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  • FIRST POST
    • marv_b
    • By marv_b 31st Mar 18, 8:23 AM
    • 8Posts
    • 1Thanks
    marv_b
    Warranty on dental crown
    • #1
    • 31st Mar 18, 8:23 AM
    Warranty on dental crown 31st Mar 18 at 8:23 AM
    Hello,

    I had a ceramic crown fitted to one of my molars in 2013. At the time, I had dental insurance through my employer and had the work done privately (at my NHS dentist, if that makes sense); it cost about 450 but 'free' to me. I distinctly remember the dentist being confident that the crown would last the rest of my life (I'm in my 30s).

    I now work for a new employer and pay for my own dental care at the same NHS practice but my dentist recently left.

    The tooth was giving me some grief a few weeks ago, so I had it checked out and the crown has cracked. I know the mouth is a hostile environment, and perhaps it was unrealistic to expect it to last the rest of my life, but 4.5 years seems a short lifespan.

    Do these things tend to come with any sort of warranty? I guess otherwise I'm looking at 244 for a new crown on the NHS.
Page 1
    • Toothsmith
    • By Toothsmith 31st Mar 18, 9:33 AM
    • 8,885 Posts
    • 10,572 Thanks
    Toothsmith
    • #2
    • 31st Mar 18, 9:33 AM
    • #2
    • 31st Mar 18, 9:33 AM
    It is a very silly thing for a dentist to say! 'The rest of your life' is a very long time, and the average life span for a crown is 10-12 years.

    Some do last a lot longer, but, the way averages work means that some last a lot shorter!

    As you say - the mouth is a hostile environment and there are so many factors that affects the survival of the crown, and a lot more are to do with the patient than the dentist.

    In certain circumstances on the NHS there is a 12 month replacement clause. If I had a patient come back with a crown failure that I felt was some fault with the crown, I might offer a replacement either free or at a discount, depending on how long it had survived - but that would be a goodwill gesture, and I would certainly never tell anyone that anything I did was likely to last forever.
    How to find a dentist.
    1. Get recommendations from friends/family/neighbours/etc.
    2. Once you have a short-list, VISIT the practices - dont just phone. Go on the pretext of getting a Practice Leaflet.
    3. Assess the helpfulness of the staff and the level of the facilities.
    4. Only book initial appointment when you find a place you are happy with.
    • marv_b
    • By marv_b 31st Mar 18, 12:02 PM
    • 8 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    marv_b
    • #3
    • 31st Mar 18, 12:02 PM
    • #3
    • 31st Mar 18, 12:02 PM
    That's very helpful, thank you Toothsmith.
    • Sammy2018
    • By Sammy2018 31st Mar 18, 4:16 PM
    • 19 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Sammy2018
    • #4
    • 31st Mar 18, 4:16 PM
    • #4
    • 31st Mar 18, 4:16 PM
    Do these things tend to come with any sort of warranty? I guess otherwise I'm looking at 244 for a new crown on the NHS.
    Originally posted by marv_b
    256 as of tomorrow (1.4.18). Disgusting that particular price increase.
    • Toothsmith
    • By Toothsmith 1st Apr 18, 11:53 AM
    • 8,885 Posts
    • 10,572 Thanks
    Toothsmith
    • #5
    • 1st Apr 18, 11:53 AM
    • #5
    • 1st Apr 18, 11:53 AM
    256 as of tomorrow (1.4.18). Disgusting that particular price increase.
    Originally posted by Sammy2018
    Especially as none of it goes back into NHS dentistry!
    How to find a dentist.
    1. Get recommendations from friends/family/neighbours/etc.
    2. Once you have a short-list, VISIT the practices - dont just phone. Go on the pretext of getting a Practice Leaflet.
    3. Assess the helpfulness of the staff and the level of the facilities.
    4. Only book initial appointment when you find a place you are happy with.
    • wary
    • By wary 1st Apr 18, 4:29 PM
    • 702 Posts
    • 314 Thanks
    wary
    • #6
    • 1st Apr 18, 4:29 PM
    • #6
    • 1st Apr 18, 4:29 PM
    Hello,

