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  • FIRST POST
    • Katie-Kat-Kins
    • By Katie-Kat-Kins 12th Apr 18, 10:06 AM
    • 1,671Posts
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    Katie-Kat-Kins
    NPower - billing dispute - help with Heatwise
    • #1
    • 12th Apr 18, 10:06 AM
    NPower - billing dispute - help with Heatwise 12th Apr 18 at 10:06 AM
    ARGH! I am absolutely at the end of my tether with this and seriously struggling to find any help.


    I have a dispute with how NPower are dealing with my dual MPAN 5 rate Heatwise meter.


    I am convinced that they are overcharging me but I cannot find any official explanation of how heatwise is supposed to work, what rates should apply to each registry, or even how many hours off peak heat you should get.


    Can anyone point me in the direction of some information to help me explain to NPower how their tariff is supposed to work because they don't have a clue!


    At present they are charging me peak rates for using my storage heaters which is costing me a bloody fortune!


    Thanks
Page 1
    • PaschalFun
    • By PaschalFun 12th Apr 18, 10:58 AM
    • 178 Posts
    • 50 Thanks
    PaschalFun
    • #2
    • 12th Apr 18, 10:58 AM
    • #2
    • 12th Apr 18, 10:58 AM
    ARGH! I am absolutely at the end of my tether with this and seriously struggling to find any help.


    I have a dispute with how NPower are dealing with my dual MPAN 5 rate Heatwise meter.


    I am convinced that they are overcharging me but I cannot find any official explanation of how heatwise is supposed to work, what rates should apply to each registry, or even how many hours off peak heat you should get.


    Can anyone point me in the direction of some information to help me explain to NPower how their tariff is supposed to work because they don't have a clue!


    At present they are charging me peak rates for using my storage heaters which is costing me a bloody fortune!


    Thanks
    Originally posted by Katie-Kat-Kins
    Heatwise meters are a legacy metering that applied to a limited number of customers in the East Midlands supply region.

    Only E.ON, as the incumbant legacy supplier for that region, are obligated to support their existing customers on that metering with an appropriate tariff..

    Your best bet would be to contact E.ON to see if they would be prepared to accept you back as a Heatwise customer ... but they are under no obligation to do so.
    • Katie-Kat-Kins
    • By Katie-Kat-Kins 12th Apr 18, 11:10 AM
    • 1,671 Posts
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    Katie-Kat-Kins
    • #3
    • 12th Apr 18, 11:10 AM
    • #3
    • 12th Apr 18, 11:10 AM
    Thanks it is my plan to have the meter removed and replaced with a standard E10 meter by either EON or M&S but I want to get this issue sorted before I do.


    If NPower could not support this metering arrangement then surely they shouldn't have agreed to take on the supply though?


    I don't know how long the supply has been with NPower, since before I lived there as I have never switched due to the dual MPAN issue. However I have just realised that they are billing one of our heat registers at peak rate rather than off peak which means that we have been over charged.


    Do you know where I can find information about how these meters are connected and which register relates to which usage? If so I can refer them to it and back up what I am saying.
    • PaschalFun
    • By PaschalFun 12th Apr 18, 11:21 AM
    • 178 Posts
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    PaschalFun
    • #4
    • 12th Apr 18, 11:21 AM
    • #4
    • 12th Apr 18, 11:21 AM
    I see you have asked similar questions in many threads over the past years.
    The advice won't change ... in fact it will only get worse for you as there was an indication about a year ago that E.ON will not accept you back as a heatwise customer.

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.php?p=73036280&postcount=21

    In this post from over 2 years ago, you said you had decided you would be better off on nPower E7 compared to E.ON Heatwise

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.php?p=69857495&postcount=11

    That being your desire, you would need to ask nPower for an E7 meter.
    A charge may apply for such a change of meter (not to mention additional costs that may also be involved - get a professional to advise what changes are required and an appropriate quote)

    In the meantime, nPower will presumably be totalising your usage and charging you a single rate tariff. (plus 2 lots of standing charges for the 2 MPANS)
    Last edited by PaschalFun; 12-04-2018 at 11:31 AM.
    • Katie-Kat-Kins
    • By Katie-Kat-Kins 12th Apr 18, 11:38 AM
    • 1,671 Posts
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    Katie-Kat-Kins
    • #5
    • 12th Apr 18, 11:38 AM
    • #5
    • 12th Apr 18, 11:38 AM
    You have misread my previous post. I said;


    "I can't find many providers that support my meter but actually decided that switching to E7 wouldn't save me much as the rates aren't much lower and I would lose my afternoon heat rate and if I needed a boost would have to use higher rate power"


    I am not on E7 and have never been, I have always been with Npower on the same arrangement as it is the only one for my meter although I understand that the tariff/meter would have originally been a EME/Powergen one.


