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  • FIRST POST
    • mezzyd
    • By mezzyd 6th Mar 18, 3:33 PM
    • 10Posts
    • 13Thanks
    mezzyd
    APCOA POPLA Bellingham Leisure Centre
    • #1
    • 6th Mar 18, 3:33 PM
    APCOA POPLA Bellingham Leisure Centre 6th Mar 18 at 3:33 PM
    Thanks to all the hints on this forum, I am fairly confident of a winning appeal at POPLA on poor signage & no keeper liability, but I hope someone can give some advice about the contract with landowner area. I have discovered that Bellingham Leisure Centre is not actually privately owned land at all, but owned by the London Borough of Lewisham. Any thoughts on how to approach this?
Page 1
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 6th Mar 18, 3:38 PM
    • 18,019 Posts
    • 28,539 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #2
    • 6th Mar 18, 3:38 PM
    • #2
    • 6th Mar 18, 3:38 PM
    If it's council owned, it's 'not relevant land' in the context of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, and as such there can be no keeper liability.

    You say you've already got keeper liability boxed off (presumably a non-compliant NtK from APCOA?), well add the fact that the car park land is council owned to doubly kill the PCN. Do you have written proof of council ownership? If so you do need to copy that in with your POPLA appeal.

    Are APCOA actually stating in the NtK that the keeper has liability?
    Last edited by Umkomaas; 06-03-2018 at 3:40 PM.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • mezzyd
    • By mezzyd 6th Mar 18, 3:48 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    mezzyd
    • #3
    • 6th Mar 18, 3:48 PM
    • #3
    • 6th Mar 18, 3:48 PM
    The original notice to keeper just asked to pay the amount or advise the name of the driver, no warning about passing of liability or mention of Protection of Freedoms Act, that's why I assumed the charge wouldn't hold up with POPLA
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 6th Mar 18, 3:50 PM
    • 9,502 Posts
    • 9,271 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #4
    • 6th Mar 18, 3:50 PM
    • #4
    • 6th Mar 18, 3:50 PM
    This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of contracts for alleged parking offences.

    Parking Eye, Smart and a smaller company have already been named and shamed, as has Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (who take hundreds of these cases to court, and nearly always lose), who have also been reported to the regulatory authority.

    The problem has become so rampant that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers. Watch the video of the Second Reading in the HofC recently.

    http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41

    and complain in the most robust terms to your MP. With a fair wind most of these companies may well be put out of business by Christmas.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 6th Mar 18, 4:10 PM
    • 18,019 Posts
    • 28,539 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #5
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:10 PM
    • #5
    • 6th Mar 18, 4:10 PM
    The original notice to keeper just asked to pay the amount or advise the name of the driver, no warning about passing of liability or mention of Protection of Freedoms Act, that's why I assumed the charge wouldn't hold up with POPLA
    Originally posted by mezzyd
    Yep, that's fine, well spotted - a non-compliant NtK. Slam dunk at POPLA as long as there is no identification of the driver.

    I doubt APCOA will even contest, so build a lengthy POPLA appeal - plenty of template points, to simply copy and paste, in the NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #2, use as many as possible (tweaked if necessary to cover your circumstances) to make the effort of dealing with it by APCOA unviable.

    If you want a regular to give it the once-over before submission, just paste a copy of it here, but you seem to have things under control yourself, if you're confident, wing it off to POPLA - .pdf file, tick 'Other' box as reason for appealing.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 6th Mar 18, 11:25 PM
    • 58,533 Posts
    • 72,030 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #6
    • 6th Mar 18, 11:25 PM
    • #6
    • 6th Mar 18, 11:25 PM
    Use any APCOA POPLA appeal shown on threads here recently, as your base (search the forum) and change the usual point about 'byelaws/no keeper liability' to 'Council owned land/no keeper liability'.

    Same sort of argument, as Umkomaas says the point is it's not relevant land, same as the byelaws ones we usually see from APCOA so yours only needs tweaks to make sense.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • mezzyd
    • By mezzyd 14th Mar 18, 12:01 AM
    • 10 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    mezzyd
    • #7
    • 14th Mar 18, 12:01 AM
    Appeal won
    • #7
    • 14th Mar 18, 12:01 AM
    Won at POPLA as APCOA chose not to contest, so thanks again - this forum is such a useful resource!
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 14th Mar 18, 12:09 AM
    • 36,811 Posts
    • 83,297 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    • #8
    • 14th Mar 18, 12:09 AM
    • #8
    • 14th Mar 18, 12:09 AM
    Won at POPLA as APCOA chose not to contest, so thanks again - this forum is such a useful resource!
    Originally posted by mezzyd
    Would you mind posting the PoPLA result in the PoPLA decisions thread please. This will help others in the same position.
    Last edited by Fruitcake; 14-03-2018 at 12:14 AM.
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