    I had a ceramic crown fitted to one of my molars in 2013. At the time, I had dental insurance through my employer and had the work done privately (at my NHS dentist, if that makes sense); it cost about 450 but 'free' to me. I distinctly remember the dentist being confident that the crown would last the rest of my life (I'm in my 30s).
    ...
    Do these things tend to come with any sort of warranty? I guess otherwise I'm looking at 244 for a new crown on the NHS.
    Originally posted by marv_b
    As the original cost was 450 then I presume that you have a white molar?
    In case you're not aware, the NHS price for a molar crown is for a silver only, which is very unsightly. Otherwise you'll have to pay the private treatment price for a white one which will likely be over 400.
    • Sammy2018
    • By Sammy2018 1st Apr 18, 4:58 PM
    • 19 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Sammy2018
    • #7
    • 1st Apr 18, 4:58 PM
    • #7
    • 1st Apr 18, 4:58 PM
    Especially as none of it goes back into NHS dentistry!
    Originally posted by Toothsmith
    That's quite shocking. So do the dentists' pocket it themselves?

    (no disrespect to the dentists btw)
    • Toothsmith
    • By Toothsmith 1st Apr 18, 8:50 PM
    • 8,885 Posts
    • 10,572 Thanks
    Toothsmith
    • #8
    • 1st Apr 18, 8:50 PM
    • #8
    • 1st Apr 18, 8:50 PM
    No. NHS dentists have fixed-priced contracts. The money patients pay comes off the monthly amount the dentist will get from the NHS.

    Over the past decade of 'austerity' Dental contract values have either not risen, or had a 1% rise like other public services.

    Added to that - area NHS authorities try their best to cut the contract values of the dentists that still have them by reducing the contracts if they 'underperform' by the end of a financial year, or for numerous other little transgressions of the rules they arbitrarily impose or enforce. In the meantime, patient fees have gone up by however much the Government have wanted to put them up, with the nett effect that the Government is paying even less for NHS dentistry.
    Last edited by Toothsmith; 01-04-2018 at 8:53 PM.
    How to find a dentist.
    1. Get recommendations from friends/family/neighbours/etc.
    2. Once you have a short-list, VISIT the practices - dont just phone. Go on the pretext of getting a Practice Leaflet.
    3. Assess the helpfulness of the staff and the level of the facilities.
    4. Only book initial appointment when you find a place you are happy with.
    • brook2jack
    • By brook2jack 2nd Apr 18, 9:13 AM
    • 4,169 Posts
    • 3,824 Thanks
    brook2jack
    • #9
    • 2nd Apr 18, 9:13 AM
    • #9
    • 2nd Apr 18, 9:13 AM
    Each dentist gets a certain amount for the work they carry out. When patient charges go up it just means the health service pays less of the amount and the patients more. In effect the dentist acts like a tax collector.

    In addition , with the latest increases, many dentists will earn less for the treatment than the patient pays! The "excess" is used to pay for non paying patients instead of health service money.

    So if a dentist has a dental unit value of less than 21 a course of treatment including a crown is 12 UDAs ,which at 21 a UDA is 252 they will earn less than your 256 NHS payment for the crown, however in order to keep their contract and get paid for children etc they have to act as a government tax collector .
    Last edited by brook2jack; 02-04-2018 at 9:17 AM.
    • goodone2
    • By goodone2 12th Apr 18, 11:17 AM
    • 5 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    goodone2
    Does any dental work come with any kind of warranty (implied or otherwise)?
    • Toothsmith
    • By Toothsmith 12th Apr 18, 12:23 PM
    • 8,885 Posts
    • 10,572 Thanks
    Toothsmith
    Does any dental work come with any kind of warranty (implied or otherwise)?
    Originally posted by goodone2
    There is a limited 12 month free replacement clause on some NHS work. And private dentists wishing to retain patient goodwill would probably come to some sort of replacement agreement with a patient who had had something fail early.
    A huge part of the survival of dental work does depend on how the patient looks after it, though - so there can never really be any 'universal' guarantee.
    How to find a dentist.
    1. Get recommendations from friends/family/neighbours/etc.
    2. Once you have a short-list, VISIT the practices - dont just phone. Go on the pretext of getting a Practice Leaflet.
    3. Assess the helpfulness of the staff and the level of the facilities.
    4. Only book initial appointment when you find a place you are happy with.
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