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  • FIRST POST
    • Phil1976
    • By Phil1976 27th Mar 18, 11:14 AM
    • 20Posts
    • 3Thanks
    Phil1976
    UK CPM ticket for inputting wrong registration.
    • #1
    • 27th Mar 18, 11:14 AM
    UK CPM ticket for inputting wrong registration. 27th Mar 18 at 11:14 AM
    Hi, I would like some advice on the correct next step I should take with UKCPM.

    I was given 2 tickets by UKCPM when parked at a hospital. On both tickets I input my other vehicle registration. Both tickets were paid for, for the full amount, however the second ticket I couldn't get on the app in time, (as my son had been rushed into the hospital so it wasn't at the top of my agenda), however I did pay for the right duration / amount albeit a few hours later.

    I have appealed it with UKCPM but appear to have received a generic reply saying :-

    - I have failed to pay for full duration, they can't find payment on the other reg (which is odd as I have receipts, showing the date, reg and car park which I have paid for)

    - Signage is clear saying "YOU MUST ENTER FULL, CORRECT VEHICLE REGISTRATION"

    - Another one about the signage being clear.

    - I didn't pay full duration so in breach of the termsand conditions.

    I really would like advice on how to proceed with this as I have queried these before with POPLA and won (but that was in a Macdonalds) but have read POPLA might not be as helpful as before.

    Also there is no mention of POPLA on my letter just says I should appeal to the IAS, but I have also read this is pointless as they wont help.

    My main frustration and reason for standing my ground is UKCPM have clearly lied by saying they cant find either Reg being paid for even though I have the receipts from the App I used.

    Really not sure how to proceed or if I even can, any advise would be grateful.

    Thanks
Page 1
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 27th Mar 18, 11:37 AM
    • 37,404 Posts
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    Fruitcake
    • #2
    • 27th Mar 18, 11:37 AM
    • #2
    • 27th Mar 18, 11:37 AM
    This is a completely unregulated scam industry.

    You need to read the Sticky thread for NEWBIES to learn all about this. You won't get PoPLA from UK CPM as they are IPC members. They offer IAS, which is as much use as a chocolate fireguard and should be avoided.

    Did you reveal the driver's identity when you appealed? I hope not. In any case, you are now in ignore mode unless you get real court papers. The NEWBIES explains all this.

    You should complain to PALS and to your MP.

    These are some of the comments made by the MPs in Parliament concerning the unregulated parking industry (Feb 2018):

    https://hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2018-02-02/debates/CC84AF5E-AC6E-4E14-81B1-066E6A892807/Parking(CodeOfPractice)Bill

    ''Rip-offs from car park Cowboys must stop''; unfair treatment; signage deliberately confusing to ensure a PCN is issued; ''years of abuse by rogue parking companies''; bloodsuckers; ''the current system of regulation is hopeless, like putting Dracula in charge of the blood-bank''; extortionate fines; rogue operators; ''sense of injustice''; unfair charges and notices; wilfully misleading; signage is a deliberate act to deceive or mislead; ''confusing signs are often deliberate, to trap innocent drivers''; unreasonable; a curse; harassing; operating in a disgusting way; appeals service is no guarantee of a fair hearing; loathed; outrageous scam; dodgy practice; outrageous abuse; unscrupulous practices; ''the British Parking Association is as much use as a multi-storey car park in the Gobi desert''; and finally, by way of unanimous conclusion: ''we need to crack down on these rogue companies. They are an absolute disgrace to this country. Ordinary motorists and ordinary residents should not have to put up with this''.

    These are the exact words used, so you should quote them to your MP in a complaint and ask him/her to contact Sir Greg Knight MP if he wants further information about this scam.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 27th Mar 18, 12:23 PM
    • 10,022 Posts
    • 9,860 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #3
    • 27th Mar 18, 12:23 PM
    • #3
    • 27th Mar 18, 12:23 PM
    Putting a wrong VRN in a ticket machine is hardly a big deal. If the PPC was to take you to court a judge is likely to take the view that it hardly merits 100 for damages for breach of contract. He/she may even feel that it constitutes an unlawful penalty and is an unreasonable and timewasting use of the court system.

    This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors.

    Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, and another company have already been named and shamed, as has Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each year). They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

    Hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned.

    The problem has become so rampant that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers. Watch the video of the Second Reading in the HofC recently.

    http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41

    and complain in the most robust terms to your MP. With a fair wind they will be out of business by Christmas.i
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Phil1976
    • By Phil1976 27th Mar 18, 1:43 PM
    • 20 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Phil1976
    • #4
    • 27th Mar 18, 1:43 PM
    • #4
    • 27th Mar 18, 1:43 PM
    Thank you very much Fruitcake and The Deep, I did not divulge who was actually driving the vehicle.

    I have just watched that video and it was very interesting and good to see these cowboy companies aren't going unnoticed. I just hope if they do get it to court, common sense prevails as you mentioned.
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 27th Mar 18, 2:07 PM
    • 37,404 Posts
    • 84,290 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    • #5
    • 27th Mar 18, 2:07 PM
    • #5
    • 27th Mar 18, 2:07 PM
    Please do complain to your MP, and make sure you tell PALS to cancel this. Tell them what the MPs said about the scammers that the hospital have employed.

    These are some of the comments made by the MPs in Parliament concerning the unregulated parking industry (Feb 2018):

    https://hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2018-02-02/debates/CC84AF5E-AC6E-4E14-81B1-066E6A892807/Parking(CodeOfPractice)Bill

    ''Rip-offs from car park Cowboys must stop''; unfair treatment; signage deliberately confusing to ensure a PCN is issued; ''years of abuse by rogue parking companies''; bloodsuckers; ''the current system of regulation is hopeless, like putting Dracula in charge of the blood-bank''; extortionate fines; rogue operators; ''sense of injustice''; unfair charges and notices; wilfully misleading; signage is a deliberate act to deceive or mislead; ''confusing signs are often deliberate, to trap innocent drivers''; unreasonable; a curse; harassing; operating in a disgusting way; appeals service is no guarantee of a fair hearing; loathed; outrageous scam; dodgy practice; outrageous abuse; unscrupulous practices; ''the British Parking Association is as much use as a multi-storey car park in the Gobi desert''; and finally, by way of unanimous conclusion: ''we need to crack down on these rogue companies. They are an absolute disgrace to this country. Ordinary motorists and ordinary residents should not have to put up with this''.

    These are the exact words used, so you should quote them to your MP in a complaint and ask him/her to contact Sir Greg Knight MP if he wants further information about this scam.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 27th Mar 18, 9:56 PM
    • 61,773 Posts
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    Coupon-mad
    • #6
    • 27th Mar 18, 9:56 PM
    • #6
    • 27th Mar 18, 9:56 PM
    even though I have the receipts from the App I used.
    Sit tight and keep that evidence. Use it at Gladstones LBCCC stage.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • Phil1976
    • By Phil1976 28th Mar 18, 4:07 PM
    • 20 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Phil1976
    • #7
    • 28th Mar 18, 4:07 PM
    • #7
    • 28th Mar 18, 4:07 PM
    Thanks Fruitcake, would I write to my MP or the MP of where the hospital is situated ?
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 28th Mar 18, 4:27 PM
    • 3,459 Posts
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    nosferatu1001
    • #8
    • 28th Mar 18, 4:27 PM
    • #8
    • 28th Mar 18, 4:27 PM
    How about both?
    • Phil1976
    • By Phil1976 11th Apr 18, 9:08 AM
    • 20 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Phil1976
    • #9
    • 11th Apr 18, 9:08 AM
    • #9
    • 11th Apr 18, 9:08 AM
    Hi, just a bit of an update.

    I have written to both my MP and the MP for where the hospital is located.

    My MP has written back to me to let me know that he has written to James Randall, Managing Director of UK Car Park Management Ltd asking him to look into the matter.

