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  • FIRST POST
    • CGG
    • By CGG 6th Mar 18, 3:41 PM
    • 726Posts
    • 683Thanks
    CGG
    Apprentice, 17, bullied at work...
    • #1
    • 6th Mar 18, 3:41 PM
    Apprentice, 17, bullied at work... 6th Mar 18 at 3:41 PM
    ... Thanks for the replies and suggestions put forward.


    I've deleted my OP as it resulted in me receiving a PM from a less than helpful member, causing me offence.
    Last edited by CGG; 08-03-2018 at 5:35 PM.
Page 1
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 6th Mar 18, 4:00 PM
    • 2,970 Posts
    • 2,938 Thanks
    Comms69
    • #2
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:00 PM
    • #2
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:00 PM
    What do you expect to be done.


    The guy runs his own business, there is no-one you could complain to
    • TELLIT01
    • By TELLIT01 6th Mar 18, 4:04 PM
    • 4,896 Posts
    • 5,249 Thanks
    TELLIT01
    • #3
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:04 PM
    • #3
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:04 PM
    The only practical advice is for your son to get out of there as soon as possible. The college have done what they can by providing a list of potential employers. It's now up to your son to put the effort into contacting them and moving on. There is little or nothing to be done directly against the current employer as everything will be one persons word against another.
    • bertiewhite
    • By bertiewhite 6th Mar 18, 4:18 PM
    • 1,064 Posts
    • 1,180 Thanks
    bertiewhite
    • #4
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:18 PM
    • #4
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:18 PM
    What do you expect to be done.


    The guy runs his own business, there is no-one you could complain to
    Originally posted by Comms69
    It still doesn't mean he can treat people like sh!t though.

    OP - have you tried contacting ACAS?
    • BorisThomson
    • By BorisThomson 6th Mar 18, 4:21 PM
    • 1,586 Posts
    • 3,420 Thanks
    BorisThomson
    • #5
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:21 PM
    • #5
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:21 PM
    He needs to get out and put this bad experience behind him. He's taken action by ensuring no one else will be placed with this electrician, and that's something he should be praised for.

    He should be aware though that there is always going to be a certain amount of banter in the trades and he'll need to develop a thicker skin if that's what he wants to do. That's not to say that bullying is acceptable - it isn't - but there will always be a level of taking the mick out of each other and out of customers. It wouldn't be an environment I would be comfortable in, it's up to your son whether it works for him or not.
    • BorisThomson
    • By BorisThomson 6th Mar 18, 4:23 PM
    • 1,586 Posts
    • 3,420 Thanks
    BorisThomson
    • #6
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:23 PM
    • #6
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:23 PM
    It still doesn't mean he can treat people like sh!t though.

    OP - have you tried contacting ACAS?
    Originally posted by bertiewhite
    Unfortunately, it does. Workers have few rights in short term employment, and even less so with issues that cannot be proven.
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 6th Mar 18, 4:24 PM
    • 2,970 Posts
    • 2,938 Thanks
    Comms69
    • #7
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:24 PM
    • #7
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:24 PM
    It still doesn't mean he can treat people like sh!t though.

    OP - have you tried contacting ACAS?
    Originally posted by bertiewhite


    Well actually it does.


    What will ACAS do? the OPs son had basically no rights whatsoever.


    The guy is a scum bag, but that doesn't mean there's action possible. (except voting with your feet)
    • tgon
    • By tgon 6th Mar 18, 4:54 PM
    • 570 Posts
    • 283 Thanks
    tgon
    • #8
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:54 PM
    • #8
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:54 PM
    Erm, last time I looked, harassment and intimidation over a period of time was a reportable police matter. And no trader is exempt from health & safety at work laws. But l agree with a previous post about calling ACAS for some legal advice. Could be just walking away is the best option. Also, as this in obviously affecting your sons health, your GP would be first port of call. One thing is certain, he is not going to get the apprenticeship he deserves in this employ.
    • DCFC79
    • By DCFC79 6th Mar 18, 6:00 PM
    • 31,662 Posts
    • 19,972 Thanks
    DCFC79
    • #9
    • 6th Mar 18, 6:00 PM
    • #9
    • 6th Mar 18, 6:00 PM
    Yes he can follow the advice thats been posted, put the experience behind him and move on.
    Can people stop loaning money/being a guarator to family/friends, it rarely ends well and you lose out as your money is gone or you get shafted with being a guarantor.
    • z1a
    • By z1a 6th Mar 18, 6:22 PM
    • 1,259 Posts
    • 1,196 Thanks
    z1a
    Can his Dad not do a bit of bullying back? Pretty sure I would.
    • John-K
    • By John-K 6th Mar 18, 6:44 PM
    • 654 Posts
    • 1,010 Thanks
    John-K
    As above, it!!!8217;s not right, but there!!!8217;s really not likely to be anything that will rescue the situation, so he should probably make the best of it that he can while he looks for something else.

    If and when he does find something, I!!!8217;d also suggest taking whatever lessons he can learn from this job. Were there occasions when the criticism was warranted, for example, or could he have done things differently, once he realised the kind of boss that he was working with?

