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  • FIRST POST
    • jake01
    • By jake01 10th Apr 18, 9:22 PM
    • 6Posts
    • 1Thanks
    jake01
    Charge back dispute for music lessons
    • #1
    • 10th Apr 18, 9:22 PM
    Charge back dispute for music lessons 10th Apr 18 at 9:22 PM
    Hi,

    I'm looking for some advice on credit charge back please, it's for some music lessons that I bought from a local shop on my amex credit card. Long story short, the tutor that was meant to be professional didn't have the necessary skills to teach, I can honestly say that she had less knowledge on music than I as a beginner. A few days after the lesson I got in touch with them and asked for a partial refund, but they're refusing to do that and they say "the tuition fee is not refundable", not only that but they're now telling me that the number of lessons that I bought is 5 but when paid I was told that it was 10! From my understanding the service that they're providing is not as described, is this something that the credit card company can help me with?

    Thanks for your time.
    Last edited by jake01; 11-04-2018 at 8:44 AM.
Page 1
    • pinkshoes
    • By pinkshoes 10th Apr 18, 10:30 PM
    • 15,909 Posts
    • 21,842 Thanks
    pinkshoes
    • #2
    • 10th Apr 18, 10:30 PM
    • #2
    • 10th Apr 18, 10:30 PM
    Can the shop not supply a different tutor?

    Have you seen a copy of the qualifications of this tutor? If not, ask for them.
    Should've = Should HAVE (not 'of')
    Would've = Would HAVE (not 'of')

    No, I am not perfect, but yes I do judge people on their use of basic English language. If you didn't know the above, then learn it! (If English is your second language, then you are forgiven!)
    • jake01
    • By jake01 10th Apr 18, 10:59 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    jake01
    • #3
    • 10th Apr 18, 10:59 PM
    • #3
    • 10th Apr 18, 10:59 PM
    Can the shop not supply a different tutor?

    Have you seen a copy of the qualifications of this tutor? If not, ask for them.
    Originally posted by pinkshoes
    I think she was their only tutor, no I didn't ask for, I thought she might get upset. Would that help in a charge back dispute?
    • unholyangel
    • By unholyangel 11th Apr 18, 6:34 PM
    • 12,642 Posts
    • 9,955 Thanks
    unholyangel
    • #4
    • 11th Apr 18, 6:34 PM
    • #4
    • 11th Apr 18, 6:34 PM
    How did you enter into the contract? Face to face in the shop, over the phone, over the internet etc?
    Money doesn't solve poverty.....it creates it.
    • jake01
    • By jake01 12th Apr 18, 9:58 AM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    jake01
    • #5
    • 12th Apr 18, 9:58 AM
    • #5
    • 12th Apr 18, 9:58 AM
    How did you enter into the contract? Face to face in the shop, over the phone, over the internet etc?
    Originally posted by unholyangel
    It was face to face.
    • McKneff
    • By McKneff 12th Apr 18, 10:35 AM
    • 36,097 Posts
    • 46,526 Thanks
    McKneff
    • #6
    • 12th Apr 18, 10:35 AM
    • #6
    • 12th Apr 18, 10:35 AM
    Did you sign anything , if so did you read what you signed
    make the most of it, we are only here for the weekend.
    and we will never, ever return.
    • jake01
    • By jake01 12th Apr 18, 10:45 AM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    jake01
    • #7
    • 12th Apr 18, 10:45 AM
    • #7
    • 12th Apr 18, 10:45 AM
    Did you sign anything , if so did you read what you signed
    Originally posted by McKneff
    No, nothing was signed, they just gave me a receipt for the card payment.
    • pinkshoes
    • By pinkshoes 12th Apr 18, 2:05 PM
    • 15,909 Posts
    • 21,842 Thanks
    pinkshoes
    • #8
    • 12th Apr 18, 2:05 PM
    • #8
    • 12th Apr 18, 2:05 PM
    You need to put it in writing to the shop all the issue you have.

    Do they have an email address?

    Let them know that on X date you purchased 10 music lessons. Then state clearly what the issues are with the teacher, and that you are now being told it is only 5 lessons you gave paid for.

    Ask them to rectify the situation by clarifying that it is indeed 10 lessons that you have paid for, ask to see the qualifications of the teacher, and ask them either for a refund or a more appropriate teacher.

