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  • FIRST POST
    • joeypesci
    • By joeypesci 12th Mar 18, 8:32 PM
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    joeypesci
    Hours worked - VERY confusing
    • #1
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:32 PM
    Hours worked - VERY confusing 12th Mar 18 at 8:32 PM
    I don't think this is just me. Working out how many hours per day I should be doing is proper confusing.

    So it works like this. I used to work in a role that was 37.5 hours a week.

    I worked this out using an online calculator. I'd done this on my timesheet for 10 year and my agency never said it was wrong.

    9-5 with an 30min lunch break unpaid. Is 7.5 hours a day paid.
    7.5x5 = 37.5

    That's fine. No one ever questioned that.

    Now in a new role for a new large employer. The hours are 37hrs a week. I then released I've been doing 9-5 every day. Again with 30mins lunch. So that is over 30mins each week extra I've been working.

    I mentioned this and was told "No you're wrong. You do 37 / 5 which equals 7.4 or 7hrs 40mins per day you should be working". That does add up. But if I then work out, in 24hour clock

    17:00pm-9:00am = 8hrs - .5 (30min lunch) that comes to 7.5 or 7hrs 30mins per day.

    This is why its super confusing. If I follow his working out of 7hrs 40mins per day then I should leaving every day at 4:50 if starting at 9am and taking 30min unpaid lunch which is stated "Not included in my working hours of 37hrs".

    Very confused.
Page 1
    • BorisThomson
    • By BorisThomson 12th Mar 18, 8:35 PM
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    BorisThomson
    • #2
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:35 PM
    • #2
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:35 PM
    7.4 hours is not 7 hours 40 minutes!
    • Dazed and confused
    • By Dazed and confused 12th Mar 18, 8:36 PM
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    Dazed and confused
    • #3
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:36 PM
    • #3
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:36 PM
    Doesn't 7.4 equal 7 hours and 24 minutes?
    • shortcrust
    • By shortcrust 12th Mar 18, 8:40 PM
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    shortcrust
    • #4
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:40 PM
    • #4
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:40 PM
    When I was in the civil service we worked to 37 hours a week (well, really 148 over four weeks) but we had flexi so it didn't matter.

    You're working for an unpaid 6 minutes per day. Can you take an hour lunch one day a week, or leave/arrive 30 mins late/early? That would take care of it. If it's a really big employer, especially a public sector one then if you make a fuss you should get your 6 mins back. In some places I think this might be met with eye rolling and knowing looks, as unfair as that might be.
    Last edited by shortcrust; 12-03-2018 at 8:41 PM. Reason: Loads of typos... Must be tired.
    • joeypesci
    • By joeypesci 12th Mar 18, 8:51 PM
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    joeypesci
    • #5
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:51 PM
    • #5
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:51 PM
    7.4 hours is not 7 hours 40 minutes!
    Originally posted by BorisThomson
    Thanks. Someone else pointed that out as well. I'll have to annoy the person again and state that 7.4 hours isn't 7hrs 40mins. It really confused me as in my working out, 7.5hrs isn't 7hr 50mins but just a decimal to make working time out easy. And that 7.5hrs is actually 7hrs 30mins. Which is why I was confused when he stated 7.4 is 7hr 40mins.

    And to shortcrust. I mentioned this myself, that 7.5 hrs per day for 4 days and then 7hrs one day, meaning leaving 30mins early would cover 37hrs. I was told "No, you've worked that out wrong".

    I'm sure I haven't.
    • Tigsteroonie
    • By Tigsteroonie 12th Mar 18, 8:55 PM
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    Tigsteroonie
    • #6
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:55 PM
    • #6
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:55 PM
    I used to do 37hr/wk as a civil servant. It was Mon - Thurs at 7hrs 30 mins; then Friday we would knock off half an hour early.
    Mrs Marleyboy

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    • jobbingmusician
    • By jobbingmusician 12th Mar 18, 9:04 PM
    • 19,141 Posts
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    jobbingmusician
    • #7
    • 12th Mar 18, 9:04 PM
    • #7
    • 12th Mar 18, 9:04 PM
    There are also employers who will force you to take an unpaid HOUR at lunch. Their business, their rules. (This does of course extend the working day by 30 min.)
    I'm the Board Guide on the Matched Betting; Referrers and Jobseeking & Training boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge posts there. Board guides are not moderators and don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this). Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com.