    Not that this implies it is his fault in any way, by the way, but it is always useful to look back on good jobs or bad and have a think what could be done in a different way if it happens again.
    • xapprenticex
    • By xapprenticex 6th Mar 18, 8:07 PM
    • 1,435 Posts
    • 1,376 Thanks
    xapprenticex
    Not advising it but if some guy/s made my son break down i'd take matters into my own hands, or make a few phone calls.
    • pmduk
    • By pmduk 6th Mar 18, 8:56 PM
    • 8,346 Posts
    • 6,166 Thanks
    pmduk
    Perhaps show the 'knob' customer the text?
    • bertiewhite
    • By bertiewhite 7th Mar 18, 7:49 AM
    • 1,064 Posts
    • 1,180 Thanks
    bertiewhite
    Unfortunately, it does. Workers have few rights in short term employment, and even less so with issues that cannot be proven.
    Originally posted by BorisThomson
    Well actually it does.
    What will ACAS do? the OPs son had basically no rights whatsoever.
    The guy is a scum bag, but that doesn't mean there's action possible. (except voting with your feet)
    Originally posted by Comms69
    Really?

    https://www.gov.uk/workplace-bullying-and-harassment

    Like z1a says, maybe a bit of retaliation bullying is in order then, if harassment is a free-for-all these days?
    • shortcrust
    • By shortcrust 7th Mar 18, 8:09 AM
    • 1,902 Posts
    • 2,785 Thanks
    shortcrust
    Really?

    https://www.gov.uk/workplace-bullying-and-harassment

    Like z1a says, maybe a bit of retaliation bullying is in order then, if harassment is a free-for-all these days?
    Originally posted by bertiewhite
    What part of the linked page do you think means the OP's son can do anything about it?
    • Enterprise 1701C
    • By Enterprise 1701C 7th Mar 18, 8:15 AM
    • 19,312 Posts
    • 208,466 Thanks
    Enterprise 1701C
    We work in "the trades", and I have heard a lot worse than that on building sites etc, I simply give as good as I get.

    Will be interesting to see what happens when this guy loses his gopher though. Sounds like to him an apprentice is simply a cheap way of getting an assistant.

    To me it sounds like your son needs to take this as a lesson learned and find another employer ASAP, but not to expect that it will not all be moonlight and roses. He needs to develop a thick skin.

    As for calling clients things like knob, I have heard that on many occasions, but then when the client is around they are polite and respectful towards them. Clients get called all things under the sun, especially when they change their mind at an inconvenient time, and many of them would expect this, but so long as they are treated respectfully when they are in contact with the business then all is well. Sounds like being nasty behind their backs, but it really is not, it is a way to let off steam and get rid of the frustrations of the job.

    Just one note, I am female. You can imagine what I have to put up with on building sites, but I give as good as I get, maybe your son needs to do the same?

    Sending your son into a loft without protective clothing though, is not acceptable. But would it not be an idea for your son to get things like a face mask in case this happens again? They are not expensive, and, so long as your son is not in shorts and a T shirt, would really be all he needs to protect against the insulation, gloves might just make his job harder.

    As for working through lunch, we often do that just for the sake of getting the job done on time.

    As for drilling through plasterboard, your son must have been able to hear him drilling on the other side, what on earth was he doing with his hand directly on the plasterboard? Assuming this was in the form of a wall, then he could not see through it, and you simply do not have any part of your body in contact with a wall when someone is drilling through it

    Actually, reading this through, you have to ask if your son is really suited to being an electrician? 4 Years is a long time to spend on an apprenticeship if he cannot take what happens on building sites etc, not sure that he would be able to run a business on the basis of just small jobs in peoples's houses!
    What is this life if, full of care, we have no time to stand and stare
    • Les79
    • By Les79 7th Mar 18, 8:16 AM
    • 203 Posts
    • 264 Thanks
    Les79
    I think it is a fine line in workplaces like this.... You've got people who prefer a hands-on sort of job and, without stereotyping, a fair number have a sort of laddish and *rough* way about them.

    Not justifying it like, but calling a customer a "knob" and "tools" behind their back is not surprising to me... Also, the pay docking may be justified if your son has been making a hash of the job and not learning (employers like this usually have one style of teaching, and if you don't show progress they think you aren't cut out for the job).

    As practical advice I would suggest that your son become a bit thick-skinned if he wishes to pursue a career in this role because this sort of behaviour (in a milder form) may be fairly common in this line of work, but on this occasion I fully agree with what other posters have said and sounds like a lot of lines have been crossed.
    • shortcrust
    • By shortcrust 7th Mar 18, 8:30 AM
    • 1,902 Posts
    • 2,785 Thanks
    shortcrust
    I think it is a fine line in workplaces like this.... You've got people who prefer a hands-on sort of job and, without stereotyping, a fair number have a sort of laddish and *rough* way about them.

    Not justifying it like, but calling a customer a "knob" and "tools" behind their back is not surprising to me... Also, the pay docking may be justified if your son has been making a hash of the job and not learning (employers like this usually have one style of teaching, and if you don't show progress they think you aren't cut out for the job).

    As practical advice I would suggest that your son become a bit thick-skinned if he wishes to pursue a career in this role because this sort of behaviour (in a milder form) may be fairly common in this line of work, but on this occasion I fully agree with what other posters have said and sounds like a lot of lines have been crossed.
    Originally posted by Les79
    I'm surprised it's surprising to anyone. I'm sure I've been called worse than that and I've probably consumed a bit of waiter spit over the years too.
    • LadyDee
    • By LadyDee 7th Mar 18, 8:42 AM
    • 2,852 Posts
    • 2,992 Thanks
    LadyDee
    If any semi-formal action is contemplated, such as calling ACAS, perhaps best to get a new job first, let things settle, then get on with a new apprenticeship in a more congenial atmosphere, and put it down to experience.

    It might be, in the future, he could be an employer and will remember his time with this person and treat his employees rather better.
    • bertiewhite
    • By bertiewhite 7th Mar 18, 8:58 AM
    • 1,064 Posts
    • 1,180 Thanks
    bertiewhite
    What part of the linked page do you think means the OP's son can do anything about it?
    Originally posted by shortcrust
    The "They could also call the Acas helpline for advice" bit.

    They were very helpful when my stepdaughter was being treated unfairly by a single owner business because she thought she could treat trainees any way she liked.
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