. Washing machine 500 every 7 years, freezer 300 every 10 years, toilet roll 4/week.

    List ALL items that are used in a spreadsheet, decide between you costs and realistic life spans, then work out on average how much per MONTH this will cost. Put this money into a separate account e.g. Both pay 40/month.

    I suggest YOU manage it.
    Should've = Should HAVE (not 'of')
    Would've = Would HAVE (not 'of')

    No, I am not perfect, but yes I do judge people on their use of basic English language. If you didn't know the above, then learn it! (If English is your second language, then you are forgiven!)
    • Pixie5740
    • By Pixie5740 15th Apr 18, 3:12 PM
    • 11,928 Posts
    • 16,795 Thanks
    Pixie5740
    • #8
    • 15th Apr 18, 3:12 PM
    • #8
    • 15th Apr 18, 3:12 PM
    You have multiple threads about the issues you have living with your father. Why don't you just sell the property and go your separate ways? IIRC part of the mortgage is interest only so unless you've got a plan to repay the capital you'll be forced to sell eventually anyway.
    • cjdavies
    • By cjdavies 15th Apr 18, 4:14 PM
    • 3,226 Posts
    • 3,442 Thanks
    cjdavies
    • #9
    • 15th Apr 18, 4:14 PM
    • #9
    • 15th Apr 18, 4:14 PM
    I knew this sorted too familiar:
    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5741798

    Best off selling.

    As a quick check there are 71 washing machines brand new in Currys under 300.
    Last edited by cjdavies; 15-04-2018 at 4:20 PM.
    • AdamPD
    • By AdamPD 15th Apr 18, 5:08 PM
    • 85 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    AdamPD
    You have multiple threads about the issues you have living with your father. Why don't you just sell the property and go your separate ways? IIRC part of the mortgage is interest only so unless you've got a plan to repay the capital you'll be forced to sell eventually anyway.
    Originally posted by Pixie5740
    I know, I'm just trying to make it work here you know? I don't want to sell because when he dies (IF he eventually gets his will sorted), his share will pass to me.

    This house was bought for 180k and the estimate of it's value now is almost 300k.

    So it'll be an investment at the end of the day

    I'm hoping to remortgage next year when I have 3 years of self employment books/accounts behind me, because I'll have enough (hopefully) to remortgage and remove both of them (legally I should say!)

    I'll have to strike up a deal with him and the uncle to remove them I'm sure, but if they aren't interested, then yea, I'll push to sell.

    Many thanks for the advice and support from you all, though.
    • AdamPD
    • By AdamPD 15th Apr 18, 5:41 PM
    • 85 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    AdamPD
    But as far as selling goes, he won't want to sell, because that means he will have to get a flat and pay the bills by himself.

    He's grown accustomed to having lodgers paying all his bills for him.
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 15th Apr 18, 5:42 PM
    • 29,120 Posts
    • 74,433 Thanks
    Mojisola
    You need to sit down and set up a maintenance budget for daily, weekly, monthly and yearly expenses.

    e.g. Washing machine 500 every 7 years, freezer 300 every 10 years, toilet roll 4/week.

    List ALL items that are used in a spreadsheet, decide between you costs and realistic life spans, then work out on average how much per MONTH this will cost. Put this money into a separate account e.g. Both pay 40/month.

    I suggest YOU manage it.
    Originally posted by pinkshoes
    If neither of you want to sell up and go your own way, this has to be the answer.
    • AdamPD
    • By AdamPD 15th Apr 18, 5:52 PM
    • 85 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    AdamPD
    Would a financial advisor or company be able to handle that kind of thing? or does it have to be done by the individual? (Working out costs per month and income etc)

    The only reason I let my dad handle the finances is because I am dyslexic, so I am terrible with things like that, I genuinely get really overwhelmed with it.
    • BorisThomson
    • By BorisThomson 15th Apr 18, 6:07 PM
    • 1,502 Posts
    • 3,168 Thanks
    BorisThomson
    I know, I'm just trying to make it work here you know? I don't want to sell because when he dies (IF he eventually gets his will sorted), his share will pass to me.

    This house was bought for 180k and the estimate of it's value now is almost 300k.

