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  • FIRST POST
    • melb
    • By melb 13th Apr 18, 2:56 PM
    • 2,576Posts
    • 957Thanks
    melb
    Pulling out of tenancy agreement before moving in
    • #1
    • 13th Apr 18, 2:56 PM
    Pulling out of tenancy agreement before moving in 13th Apr 18 at 2:56 PM
    hi there my 18 year old daughter has signed a 12 month tenancy on a flat she didn't view beforehand.

    The flat is not as described - not unsafe but filthy. it was described as smart and well-presented and the photos looked lovely.

    The landlady is washing her hands and saying it is up to our daughter to clean it.

    Is there any way of getting out of this agreement? I saw something online about some cooling off period if the tenancy agreement was signed before viewing the property. This is on the Landlord Blog website:-

    "I am afraid tenants do not get a cooling off period unless the property was rented without being viewed first (as happens with some student lets)"

    also I saw somewhere that if the tenancy agreement is signed online this can be a reason to cancel.

    Please no lectures - she is a very headstrong 18 year old and is learning lessons the hard way but i would really appreciate any advice.

    Obviously she will have to forfeit some of the monies already paid (300 referencing fees, 650 deposit plus first months rent so far) but the place is no better than a flop-house - the communal areas have not been cleaned for years.

    I just want to help her to try and extricate herself asap. There is no break clause in the tenancy agreement although the Landlord can give two months notice but not the tenant by the look of it.

    thank
Page 1
    • hazyjo
    • By hazyjo 13th Apr 18, 4:30 PM
    • 10,353 Posts
    • 13,417 Thanks
    hazyjo
    • #2
    • 13th Apr 18, 4:30 PM
    • #2
    • 13th Apr 18, 4:30 PM
    They're prob/obviously old photos. Take dated photos when she moves in. Leave it in the same condition upon exit.


    Dirt? Really? Can she not clean or get someone in for half a day? Strange reason to want to cancel the tenancy.
    2018 wins: Single Malt Whisky; theatre tickets; festival tickets; year of gin(!); shoes
    • G_M
    • By G_M 13th Apr 18, 4:40 PM
    • 43,838 Posts
    • 51,818 Thanks
    G_M
    • #3
    • 13th Apr 18, 4:40 PM
    • #3
    • 13th Apr 18, 4:40 PM
    What does she want?

    * to move in but force the LL to clean?
    * to move in but not have to clean it herself?
    * not to move in because she does not want to clean?
    * not to move in for some other reason and use the dirt as an excuse?
    * something else?

    Until she moves in, there is no tenancy. But there IS a contact. I've ever heard of the no "cooling off period unless the property was rented without being viewed first" - but if one party (ie landlady) breaches a fundameental term of the contract it could be rescinded. I doubt dirt constitutes a fundemental term.

    I'd suggest she
    * take dated hotos
    * ensure the inventory (if provided) clearly& accurately describes the state of the property
    * if it does not, amends the inventory herself before signing, and keeps a copy
    * pays a cleaner/cleaning company to clean the prooperty
    * sends the bill, with a polite friendly covering letter, asking the LL to re-imburse her
    * if the LL refuses/does not answer, puts it down to experience.
    • melb
    • By melb 13th Apr 18, 6:13 PM
    • 2,576 Posts
    • 957 Thanks
    melb
    • #4
    • 13th Apr 18, 6:13 PM
    • #4
    • 13th Apr 18, 6:13 PM
    if a flat is advertised with photos showing curtains at windows would you reasonably assume that when you move in the curtains would still be there?

    If the letting agent tells you on the phone when you ask what is included with the rental "it's just as you see it in the photos" but then once you have signed up says that because the curtains weren't mentioned in the description then they won't be included (even though one set is still there but hanging off a pole which is hanging off the wall?)

    If they now say that the property is unfurnished (which wasn't specified in the description and the photos gave the impression of a furnished property) why are there a settee, bed, wardrobe plus various tables etc in the flat?