    I'm hoping this is enough to stop them pursuing my fines.
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 11th Apr 18, 9:15 AM
    • 10,022 Posts
    • 9,860 Thanks
    The Deep
    They are not fines. They are invoices for damages for alleged breaches of contract. They are imo trifles, and the Law does not concern itself with trifles.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_minimis
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Half_way
    • By Half_way 11th Apr 18, 10:16 AM
    • 4,278 Posts
    • 6,072 Thanks
    Half_way
    Are you aware of the NHS parking principles for patients, staff and visitors?
    after consulting this, what happened when you contacted the Hospital PALS ?
    From the Plain Language Commission:

    "The BPA has surely become one of the most socially dangerous organisations in the UK"
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 13th Apr 18, 8:43 PM
    • 61,773 Posts
    • 74,680 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Hi, just a bit of an update.

    I have written to both my MP and the MP for where the hospital is located.

    My MP has written back to me to let me know that he has written to James Randall, Managing Director of UK Car Park Management Ltd asking him to look into the matter.

    I'm hoping this is enough to stop them pursuing my fines.
    Originally posted by Phil1976
    Good update, but your MP is deluded if he thinks ex-clamper gits are going to stop pursuing money.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • Phil1976
    • By Phil1976 17th Apr 18, 9:40 AM
    • 20 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Phil1976
    I contacted the hospital and this was their reply

    "You can appeal to the Independent Appeal Service currently known as Independent Appeals Service (IAS). You will have 28 days from the date of your rejection letter to do this. PLEASE NOTE you should be aware that if your appeal is unsuccessful, you will lose the right to pay at the discount rate, meaning the full fee of 100.00 will then be payable."

    about as helpful as UK CPM. I think its fair to say they wanted nothing to do with it.
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 17th Apr 18, 10:51 AM
    • 3,459 Posts
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    nosferatu1001
    WHen you contacted the hospital and asked them for an explanation of why they are in breach of the NHS Parking Principles and the explicit instruciton from their MInister, what was their response?

    Was this to PALS?
    Be more firm. Go in. be a nuisance to them.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 17th Apr 18, 10:59 AM
    • 61,773 Posts
    • 74,680 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    And direct them to the Parliamentary debate from 2.2.18 where all MPs in the House were unanimous in agreeing:

    ''years of abuse by rogue parking companies''; bloodsuckers; ''the current system of regulation is hopeless, like putting Dracula in charge of the blood-bank''; extortionate fines; rogue operators; ''sense of injustice''; unfair charges and notices; wilfully misleading; signage is a deliberate act to deceive or mislead; ''confusing signs are often deliberate, to trap innocent drivers''; unreasonable; a curse; harassing; operating in a disgusting way; appeals service is no guarantee of a fair hearing; loathed; outrageous scam; dodgy practice; outrageous abuse;''

    Ask them how they think an appeals service that (given the numerous reports) almost never allows any, and does not consider mitigating circumstances AT ALL, fits with their own ethos and this Government policy:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/nhs-car-parking-management-htm-07-03


    Ask them how penalising a wrong registration is fair and proportionate?

    Tell them you will escalate the complain and will NOT be using the kangaroo court, and that they need to alert their top Management to this horrendous issue with their contractor not offering anything like an INDEPENDENT appeal, since it is run by their own Trade Body and gives reportedly biased (anti-consumer) decisions from an anonymous person:

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/01/is-independent-appeal-service-kangaroo.html

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2015/08/ipc-kangaroo-court-defies-government.html

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2017/11/ipc-kangaroo-court-strikes-again.html

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2014/12/independent-parking-committee-kangaroo.html

    Tell them the above links are not to some random blogger. The Parking Prankster has reported about this issue for many years and is on Watchdog in a 'dodgy practices' report about parking firms tomorrow night:

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2018/04/parking-prankster-on-watchdog.html

    HTH
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 17th Apr 18, 11:02 AM
    • 37,323 Posts
    • 21,513 Thanks
    Quentin
    I contacted the hospital and this was their reply

    "You can appeal to the Independent Appeal Service currently known as Independent Appeals Service (IAS). You will have 28 days from the date of your rejection letter to do this. PLEASE NOTE you should be aware that if your appeal is unsuccessful, you will lose the right to pay at the discount rate, meaning the full fee of 100.00 will then be payable."

    about as helpful as UK CPM. I think its fair to say they wanted nothing to do with it.
    Originally posted by Phil1976
    As you will know, the advice here is different - DON'T go to IAS at all.


    You now ignore everything except a lbcca or court correspondence


    But do keep on at PALS!
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