    NPower aren't totalising my usage and charging me a single rate tariff, they are charging me a two rate peak/off peak tariff and have been as long as I have been in the property.


    Yes I have asked many questions about electricity metering and heatwise tariffs. It is really difficult to find any information about these meters and tariffs and I am still struggling to get to the bottom of it all. I would love to have a simpler set up but it isn't exactly straightforward to sort out, and there are significant barriers.


    I don't expect the advice to change, I am looking for independent information that will assist me with my complaint, something I haven't asked before. I hoped that someone with more industry knowledge might be able to point me in the right direction
  • nPower
    • #6
    • 12th Apr 18, 2:11 PM
    • #6
    • 12th Apr 18, 2:11 PM
    ARGH! I am absolutely at the end of my tether with this and seriously struggling to find any help.


    I have a dispute with how NPower are dealing with my dual MPAN 5 rate Heatwise meter.


    I am convinced that they are overcharging me but I cannot find any official explanation of how heatwise is supposed to work, what rates should apply to each registry, or even how many hours off peak heat you should get.


    Can anyone point me in the direction of some information to help me explain to NPower how their tariff is supposed to work because they don't have a clue!


    At present they are charging me peak rates for using my storage heaters which is costing me a bloody fortune!


    Thanks
    Originally posted by Katie-Kat-Kins



    Hi Katie-Kat-Kins,

    Thanks for your message. Please contact us using the details on our profile page so we can help with your meter query.

    Thanks

    Jen
    Official Company Representative"
    I am the official company representative of nPower. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE.
    If we ask you to contact us, please do so using helpandsupport@npower.com - MSE Forum has temporarily allowed the display of our contact details in our signature due to a technical issue with our profile
    • trickytree1963
    • By trickytree1963 12th Apr 18, 3:49 PM
    • 240 Posts
    • 146 Thanks
    trickytree1963
    • #7
    • 12th Apr 18, 3:49 PM
    • #7
    • 12th Apr 18, 3:49 PM
    Dont know if this helps, seems to explain which hours etc covered by Heatwise?

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2890440
    • Katie-Kat-Kins
    • By Katie-Kat-Kins 13th Apr 18, 9:28 AM
    • 1,671 Posts
    • 1,779 Thanks
    Katie-Kat-Kins
    • #8
    • 13th Apr 18, 9:28 AM
    • #8
    • 13th Apr 18, 9:28 AM
    Dont know if this helps, seems to explain which hours etc covered by Heatwise?

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2890440
    Originally posted by trickytree1963

    Thank you - that mirrors my understanding but NPower are applying peak rate prices to registry 5 and do not accept that this is incorrect
    • Katie-Kat-Kins
    • By Katie-Kat-Kins 13th Apr 18, 9:31 AM
    • 1,671 Posts
    • 1,779 Thanks
    Katie-Kat-Kins
    • #9
    • 13th Apr 18, 9:31 AM
    • #9
    • 13th Apr 18, 9:31 AM
    Hi Katie-Kat-Kins,

    Thanks for your message. Please contact us using the details on our profile page so we can help with your meter query.

    Thanks

    Jen
    Originally posted by nPower

    Thank you Jen, I am already in touch with Npower direct but I would be grateful if you would confirm whether the description of heatwise provided on the post linked to is correct


    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2890440[/QUOTE
    • PaschalFun
    • By PaschalFun 13th Apr 18, 10:10 AM
    • 178 Posts
    • 50 Thanks
    PaschalFun
    Thank you Jen, I am already in touch with Npower direct but I would be grateful if you would confirm whether the description of heatwise provided on the post linked to is correct


    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2890440[/QUOTE
    Originally posted by Katie-Kat-Kins
    Do I therefore take it you are now well on the way to resolving all your issues with nPower?

