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    • eatgarbage
    • By eatgarbage 2nd Apr 18, 1:48 PM
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    eatgarbage
    Equal Pay
    • #1
    • 2nd Apr 18, 1:48 PM
    Equal Pay 2nd Apr 18 at 1:48 PM
    I have been in a job role for over 7 years, we employed a new team member a year ago who has much less experience and still is nowhere near my skill level, however they came into the role from a different department on higher pay than me but the same pay scale. Do I have a case to say I should be paid equal to or more than him?
Page 1
    • agrinnall
    • By agrinnall 2nd Apr 18, 1:54 PM
    • 20,709 Posts
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    agrinnall
    • #2
    • 2nd Apr 18, 1:54 PM
    • #2
    • 2nd Apr 18, 1:54 PM
    You can try to make the case to your boss but you have no legal means to enforce it.
    • marliepanda
    • By marliepanda 2nd Apr 18, 1:55 PM
    • 6,333 Posts
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    marliepanda
    • #3
    • 2nd Apr 18, 1:55 PM
    • #3
    • 2nd Apr 18, 1:55 PM
    I have been in a job role for over 7 years, we employed a new team member a year ago who has much less experience and still is nowhere near my skill level, however they came into the role from a different department on higher pay than me but the same pay scale. Do I have a case to say I should be paid equal to or more than him?
    Originally posted by eatgarbage
    A case? Not really no. Thereís no legal basis for equal pay for equal work.

    Could you ask? Sure.
    • eatgarbage
    • By eatgarbage 2nd Apr 18, 2:23 PM
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    eatgarbage
    • #4
    • 2nd Apr 18, 2:23 PM
    • #4
    • 2nd Apr 18, 2:23 PM
    So the equal pay act isn't legally enforceable?
    • Spidernick
    • By Spidernick 2nd Apr 18, 2:38 PM
    • 2,836 Posts
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    Spidernick
    • #5
    • 2nd Apr 18, 2:38 PM
    • #5
    • 2nd Apr 18, 2:38 PM
    Presumably the individual is moving over from the other department on the same salary as they were on there? If so, that is not unusual and what normally happens is that the worker is then not entitled to any further pay rises until the pay band has caught up. As to whether they deserved a higher salary in the other department, we have no data to say either way.
    'I want to die peacefully in my sleep, like my father. Not screaming and terrified like his passengers.' (Bob Monkhouse).

    Sky? Believe in better.

    Note: win, draw or lose (not 'loose' - opposite of tight!)
    • eatgarbage
    • By eatgarbage 2nd Apr 18, 2:50 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    eatgarbage
    • #6
    • 2nd Apr 18, 2:50 PM
    • #6
    • 2nd Apr 18, 2:50 PM
    Presumably the individual is moving over from the other department on the same salary as they were on there? If so, that is not unusual and what normally happens is that the worker is then not entitled to any further pay rises until the pay band has caught up. As to whether they deserved a higher salary in the other department, we have no data to say either way.
    Originally posted by Spidernick
    Thanks for the reply, what i'm looking at is the Equal Pay Act this states that people should receive equal pay for equal work. My logic is that If I have more experience in this role and they are being paid more I should get an increase.

    If I was female I would be able to argue sex discrimination. However this is not necessary as the Act applies to both sexes. Therefor Equal.
    • xapprenticex
    • By xapprenticex 2nd Apr 18, 3:08 PM
    • 1,500 Posts
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    xapprenticex
    • #7
    • 2nd Apr 18, 3:08 PM
    • #7
    • 2nd Apr 18, 3:08 PM
    You appear to know what you are doing, keep us updated.
    • ACG
    • By ACG 2nd Apr 18, 3:30 PM
    • 17,331 Posts
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    ACG
    • #8
    • 2nd Apr 18, 3:30 PM
    • #8
    • 2nd Apr 18, 3:30 PM
    If I was female I would be able to argue sex discrimination.
    Originally posted by eatgarbage
    And they would be able to argue it is not - I have no idea who would win.

    I used to work for a very large company. Our jobs were being made redundant. I was offered a lower grade job, but my wage would have remained the same - my wage would have been more than the banding for that job, but I would not have had a pay rise for about 10 years.

