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  • FIRST POST
    • Sparkleybutterfly
    • By Sparkleybutterfly 7th Mar 18, 1:44 PM
    • 44Posts
    • 6Thanks
    Sparkleybutterfly
    Sell or not to sell?
    • #1
    • 7th Mar 18, 1:44 PM
    Sell or not to sell? 7th Mar 18 at 1:44 PM
    I've been reading through a lot of the posts regarding overpaying mortgages and want to move to the other camp and sell up to be a mortgage-free wannabe

    Hereís my position:
    Age: 58 and divorced
    Children: x 3 (32; 30; 26 - all with steady employment and their heads screwed on regarding their futures) so no financial responsibility
    Mortgage: £88,000
    Value of property: approx. £100,000 (on a good day). I bought it 9 years ago for £137,000 so have lost all my deposit sadly
    Term remaining: 12 years (but I only have another 8 years before retirement)
    Current payments: £800 (including rates)
    Salary: £1,400 (take home pay)
    Rental income: £500
    Credit card debit: £10,000 (mostly on 0% finance)
    Car Loan and usual outgoings of life/car insurance, contact lens costs etc.
    Savings: £800

    Iím currently living with my OH (2 years now), no outgoings except for food and a little towards our small utilities (nice position to be in). He is retired with a great pension and is very generous when it comes to our lifestyle/holidays etc., but it is still more expensive than I can afford at the moment as I like to contribute something (albeit a small amount).

    Moving forward:
    I will need to reduce the term of my mortgage to meet my retirement date, so payments will go up and they are a real struggle at the moment. I have tried to overpay but I end up dipping into what I have put away before the end of the month, so thatís not working.

    It is only from September last year that I had no financial responsibility to my last child who finished her Masters and is now in full-time, permanent employment with good prospects and doesnít need a roof over her head.

    My eldest son rents my property, so in essence I am still helping him along by not asking for full rental income from him, but then I donít have to worry about anything breaking as he will wait for it to be fixed.

    The house needs some attention, and could really do with a new oil boiler, or changing to gas, new kitchen and bathroom and a good lick of paint. Problem is I donít have any disposable income to do these changes.

    So Ė if my son leaves the property (which he will do, to buy his own at some stage), I will have to rent the property out or do what I have done in the past and be a resident landlady to lodgers. To be honest, neither of which I want to do and neither will cover my mortgage/rates monthly payment, but I will have the worry of keeping the house up to a rental able standard.

    The burning question is Ė do I keep my head down and reduce the term, increase my payments to:
    • Provide security if my relationship doesnít work out
    • In 8 yearsí time I have a property which I could sell or rent out
    • Always feel like Iím in debt
    • Have something to leave to my kids when I die
    OR Ė Sell to:
    • Have a little money in the bank
    • Enable me to save a chunk of money each month towards my retirement
    • Feel like I have no responsibility for the first time in my life
    • Purchase a smaller/cheaper property in a yearís time to rent out (if I was able to get a mortgage??!!)

    Apologies for the very long post, but I really am getting splinters sitting on the fence. The property was bought after divorce for the purpose of somewhere for the children and me to live. It was all I could afford at the time and would not be one that I would have chosen, nor in the area I would have liked, so I donít feel any affiliation to it.

    Open to any advice available.

    Thank you
    Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass
    It's about learning to dance in the rain
Page 1
    • Tropically
    • By Tropically 7th Mar 18, 2:05 PM
    • 253 Posts
    • 742 Thanks
    Tropically
    • #2
    • 7th Mar 18, 2:05 PM
    • #2
    • 7th Mar 18, 2:05 PM
    Are you going to stay with your current OH?
    Mortgage started at £318,000 in June 2016. Original MF - 2041
    2017 OPs: £7000/£7000
    Mortgage in Nov 2017 - £297,808
    • Sparkleybutterfly
    • By Sparkleybutterfly 7th Mar 18, 2:58 PM
    • 44 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    Sparkleybutterfly
    • #3
    • 7th Mar 18, 2:58 PM
    • #3
    • 7th Mar 18, 2:58 PM
    That is certainly the intention but after a 23 year marriage which ended 11 years ago - who knows. But to be honest I cannot live my life thinking like that. I am enjoying my life at the moment and have no financial or emotional responsibility to provide a stable environment (other than the normal) for my children (currently).
    Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass
    It's about learning to dance in the rain
    • Tropically
    • By Tropically 7th Mar 18, 4:05 PM
    • 253 Posts
    • 742 Thanks
    Tropically
    • #4
    • 7th Mar 18, 4:05 PM
    • #4
    • 7th Mar 18, 4:05 PM
    I ask because I want to know whether it's a possibility that you might end up renting while retired.

    Another downside to selling now is that you will realise the losses (i.e. there is still a possibility your house price will go up in the future).

    I think that you should be asking your son for enough to cover the mortgage. Normally, I don't like when parents charge their kids rent (if in the same home) but in this case, you are losing money every month by topping up his rent by £300. £800 is a really reasonable rent for what sounds like a big family home. He is 32, and he should be able to cover the costs each month.

    But that aside, for your own quality of life I think you should sell either now or when your son moves out. It doesn't sound like you want to be a landlord. Being a landlord can be quite time consuming, or at least frustrating, and you mention that this won't cover the monthly repayment anyway.