    Can the letting agent lie with impunity? The oven is way dirtier than anything i have seen in my life. I am pretty sure the previous tenant will have had a sizeable amount taken off their deposit to cover this and other cleaning.

    Who is responsible for cleaning the communal areas in a house sub-divided into about 3 or 4 flats? In the Tenancy agreement it says the landlord but it is filthy and the letting agent has quoted the landlord as saying that each flat owner should hoover outside their own front door. So that will be a nice clean square metre outside each door and the stairs will remain a health hazard
    • JennyP
    • By JennyP 13th Apr 18, 6:25 PM
    • 857 Posts
    • 582 Thanks
    JennyP
    • #5
    • 13th Apr 18, 6:25 PM
    • #5
    • 13th Apr 18, 6:25 PM
    IMHO, the biggest issue is that none of this bodes well for them being a decent landlord. Who knows what other problems there'll be if she does move in.
    • Slithery
    • By Slithery 13th Apr 18, 6:27 PM
    • 666 Posts
    • 1,030 Thanks
    Slithery
    • #6
    • 13th Apr 18, 6:27 PM
    • #6
    • 13th Apr 18, 6:27 PM
    @melb

    You failed to answer G_M's question.
    • melb
    • By melb 13th Apr 18, 6:27 PM
    • 2,576 Posts
    • 957 Thanks
    melb
    • #7
    • 13th Apr 18, 6:27 PM
    • #7
    • 13th Apr 18, 6:27 PM
    I know that's how I feel
    • gingercordial
    • By gingercordial 13th Apr 18, 6:49 PM
    • 1,131 Posts
    • 1,173 Thanks
    gingercordial
    • #8
    • 13th Apr 18, 6:49 PM
    • #8
    • 13th Apr 18, 6:49 PM
    hi there my 18 year old daughter has signed a 12 month tenancy on a flat she didn't view beforehand.

    The flat is not as described - not unsafe but filthy. it was described as smart and well-presented and the photos looked lovely.

    The landlady is washing her hands and saying it is up to our daughter to clean it.

    Is there any way of getting out of this agreement? I saw something online about some cooling off period if the tenancy agreement was signed before viewing the property. This is on the Landlord Blog website:-

    "I am afraid tenants do not get a cooling off period unless the property was rented without being viewed first (as happens with some student lets)"

    also I saw somewhere that if the tenancy agreement is signed online this can be a reason to cancel.

    Please no lectures - she is a very headstrong 18 year old and is learning lessons the hard way but i would really appreciate any advice.

    Obviously she will have to forfeit some of the monies already paid (300 referencing fees, 650 deposit plus first months rent so far) but the place is no better than a flop-house - the communal areas have not been cleaned for years.

    I just want to help her to try and extricate herself asap. There is no break clause in the tenancy agreement although the Landlord can give two months notice but not the tenant by the look of it.

    thank
    Originally posted by melb
    No matter how dirty it is, surely it would be cheaper to hire a cleaning company to do a day's deep clean than to lose out on all of that? That's assuming she doesn't fancy tackling it herself.

    She may then find it is not so bad after all.
    • melb
    • By melb 13th Apr 18, 7:06 PM
    • 2,576 Posts
    • 957 Thanks
    melb
    • #9
    • 13th Apr 18, 7:06 PM
    • #9
    • 13th Apr 18, 7:06 PM
    I know we will do the cleaning. I don't like anybody being stitched up and lied to though - whether it's a member of my family or anyone else.
    • Slithery
    • By Slithery 13th Apr 18, 7:16 PM
    • 666 Posts
    • 1,030 Thanks
    Slithery
    I know we will do the cleaning. I don't like anybody being stitched up and lied to though - whether it's a member of my family or anyone else.
    Originally posted by melb
    Well that's the risk you take when you sign up for a property without even viewing it first. Be grateful that this is your only issue and that you haven't been scammed out of a grand by someone who doesn't even own the property.