    So it'll be an investment at the end of the day.
    Originally posted by AdamPD
    So you want his money when he dies but you also want his money now.

    I'd suggest Dad pays more now, and then leaves his estate to somewhere more grateful.
    • AdamPD
    • By AdamPD 15th Apr 18, 6:11 PM
    • 85 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    AdamPD
    So you want his money when he dies but you also want his money now.

    I'd suggest Dad pays more now, and then leaves his estate to somewhere more grateful.
    Originally posted by BorisThomson
    I'm not that cold, but right now it is a business as others have said.

    IF I can get the house solely in my name next year, he won't have to worry about paying any bills or anything towards maintenance, he will be able to live there indefinitely for free.

    But as it stands right now, I'm the only one paying for all the big expenses in this house, including a boiler which has to be replaced this year, because it's got rust in the containment/heating vessel (I forget the proper term), to which he hasn't offered anything towards.

    Plus 1/3rd of the house still belongs to my uncle, who moved out 5-6 years ago and left us with a mortgage debt/damaged credit.
    • NeilCr
    • By NeilCr 15th Apr 18, 6:17 PM
    • 1,549 Posts
    • 2,036 Thanks
    NeilCr
    To be honest, this is more about your communication issues with your dad than anything else. It's been going on for a while (from your posts) and nothing changes.

    Looks like you need mediation of some sort (is there a friend/relation who could do that) as opposed to bringing in someone from "outside" who is more likely to make it worse.
    • AdamPD
    • By AdamPD 15th Apr 18, 6:19 PM
    • 85 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    AdamPD
    To be honest, this is more about your communication issues with your dad than anything else. It's been going on for a while (from your posts) and nothing changes.

    Looks like you need mediation of some sort (is there a friend/relation who could do that) as opposed to bringing in someone from "outside" who is more likely to make it worse.
    Originally posted by NeilCr
    Yea I agree, I don't like conflict, so I just go along with it, but it's times like this it escalates because something needs replacing that's expensive.
    • Pixie5740
    • By Pixie5740 16th Apr 18, 10:43 AM
    • 11,928 Posts
    • 16,795 Thanks
    Pixie5740
    I know, I'm just trying to make it work here you know? I don't want to sell because when he dies (IF he eventually gets his will sorted), his share will pass to me.

    This house was bought for 180k and the estimate of it's value now is almost 300k.

    So it'll be an investment at the end of the day

    I'm hoping to remortgage next year when I have 3 years of self employment books/accounts behind me, because I'll have enough (hopefully) to remortgage and remove both of them (legally I should say!)

    I'll have to strike up a deal with him and the uncle to remove them I'm sure, but if they aren't interested, then yea, I'll push to sell.

    Many thanks for the advice and support from you all, though.
    Originally posted by AdamPD
    No I don't know. What I do know is that the property I own, the property I live in is my home not an investment, and I share it with people that I not only like but love as well.

    You don't like living with lodgers and you don't seem to particularly like living with your father. Is the money that you think you might eventually get worth it? Getting a mortgage whilst using equity gifted from someone who will continue to live in the property will be tricky. There's also Capital Gains Tax to consider as you have more than one lodger living there at the same time.
    • AdamPD
    • By AdamPD 16th Apr 18, 10:47 AM
    • 85 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    AdamPD
    There's a lot to factor in, I know, but we/I need to remortgage, because we have one of those odd half interest, half repayment mortgages, so in 10 years or so, only half the mortgage will have been paid off.

    I don't consider this a home, for the simple reason other people live here that are effectively strangers to me, we have two lodgers in two room, we have no lounge area to relax in, just our bedrooms.

    I don't know anymore, I can't sell and get my own place because it's just too expensive to buy here now and there's the complication that my uncle will get a third of any equity in the property, despite not adding anything to it and leaving us in debt.

    It's just a mess.
    • NBLondon
    • By NBLondon 16th Apr 18, 2:08 PM
    • 1,717 Posts
    • 8,402 Thanks
    NBLondon
    Have you considered taking out a large life insurance policy on Dad and Uncle - and then inviting them on a walk along Beachy Head?
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