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  • FIRST POST
    • joojoobeans
    • By joojoobeans 10th Apr 18, 10:44 AM
    • 5Posts
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    joojoobeans
    Natwest transactions - Is this even legal?
    • #1
    • 10th Apr 18, 10:44 AM
    Natwest transactions - Is this even legal? 10th Apr 18 at 10:44 AM
    Looking at online banking around 12 midnight last night (9th april). Assumed it would display all transactions that had left my account that day and that no more could go through. Woke up to an additional 5 transactions having left my account on 9th april!! This senario happens all the time.

    Have asked natwest to confirm what day/time they left my actual account (assuming it might not display instantly on online banking). Surely if they are processed through my account after 12 midnight though they should show the next days date?

    My main concern is people getting charged for going overdrawn as transactions are being proccessed in the small hours but still being included in the previous days banking. Therefore, the information provided to customers about their account is inaccurate. Where do the banks stand on this? Is it legal?
Page 2
    • PeacefulWaters
    • By PeacefulWaters 12th Apr 18, 10:38 AM
    • 8,318 Posts
    • 10,667 Thanks
    PeacefulWaters
    So you admit that you're working as a team
    I think any non-argumentative poster would see "we" as a recognition that some other posters agree with a point.

    That can and does work both ways in a discussion.

    To see it as some sort of pre-meditated online teamwork is one hell of a stretch.
    • RG2015
    • By RG2015 12th Apr 18, 12:25 PM
    • 1,301 Posts
    • 766 Thanks
    RG2015
    I think any non-argumentative poster would see "we" as a recognition that some other posters agree with a point.

    That can and does work both ways in a discussion.

    To see it as some sort of pre-meditated online teamwork is one hell of a stretch.
    Originally posted by PeacefulWaters
    I agree.

    I also think that if there is evidence of "teamwork" on this site the team members must change their team allegiance almost daily.

    Paranoia, on the other hand if often the domain of the single-member teams.
    • joojoobeans
    • By joojoobeans 13th Apr 18, 1:22 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    joojoobeans
    Thank you for everyone's responses and the interesting debate that followed. This was never about my own personal finances or being upset about overdraft fees. It was the principal of the matter that I was interested to discuss. As well as querying the banks obligation to display accurate infomation to their customers.

    Transactions that are processed through a bank account on 10th April at 2am should display the date they are processed, not the previous days date. It is about displaying accurate information to the customer about their account. Particularly as displaying inaccurate information, in this type of scenario , could potentially work in favour of the bank and against the customer.

    Natwest have now responded to my complaint.

    First of all they have clarified to me that the information presented, via online banking and via the systems that their advisors use, is not a true reflection of the dates and times at which transactions are processed through an account. (Incidentally it also happens when I transfer money between my natwest accounts. For example I transfer money on 10th April, it updates my balance but still shows as a pending transaction dated the 10th, the following day it shows the transaction date to be the 11th april - go figure!?!?).

    They tried to tell me it was the retailers who requested the money at this time. I said I found it hard to believe that 5 different retailers all decided to request money for transactions made on different days in the small hours of the same day. Regardless, the transactions they requested should still show the date they left my account, not the previous days date. They tried to argue that perhaps the retailers requested it just before midnight the previous day but it didn't update my account until sometime after. I argued this is clearly a failure in the way their system is configured, as other banks are able to present debit card transactions to their customers instantly, so the technology is clearly available to do so. The girl I spoke to was very apologetic and sounded understandably sheepish as she could no longer deny there was an issue with their system. She agreed it was a problem and that I wasn't the first person to complain about this and that they would look into changing the system in future.

    So overall not a fantastic response, as they tried to pass the buck onto retailers, despite it being fairly obvious that this situation is caused by the way their system is configured, and the way they have set it up to display transaction information.

    What I have learnt from this....

    1) natwest do not display accurate information to me about my account.
    2) other banks have better technology and are able to display more accurate, up to date information about my account.
    3) might be time to change banks (despite it being a real pain to do so).

    Thankyou again for everyone's comments, some have been very enlightening.
    • RG2015
    • By RG2015 13th Apr 18, 2:26 PM
    • 1,301 Posts
    • 766 Thanks
    RG2015
    You make some valid points in your posts but in answer to you primary question nothing NatWest do is illegal.

    I have been happy to bank with NatWest for 45 years and know their ways inside out. Most banks have quirks and very few operate on a real time basis and these tend to be the newer start-up banks.

    NatWest may or may not be doing this to increase their profits but that could not be proven either way. I believe that the established banks have decided not to radically update their IT platforms because it would be very costly and could result in very severe IT failings. The cost, both financial and in system down time would ultimately be borne by us, the customers.

    The new banks are now becoming more attractive like the new energy companies. But unlike the new energy companies there are no real cost incentives. For now, real time banking is a minor issue for me and would not be an incentive for me to change.
    • meer53
    • By meer53 13th Apr 18, 2:26 PM
    • 9,251 Posts
    • 13,436 Thanks
    meer53
    So you admit that you're working as a team.


    The OP is clearly monitoring what he is spending. I believe it was one of your "we" team that turned the post in to something about financial discipline.

    For purely card transactions, there is no way you can go overdrawn, because with most systems these days, when the retailer swipes the card and you've hit your limit, it will simply decline the transaction.

    I'm not saying don't keep track of your spending. I do it religiously (Clearly, the OP is doing the same). But don't make this what it's not. "backdating" transactions is never good. Especially when done by a bank for their own gain.
    Originally posted by OceanSound
    You are completely wrong about the bit i have highlighted above. It is possible to go overdrawn using a debit card, all bank accounts have a buffer which will allow transactions to be authorised even if you don't have sufficient funds in your account. They are not "simply" declined.
    • joojoobeans
    • By joojoobeans 13th Apr 18, 5:49 PM
    • 5 Posts
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    joojoobeans
    RG2015 thankyou for your reply, that makes a lot of sense and I feel it answers my query well.
    • Emily Joy
    • By Emily Joy 13th Apr 18, 6:24 PM
    • 154 Posts
    • 67 Thanks
    Emily Joy
    You are completely wrong about the bit i have highlighted above. It is possible to go overdrawn using a debit card, all bank accounts have a buffer which will allow transactions to be authorised even if you don't have sufficient funds in your account. They are not "simply" declined.
    Originally posted by meer53
    I didn't follow it very closely, but there have been some letters from Lloyds telling that the overdraft facility is changing and that non-arranged overdraft will not be possible?
    • joojoobeans
    • By joojoobeans 13th Apr 18, 10:47 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    joojoobeans
    At natwest we get charged for using an arranged overdraft. Its ok to go overdrawn up to 10 but you get charged 6 for usint anything more than that.
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