    I also used to work for a bank. Someone there was made a manager but did not like it so they stepped down to customer service advisor. Going off your argument, every other customer service advisor should be put on the same wage as a manager?
    • anamenottaken
    • By anamenottaken 2nd Apr 18, 3:54 PM
    • 4,146 Posts
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    anamenottaken
    • #9
    • 2nd Apr 18, 3:54 PM
    • #9
    • 2nd Apr 18, 3:54 PM
    . . . what i'm looking at is the Equal Pay Act .
    Originally posted by eatgarbage
    Equal Pay Act (if you are thinking of the 1970 Act) has been repealed.






    However, there is the Equality Act 2010 and though for equal pay this applies to both sexes it still requires the comparator to be of the opposite sex.
    • eatgarbage
    • By eatgarbage 2nd Apr 18, 4:39 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    eatgarbage
    Why do they have to be of the opposite sex? I have another colleague who is female. So she could argue it and get a raise and I couldn't? Doesn't seam very equal.

    In response to previous posts I would argue if you apply for a job at a lower band or accept a job at lower band that's what you should get paid. That's a different situation to me though. I'm talking about equal pay for arguably me doing more work because I know what I'm doing
    • Gavin83
    • By Gavin83 2nd Apr 18, 4:52 PM
    • 5,253 Posts
    • 8,596 Thanks
    Gavin83
    Why do they have to be of the opposite sex? I have another colleague who is female. So she could argue it and get a raise and I couldn't? Doesn't seam very equal.
    Originally posted by eatgarbage
    Well no, she couldn't. She has to prove she receives lower pay because of her sex. The fact you are presumably on a similar wage as her and they've got a good reason as to why the other person is paid more means her case would fail. And I'd she made it official it's likely she'd be on borrowed time at the company.

    You can ask. If you're as experienced and good as you suggest they should be willing to pay more to keep you there. They've no obligation to increase your salary however.
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 2nd Apr 18, 5:21 PM
    • 2,640 Posts
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    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    Thanks for the reply, what i'm looking at is the Equal Pay Act this states that people should receive equal pay for equal work. My logic is that If I have more experience in this role and they are being paid more I should get an increase.

    If I was female I would be able to argue sex discrimination. However this is not necessary as the Act applies to both sexes. Therefor Equal.
    Originally posted by eatgarbage
    No. there is not and never has been any such act.

    There are laws that state you cannot be paid less purely because of gender, race, etc.

    The situation you are in prevails in 95% of companies across the country. People are paid different amounts for doing the same job for all sorts of reasons. If you were female you would need to show that you were paid less than this person purely because of your gender, and you are not.

    This is not a legal issue. They pay this person this salary because they believe it's worth paying it to keep them. They may be paying you less because you never asked for more. If they think it's worth paying you the same, just ask. If they tell you no, you'll know the reason you are paid less is because they value your service less. Then, if you think other people will pay you more, go and work for them instead.

    There's no law, and never will be a law, compelling companies to value everyone equally no matter how competent they are.
    • Kynthia
    • By Kynthia 2nd Apr 18, 5:32 PM
    • 5,218 Posts
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    Kynthia
    You seem to believe that everyone should be paid exactly the same for a role but people aren't exactly the same. People are sometimes paid more because they are more skilled, have been there longer or hace more experience, have a desirable trait or skill, are employed at a time when there was more jobs than appropriate people and the employer had to offer a premium to beat other employers, etc. As long as the reason someone is paid less for the same role isn't because of a protective characteristic then there's no law saying everyone must be paid the same.
    Don't listen to me, I'm no expert!
    • TBagpuss
    • By TBagpuss 2nd Apr 18, 6:03 PM
    • 6,700 Posts
    • 8,750 Thanks
    TBagpuss
    as others have said, the relevant law is in the Equalities Act, and it protects from unlawful discrimination (including pay discrimination) i.e. where the reason for the discrimination is age, race, gender, disability or another protected characteristic.

    In your case, there is nothing to suggest that you are are paid less than your new colleague because of any protected characteristic.

    Your way forward would be to negotiate with your employer for a pay rise. Don't argue on the basis of the new hire, but on the basis of why you are worth more than you are currently paid;for instance, focus on things which you have been praised for, in your appraisals (if you have them) or by your managers, customers etc. Think about whether you have greater responsibilities now than when you were last given a raise, or have improved your productivity.

    It's relevant to look at what market rates are for your type of work and level of skill - i.e. what it would cost your employer to replace you if you left (and also whether you would be better off if you chose to move elsewhere)

    Consider whether there has been any negative feedback in your appraisals or comments made to / about you about your work or presentation? Probably this doesn't apply to you, but it is possible that despite your greater experience, you are perceived as less positive over all?