    In what way is the teacher not suitable? Can you give some examples?
    Should've = Should HAVE (not 'of')
    Would've = Would HAVE (not 'of')

    No, I am not perfect, but yes I do judge people on their use of basic English language. If you didn't know the above, then learn it! (If English is your second language, then you are forgiven!)
    • eddddy
    • By eddddy 12th Apr 18, 2:52 PM
    • 6,761 Posts
    • 6,638 Thanks
    eddddy
    • #9
    • 12th Apr 18, 2:52 PM
    • #9
    • 12th Apr 18, 2:52 PM
    The Consumer Rights Act 2015 says:

    49 Service to be performed with reasonable care and skill

    Every contract to supply a service is to be treated as including a term that the trader must perform the service with reasonable care and skill.

    Link: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/15/part/1/chapter/4/enacted

    So it sounds like you are claiming for 'Breach of Contract' on the basis that the service was not provided with 'reasonable care and skill'.

    If the course of lessons cost more than 100 (and it was clear that you were buying one course, as opposed to 10 individual lessons costing less than 100 each), you can make a section 75 claim against the credit card company.

    (It also needs to be clear that you had a contract directly with the shop that you paid - and not with the piano teacher.)

    Otherwise, you can try a chargeback (if this meets the criteria in Amex's t&cs for a chargeback).


    Failing that, you can make a claim against the shop in the small claims court.
    • jake01
    • By jake01 12th Apr 18, 6:06 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    jake01
    You need to put it in writing to the shop all the issue you have.
    Do they have an email address?
    Let them know that on X date you purchased 10 music lessons. Then state clearly what the issues are with the teacher, and that you are now being told it is only 5 lessons you gave paid for.
    Ask them to rectify the situation by clarifying that it is indeed 10 lessons that you have paid for, ask to see the qualifications of the teacher, and ask them either for a refund or a more appropriate teacher.
    In what way is the teacher not suitable? Can you give some examples?
    Originally posted by pinkshoes
    Yes, I do have their email address, I'll send them an email and see what they'll say. Basically, it was obvious that she didn't have much teaching experience or knowledge, so for example when I needed some assistance, she couldn't provide proper explanation or even do the task better than I was doing. I can honestly say that I knew more than she did, not even sure if she was an actual tutor!
    • jake01
    • By jake01 12th Apr 18, 7:22 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    jake01
    The Consumer Rights Act 2015 says:
    So it sounds like you are claiming for 'Breach of Contract' on the basis that the service was not provided with 'reasonable care and skill'.
    If the course of lessons cost more than 100 (and it was clear that you were buying one course, as opposed to 10 individual lessons costing less than 100 each), you can make a section 75 claim against the credit card company.
    (It also needs to be clear that you had a contract directly with the shop that you paid - and not with the piano teacher.)
    Otherwise, you can try a chargeback (if this meets the criteria in Amex's t&cs for a chargeback).
    Failing that, you can make a claim against the shop in the small claims court.
    Originally posted by eddddy
    Thanks for your response. I've been touch with my credit card company but they've asked me to provide evidence as to how the service wasn't as described. Unfortunately, expect the receipt which only shows how much was paid, and a few emails in which the shop basically denies what I'm saying, I don't have anything else, do you reckon that the credit card company would issue a charge back based on those?
    • bris
    • By bris 13th Apr 18, 12:32 AM
    • 7,810 Posts
    • 6,792 Thanks
    bris
    No not a chance of winning this via S75 or chargeback. Simple to defend, your word against theirs. Are you qualified to state they are incompetent, are your expectations to high or are you just looking for a refund? This is how the CC will see it.


    The courts may be able to help, they will at least want to see proof the teacher was able and competent enough to do the service paid for.
    • Lavendyr
    • By Lavendyr 13th Apr 18, 7:56 PM
    • 2,092 Posts
    • 1,906 Thanks
    Lavendyr
    I find it incredible that you paid for these lessons in advance without any form of paperwork! In your place I'd have wanted to see all the details set out in a contract including number of lessons and details of the teacher. Usually you'd also get to meet/have a trial with the teacher to make sure they are suitable and get on OK with your child etc.

    I'd do as others have said and write to the company setting out your concerns/issues, but ultimately you have no proof that you paid for a tutor of a particular level or for 10 lessons rather than 5...so I struggle to see how a court would find in your favour.
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