    So does she want the property or not? In the first post you said no but now you're saying that you'll do the cleaning???
    • HampshireH
    • By HampshireH 13th Apr 18, 7:30 PM
    • 570 Posts
    • 582 Thanks
    HampshireH
    Unless specified as furnished properties are generally let unfinished. If your not happy with the items being there put in writing a request for them to be removed as per the advert

    Photos are generally taken whilst occupants are there. Look on rightmove many properties have stuff in. It doesn't mean they come with it.

    Do you have a link to the advert? Would be interesting to see.

    I assume she has an accurate inventory for her moving In? Obviously photos too.

    Big lesson learnt.

    Sounds like the estate agent could be just handling the rent side of things and not the maintenance? What does the tenancy say?

    It will either say, furnished, part furnished or unfinished and then the inventory will reflect this.

    Goodluck!
    • Annie35
    • By Annie35 13th Apr 18, 7:40 PM
    • 215 Posts
    • 184 Thanks
    Annie35
    Be grateful that this is your only issue and that you haven't been scammed out of a grand by someone who doesn't even own the property.?
    Originally posted by Slithery
    Ooh slithery, I watched exactly that unfold on a fb site last night, can't stop thinking about it

    OP, have a read through the tenancy agreement they often have clauses where by you can leave early if you pay re letting fees & rent for vacant period. If it doesn't ask the agency anyway.
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 13th Apr 18, 9:14 PM
    • 4,175 Posts
    • 5,874 Thanks
    Cakeguts
    if a flat is advertised with photos showing curtains at windows would you reasonably assume that when you move in the curtains would still be there?

    If the letting agent tells you on the phone when you ask what is included with the rental "it's just as you see it in the photos" but then once you have signed up says that because the curtains weren't mentioned in the description then they won't be included (even though one set is still there but hanging off a pole which is hanging off the wall?)

    If they now say that the property is unfurnished (which wasn't specified in the description and the photos gave the impression of a furnished property) why are there a settee, bed, wardrobe plus various tables etc in the flat?

    Can the letting agent lie with impunity? The oven is way dirtier than anything i have seen in my life. I am pretty sure the previous tenant will have had a sizeable amount taken off their deposit to cover this and other cleaning.

    Who is responsible for cleaning the communal areas in a house sub-divided into about 3 or 4 flats? In the Tenancy agreement it says the landlord but it is filthy and the letting agent has quoted the landlord as saying that each flat owner should hoover outside their own front door. So that will be a nice clean square metre outside each door and the stairs will remain a health hazard
    Originally posted by melb
    A house divided into 4 flats might mean that the landlord is responsible for the cleaning of the common parts but it might not be the person who owns the flat your daughter is renting. It could be the owner of the building so the freeholder landlord not the owner of one of the individual flats.

    The best thing to do here is to hire someone to clean the flat if your daughter doesn't want to do it herself. It is possible that she chose this flat because it was cheap?
    • deannatrois
    • By deannatrois 14th Apr 18, 5:57 AM
    • 5,300 Posts
    • 7,435 Thanks
    deannatrois
    How is your daughter feeling about the flat?

    Why was she wanting her own place? She must be doing fairly well to have been able to manage the rent deposit etc? I know the first few places I lived in weren't palaces when I saw them initially but I soon fixed them up including cleaning and sticking peeling wallpaper down. It was what I could afford at the time so compromises have to be made.

    Cleaning an oven has to be done at some point, a bit of bicarb of soda, a good scrub, repeat if necessary. If really tough you can buy acid containing oven cleaning kits (can be bough from some cheap shops for about 3 or less), put the shelves in a bag and dissolve the grease/burnt on debris with minimum scrubbing. Walls etc can be scrubbed. Even the grimiest windows can be cleaned fairly quickly, frames and all with vinegar and a tea towel or two. Floors can be cleaned with the hire of a carpet washer. Dirt is easy. Repairs are harder.

    Unfortunately having paid the deposit and rent up front, there isn't a lot of choice.
    Last edited by deannatrois; 14-04-2018 at 6:02 AM.
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