    Bear in mind that your total package may be more valuable than your new colleagues - do you know whether you have the same holiday, paid sickness and pension rights, for instance? You presumably do have greater security and more rights in the event of redundancy, as you've been there longer.

    If your conversation with your boss focuses on why t is in the businesses interest to pay yu more, you're more likely to be successful in negotiating a raise than if your argument is 'it's not fair', or 'he gets more than me'. For all you know, your bosses feel that the co-worker is paid too much and they are trying to manage him out!
    • eatgarbage
    • By eatgarbage 2nd Apr 18, 6:58 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    eatgarbage
    Thanks for the response. No managing him out, we are part of a FTSE 30 company and he had moved from IT hoping he had transferable skills, he doesn't. It happens he was higher up the Pascale than I was previously.

    As it is me and my afformentioned colleague who have to pick up all the stuff he is unable to do or even understand it just feels unfair. I dare say he may have a better package than me as he has been in the company longer than me.

    Don't get me wrong I get well paid but having someone who is for want of a better word incompetent getting paid more doesn't seem fair.
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 2nd Apr 18, 7:14 PM
    • 2,640 Posts
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    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    It's not supposed to be fair. He might be lucky, in which case it's nothing to do with you. You might be unlucky, in which case you can do something about it by asking for more money and going elsewhere if they won't pay it.
    • TBagpuss
    • By TBagpuss 3rd Apr 18, 11:42 AM
    • 6,700 Posts
    • 8,750 Thanks
    TBagpuss
    Thanks for the response. No managing him out, we are part of a FTSE 30 company and he had moved from IT hoping he had transferable skills, he doesn't. It happens he was higher up the Pascale than I was previously.

    As it is me and my afformentioned colleague who have to pick up all the stuff he is unable to do or even understand it just feels unfair. I dare say he may have a better package than me as he has been in the company longer than me.

    Don't get me wrong I get well paid but having someone who is for want of a better word incompetent getting paid more doesn't seem fair.
    Originally posted by eatgarbage
    In that case, make sure that the relevant managers are aware of the extra work that you and your co-worker are taking on. depending on the nature of your work and the instructions you are given, it may be appropriate for you to either stop picking up their slack - start returning stuff to them if it isn't done correctly, for instance, or alternatively carry on doing it, but make sure that your manager is aware of it, and raise the extra work next time you have an appraisal or pay review.
    • Samsung_Note2
    • By Samsung_Note2 3rd Apr 18, 2:05 PM
    • 526 Posts
    • 200 Thanks
    Samsung_Note2
    Thanks for the response. No managing him out, we are part of a FTSE 30 company and he had moved from IT hoping he had transferable skills, he doesn't. It happens he was higher up the Pascale than I was previously.

    As it is me and my afformentioned colleague who have to pick up all the stuff he is unable to do or even understand it just feels unfair. I dare say he may have a better package than me as he has been in the company longer than me.

    Don't get me wrong I get well paid but having someone who is for want of a better word incompetent getting paid more doesn't seem fair.
    Originally posted by eatgarbage
    I personally would find the first bin and throw that chip away you have on your shoulder.

    Your college gets paid more than you..maybe many others do,how would you know as its none of your business.
    Who knows maybe they simply believe the other person is simply better than you and dont share your inflated opinion of yourself.
    If my appalling spelling offends you that much...dont read my posts.
    • Ja7188
    • By Ja7188 4th Apr 18, 6:55 PM
    • 188 Posts
    • 181 Thanks
    Ja7188
    Also, you may yourself be paid more than most of the others in your role so you may really have very little to complain about...

    By all means ask your boss the question (although, given that you're in a large company where any significant rise would probably require several levels of sign-off, don't get your hopes up) but if you attempt to start any kind of formal procedure, you risk being branded a nuisance and nudged towards the exit in fairly short order.
    • Tara247
    • By Tara247 16th Apr 18, 9:55 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Tara247
    Sorry to jump in on your post, but equal pay surely must be if you are in the same titled role, with the same responsiblities and the same hours.
    I am female working for a company for 4 years now, as the business has grown they hired a male offering the same job role as i, we do the same tasks, same responsibilities, the same hours however he is paid £3000 pa more than me. Should i go down the gender pay route with my employer?
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