    To be fair, I suspect nPower may not know the answer to your question you posed as they do not supply the Heatwise tariff.

    As I mentioned previously above,
    Heatwise meters are a legacy metering that applied to a limited number of customers in the East Midlands supply region.

    Only E.ON, as the incumbant legacy supplier for that region, are obligated to support their existing customers on that metering with an appropriate tariff..
    However, if it helps, there is confirmation by E.ON rep. Malc in post#9 that confirms the
    assumptions are correct
    What tariff does your nPower bill say you are currently on?
    Last edited by PaschalFun; 13-04-2018 at 10:14 AM.
    • Katie-Kat-Kins
    • By Katie-Kat-Kins 13th Apr 18, 2:51 PM
    • 1,671 Posts
    • 1,779 Thanks
    Katie-Kat-Kins
    Do I therefore take it you are now well on the way to resolving all your issues with nPower? ?
    Originally posted by PaschalFun

    No, I have been in discussions with them for sometime and don't seem to be making much progress. They don't seem to know a thing about it.

    To be fair, I suspect nPower may not know the answer to your question you posed as they do not supply the Heatwise tariff.

    As I mentioned previously above,
    However, if it helps, there is confirmation by E.ON rep. Malc in post#9 that confirms the
    What tariff does your nPower bill say you are currently on?
    Originally posted by PaschalFun

    NPower describe my tariff as Standard SC Electricity DD Heatwise 2 - Electricity


    That is taken from my most recent bill so although they didn't originate the heatwise tariff they are supplying something called heatwise. This has been the case for the last 10 years or so.
    • microstar
    • By microstar 13th Apr 18, 4:00 PM
    • 13 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    microstar
    I am having exactly the same problem with Npower. At times they bill me correctly and then other times they transpose meter readings or apply Peak tariff to Heatwise consumption.
    The Npower billing and complaints system is basically broken. Once my bill is correct I will leave Npower, even if it means paying a higher tariff.

    I have recently undertaken load tests and written a full report for Npower, showing how the meter registers advance at different times of the day. I have illustrated this with photographs of each meter reading. If you would like a copy then please PM me.

    The Heatwise meter registers are:
    Rate 1. Day tariff consumption.
    Rate 2. Economy 7 Night consumption.
    Rate 3. Boost (not connected in my installation - reads 00000).
    Rate 4. Heatwise Evening/Night consumption.
    Rate 5. Heatwise Afternoon consumption.

    If Npower do not resolve this soon I would really like to take court action against them. I will employ a Chartered Electrical Engineer to conduct tests and write a report for me. This has been going on for 3+ years and includes a successful complaint to Ofgem and a visit from Npower's own engineer who fully agreed with my position!
    The incompetence is truly mind-blowing.
    Last month they billed me incorrectly again, tripling my bill from 100/month to 300 !
    I wonder how many less technically aware customers are being overcharged by this company.
    • microstar
    • By microstar 13th Apr 18, 5:44 PM
    • 13 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    microstar
    FYI
    The Heatwise meter is radio teleswitched to power up the heating circuits at the following times:
    03.00 - 08.00
    13.30 - 16.30
    20.00 - 22.00
    A total of 10 hours.
    This information came from a Mr Scott Kelly at Npower - one of the few people who knows what he is talking about. He seems to have left. Another useful contact was a guy called Christopher Hunt, but he seems to have left as well!

    During the Heatwise periods the storage heaters and hot water heater supplies will be live. All consumption will be recorded on registers 4 (Eve/Night consumption) and 5 (afternoon consumption). This is for the Horstmann Series K Radio Telemeter (cream housing, one orange and one blue button on the front).
    So all heating consumption in kWh is recorded on registers 4 and 5. The consumption on these two registers should be added together and charged at the Heatwise 'Heat' tariff which is around 8p/kWh.
    Register 1 is your normal peak rate consumption. If your meter is also Economy 7 then register 2 will record night time off-peak consumption (00.30 - 07.30 in my case).
    The meter timings are controlled by a radio signal sent out by the distributor and so could be changed. I understand the radio system will be turned off by 2020 at the latest, so Heatwise meters will have to be replaced soon (Eon are already doing it).
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