    If you sold, and you saved that money in an account that got a little interest, I think you'd be better off emotionally and financially in comparison to paying for your son to live and paying a bunch of interest.
    Mortgage started at £318,000 in June 2016. Original MF - 2041
    2017 OPs: £7000/£7000
    Mortgage in Nov 2017 - £297,808
    • Sparkleybutterfly
    • By Sparkleybutterfly 7th Mar 18, 5:58 PM
    • 44 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    Sparkleybutterfly
    • #5
    • 7th Mar 18, 5:58 PM
    • #5
    • 7th Mar 18, 5:58 PM
    I totally appreciate the question and the reply.


    There is a high possibility that I will end up renting when I retire.


    If any thing happens to my partner and he dies before me, he has 2 children and I am sure they will not wish their Dad's property to remain as my home indefinitely. I know that sounds harsh, but I'm being realistic.


    This is why I am so on the fence about this. In an ideal world I would have, say a year of being able to save and then buy a small property with a mortgage, which I would be happy to rent out, but my worry is that I wouldn't be accepted for a mortgage at the age of say 59 or 60??


    Emotionally, it is the way forward but practically I just don't know and wonder if I'm letting the thought of being cash rich (for the first time in my life) and property poor cloud my judgement.


    As for my son, getting £500 out of him a month is tough enough without asking for more. He's apparently saving for a house (I am smiling at this point), and doesn't see my house as anything more than a stop gap rather than a really comfortable property to live in so he would never see the justification for paying more. I only was able to negotiate the £500 because I got 3 estate agents out to give me a sale or rental figure.


    I suppose we never really know what is around the corner and much as it would be lovely to leave my children something, it is such a burden at the moment and at least I am not in negative equity.


    I will deliberate a little longer before making that decision, but thank you for taking the time to respond.
    Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass
    It's about learning to dance in the rain
    • edinburgher
    • By edinburgher 7th Mar 18, 5:59 PM
    • 11,124 Posts
    • 59,707 Thanks
    edinburgher
    • #6
    • 7th Mar 18, 5:59 PM
    • #6
    • 7th Mar 18, 5:59 PM
    For me, the elephant in the room would be what is your current pension provision like?

    Because as it stands, you're losing £4,500 a year (the amount you sub your son each month + potential pension tax relief).

    I'd be livid if I thought my Mum was adding years onto her working life topping me up

    Speaking as someone pretty close in age to your son, this is ridiculous!

    Without meaning to be a cheeky !!!!!!, you're not a rich person, time to cut the apron strings?
    • edinburgher
    • By edinburgher 7th Mar 18, 6:02 PM
    • 11,124 Posts
    • 59,707 Thanks
    edinburgher
    • #7
    • 7th Mar 18, 6:02 PM
    • #7
    • 7th Mar 18, 6:02 PM
    You can still get a mortgage, but only til SPA I believe, so another 9 years or less?

    Also, am I right in thinking you earn c. £20k? On a good day, you'd get a mortgage for £100k, but I suspect that your affordability calculations would look horrible, as you'd need to pay back £11k a year + interest. Your car finance debt appears to cancel out your deposit as well

    So you're probably looking at renting or sticking with your current property, which costs you nearly 60% of your income unless you have lodgers/a tenant.

    I'd wait 'til son moves out then sell, but he needs to be paying market rent + all rates.

    You *cannot* afford to subside him!!!
    Last edited by edinburgher; 07-03-2018 at 6:05 PM.
    • Sparkleybutterfly
    • By Sparkleybutterfly 7th Mar 18, 6:09 PM
    • 44 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    Sparkleybutterfly
    • #8
    • 7th Mar 18, 6:09 PM
    • #8
    • 7th Mar 18, 6:09 PM
    # Edinburgher


    My pension provision (including my state pension) will roughly amount to my current take home salary. I have already checked this out and if I kept the house (and it was paid out) I could either sell or rent out to top up my pension.


    You are not being cheeky but it is extremely difficult to cut the apron strings and up until now I felt I was not in a position to sell this house for reasons of providing a home for 2 of the 3 kids. My youngest has now finished studying and in her own place so other than my son I have no real responsibility any more, hence this dilemma in whether, moving forward, I sell or not.


    I really appreciate the questions as there may be something I have missed when complementing this.
    Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass
    It's about learning to dance in the rain
    • edinburgher
    • By edinburgher 7th Mar 18, 6:14 PM
    • 11,124 Posts
    • 59,707 Thanks
    edinburgher
    • #9
    • 7th Mar 18, 6:14 PM
    • #9
    • 7th Mar 18, 6:14 PM
    Well, it's a relief that you have adequate pension provision
    • enthusiasticsaver
    • By enthusiasticsaver 7th Mar 18, 10:18 PM
    • 6,401 Posts
    • 13,164 Thanks
    enthusiasticsaver
    I think you should sell the property and your son will need to find somewhere. He is 32 so no longer a child and presumably it is too big for just him anyway. You are only 9 years off retirement and you are subsidising him when you should be making plans for your own retirement. You may struggle to get a mortgage though as most lenders won't go past spa. Of course it all depends on what happens with your new relationship.
    Debt free and mortgage free and early retiree. Living the dream

    I'm a Board Guide on the Debt-Free Wannabe, Mortgages and Endowments, Banking and Budgeting boards. I volunteer to help get your forum questions answered and keep the forum running smoothly. Any views are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com. Pease remember, board guides don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
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