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  • FIRST POST
    • TGCSurrey
    • By TGCSurrey 11th Apr 18, 11:20 AM
    • 3Posts
    • 0Thanks
    TGCSurrey
    UK CPM PCN Charge
    • #1
    • 11th Apr 18, 11:20 AM
    UK CPM PCN Charge 11th Apr 18 at 11:20 AM
    Hi All,

    Sorry for another thread but I couldn't find any information on the stage I'm currently at with UK CPM. Fingers crossed you can help.

    I received a fine for parking in a new permit parking car park, I have previously parked here for 1 year and must of missed the signs!

    I left it a few weeks and appealed the fine using the templated letter, I then received an email from UK CPM stating: "Our signage has been approved and meets the required code of practice regulated by the IPC.

    If you’re denying liability for this Parking Charge Notice, you will be required to transfer liability to the driver of the vehicle at the time of the incident.


    Yes, the charges are based on breaching the terms and conditions of the parking restrictions.

    The signs that are installed around the area clearly state ‘ A Valid UK CPM Permit must be clearly displayed in the front windscreen at all times.’ ‘ You must park wholly within a marked bay. No Parking on roadways / yellow line / paved / hatched or landscaped areas’. ‘ If unsure please seek further advice from CPM or refrain from parking’.

    Also please find attached the images of the vehicle in question."

    This is where I thought I had them! The images of the vehicle in question were completely blurry and the registration could not be made out. I replied and asked if they had any better images of the vehicle as I could not confirm if this is the vehicle in question, they replied and said "Unfortunately, all the photographs attached within the email are the only photographs we have of the vehicle on the date of incident."

    I sent a letter (using the wording etc from the newbies template) stating that as per the attached emails and photos from the UK CPM , these are the best pictures of the vehicle in question and clearly you can see that you cannot validate this is the vehicle in question, please cancel this PCN and confirm in writing.

    I heard nothing for a month, but now I have received a letter with clearer pictures of the vehicle in question.

    Now I'm stuck! What should I do? As they confirmed in writing that the 1st images were the best versions they had, surely they cant just appear with clear ones now!?

    Thanks for your help in advance.
Page 1
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 11th Apr 18, 11:34 AM
    • 9,209 Posts
    • 8,979 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #2
    • 11th Apr 18, 11:34 AM
    • #2
    • 11th Apr 18, 11:34 AM
    Have you read the stickies


    This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors.

    Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, and another company have already been named and shamed, as has Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each year). They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

    Hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned.

    The problem has become so rampant that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers. Watch the video of the Second Reading in the HofC recently.

    http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41

    and complain in the most robust terms to your MP. With a fair wind they will be out of business by Christmas.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 11th Apr 18, 11:40 AM
    • 2,313 Posts
    • 4,122 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    • #3
    • 11th Apr 18, 11:40 AM
    • #3
    • 11th Apr 18, 11:40 AM
    I have previously parked here for 1 year and must of missed the signs!
    That's going to be an interesting line of approach. Whilst it appears you will be stretching people's imagination with that one, a picture supporting your view about the signs will be a must if this goes to court. Take plenty to demonstrate how the average person and not just you, could miss them
    Idiots please note: If you intend NOT to read the information on the Notice of Allocation and hand a simple win to the knuckle dragging ex-clampers, then don't waste people's time with questions on a claim you'll not defend.
    • TGCSurrey
    • By TGCSurrey 11th Apr 18, 11:43 AM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    TGCSurrey
    • #4
    • 11th Apr 18, 11:43 AM
    • #4
    • 11th Apr 18, 11:43 AM
    sorry I wasnt clear on this, I have parked here for a year but the signs had only been up 1 week
    • Johnersh
    • By Johnersh 11th Apr 18, 1:33 PM
    • 1,036 Posts
    • 1,998 Thanks
    Johnersh
    • #5
    • 11th Apr 18, 1:33 PM
    • #5
    • 11th Apr 18, 1:33 PM
    I have parked here for a year but the signs had only been up 1 week
    Which is why the onus is on the PPC to make it very clear that parking conditions have changed (i.e. enhanced numbers of signs - temporary additional ones at the perimeter etc. I believe that is a requirement even of the IPC code of practice.

    Assuming this is a ticket at your own flat (or that of a bf or gf you've visited regularly for 1+ years) were they provided with additional notice?

    UK CPM signage typically looks like the one on here: http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=112710

    Of course, whether or not the signage actually constitutes an offer to the general public which is capable of acceptance is a different issue. Whether it is capable of performance where the general public has no entitlement to a permit so is immediately in breach is an issue explored in Pace v Lengyl
    "The best advice I ever got was that knowledge is power and to keep reading."
    DISCLAIMER: I post thoughts as & when they occur. I don't advise. You are your own person and decision-maker. I'm unlikely to respond to DMs seeking personal advice. It's ill-advised & you lose the benefit of a group "take" on events.
    • TGCSurrey
    • By TGCSurrey 11th Apr 18, 2:39 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    TGCSurrey
    • #6
    • 11th Apr 18, 2:39 PM
    • #6
    • 11th Apr 18, 2:39 PM
    Very true, it would seem the signs were put up correctly. Would the communications reference the pictures not be a viable point to cancel the ticket. CPM stating that they had no better quality photos but then miracilously once challenged they have clear photos!?
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 11th Apr 18, 2:47 PM
    • 17,627 Posts
    • 27,849 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #7
    • 11th Apr 18, 2:47 PM
    • #7
    • 11th Apr 18, 2:47 PM
    Would the communications reference the pictures not be a viable point to cancel the ticket.
    You don't seem to have the hang of this yet. PPCs don't cancel tickets unless:

    1. The landowner instructs them to
    2. The second stage appeal service upholds the motorist's appeal and then instructs them to (but as UKCPM are IPC operators, very unlikely to happen - NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #3 refers)
    3. A Judge instructs them to - that opportunity might avail itself as UKCPM are quite litigious. They have 6 years to press charges via the county court.

    http://www.bmpa.eu/companydata/UK_Car_Park_Management.html
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 14th Apr 18, 1:54 AM
    • 57,498 Posts
    • 71,097 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #8
    • 14th Apr 18, 1:54 AM
    • #8
    • 14th Apr 18, 1:54 AM
    it would seem the signs were put up correctly.
    Originally posted by TGCSurrey
    We doubt it, how so? If restrictions are introduced to a previously unrestricted car park the signs must be VERY VERY prominent and copious.

    Is this a residential car park where you live, if so, why have the residents allowed the likes of ex-clampers UKCPM on site?

    Did the driver have a permit but had not opened their post? Or put the permit to one side? Or was not issued with one (fault of the parking firm and/or managing Agent?).

    Or what? Or is it a works car park, again was the driver entitled/authorised to use that car park?
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

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