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    • Dazed and confused
    • By Dazed and confused 12th Mar 18, 9:29 PM
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    Dazed and confused
    • #8
    • 12th Mar 18, 9:29 PM
    • #8
    • 12th Mar 18, 9:29 PM
    Maybe you would find it simplest if you agreed at the outset of your next conversation at work that you only talk in hours and minutes.
    • agrinnall
    • By agrinnall 13th Mar 18, 9:25 AM
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    agrinnall
    • #9
    • 13th Mar 18, 9:25 AM
    • #9
    • 13th Mar 18, 9:25 AM
    If the person you're trying to explain it to is hard of understanding then maybe do it this way:

    37 hours = 2,220 minutes per week

    2220/5 = 444 minutes per day

    444 minutes = 7 hours (420 minutes) + 24 minutes

    I know all about this as I work a 37 hour week pro-rated to 4 days per week, so all my working and holiday time calculations are done in minutes.
    • joeypesci
    • By joeypesci 19th Mar 18, 11:12 AM
    • 500 Posts
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    joeypesci
    Thanks for the replies.

    I'm more confused because they seem to be changing things without seemingly knowing what they are talking about or I'm just not understanding it.

    I got told the next day buy this same guy that our working hours are 9-5 which is 7hrs 24mins a day and 36mins unpaid lunch. No mentioned that he'd actually got the 7.4 wrong the day before and also, where has the extra unpaid 6mins come from when on my contract it clearly states "30 minutes for lunch which isn't included in your weekly hours".

    Using quite a good online timesheet calculator I now see they have decided to mention 36mins of unpaid lunch to make it add up to 37hrs. Should I be picky and depute this and get them to rewrite the contract because it clearly states 30mins for lunch. If it's now 36mins then they surely need to reflect that on my contract.
    • agrinnall
    • By agrinnall 19th Mar 18, 12:15 PM
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    agrinnall
    It's such a minor change that I can't see any way you can realistically object to it to anyone other than your employer - and what would your grounds for objection be?
    • joeypesci
    • By joeypesci 19th Mar 18, 12:53 PM
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    joeypesci
    I'm not objecting to the extra 6mins. I just want it on the contract. What happens if (they won't but what if) a new manager came in and they clock watched and starting saying "Your contract states you can only have 30mins, why are you having 36mins". I'd explain and just get told "I don't care what the e-mail says, your contract say 30mins".

    That is the point.
    • KiKi
    • By KiKi 19th Mar 18, 1:17 PM
    • 4,957 Posts
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    KiKi
    Are you in a job where you are literally on a lunch rota for 30 minutes dead (like a customer call centre)? If not, don't make a deal of it unless it actually becomes a problem. I can't remember the last time I cared what I had for lunch - sometimes I get no time. Other times I might take an hour. I'm certainly not paid for it.
    ' <-- See that? It's called an apostrophe. It does not mean "hey, look out, here comes an S".
    • joeypesci
    • By joeypesci 22nd Mar 18, 10:19 AM
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    joeypesci
    Are you in a job where you are literally on a lunch rota for 30 minutes dead (like a customer call centre)? If not, don't make a deal of it unless it actually becomes a problem. I can't remember the last time I cared what I had for lunch - sometimes I get no time. Other times I might take an hour. I'm certainly not paid for it.
    Originally posted by KiKi
    Yes.

    And by law you're required to be given at least a 20min uninterrupted break.
    • k3lvc
    • By k3lvc 22nd Mar 18, 10:27 AM
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    k3lvc
    Now in a new role for a new large employer.
    Originally posted by joeypesci

    This is key - unless you value your 6mins more than you value your job I wouldn't be creating too many waves on what you want documenting
    • joeypesci
    • By joeypesci 22nd Mar 18, 11:22 AM
    • 500 Posts
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    joeypesci
    I hate that saying "creating waves". It's not creating waves it's exercising your rights. Again. the contract states 30mins unpaid lunch which would then work out at 9-5 mon-thurs and 9-4 on friday. But now they've changed it to 36mins unpaid lunch yet not put it on the contract so they can say "its 9-5 every day".

    Again, the reason for a request for the contract to reflect the extra 6 mins they randomly added on after the contract was signed is to cover myself. If a new manager appears that clock watches they could possibly, legally pull me up on the extra 6 mins each day if they deem the e-mail as not evidence enough that I'm entitled to that.
    • marlot
    • By marlot 22nd Mar 18, 12:26 PM
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    marlot
    ...9-5 mon-thurs and 9-4 on friday..
    Originally posted by joeypesci
    For 37 hours a week, its 9-4.30 on Friday :-)
    • ohreally
    • By ohreally 22nd Mar 18, 12:59 PM
    • 6,626 Posts
    • 5,142 Thanks
    ohreally
    .40x60 - 24minutes, its not difficult.
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