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  • FIRST POST
    • capital0ne
    • By capital0ne 4th Mar 18, 2:59 PM
    • 475Posts
    • 236Thanks
    capital0ne
    'Phoenix firm' burnt through my savings
    • #1
    • 4th Mar 18, 2:59 PM
    'Phoenix firm' burnt through my savings 4th Mar 18 at 2:59 PM
    Another week goes by and yet another news story about bad Financial Advisors as reported in The Sunday Times 4 Mar 2018 (@ST_Money)
    The article reports:

    Terence Brimble of Chippenham, Wilts received fees in excess of £100,000 over five years from Jackie Naghten and Louise Brassey who were his clients.

    His recommended investments went badly wrong and the two clients were refunded the maximum of £50,000 each from the FSCS (the maximum allowed), but this was fraction of the money they lost.

    Mr Brimble liquidated his firm Knightsbridge Financial Management in Dec 2016 after he started receiving complaints from clients (not too professional). The firm had £1m in outstanding claims.
    Brimble however set up a new company Knightsbridge Personal & Corporate Solutions, part of Intrinsic, one of Britains largest networks of advisors.

    This is not an isolated case, since April 2015 the FSCS has ruled in favour of 55,515 people, 6,387 of which have received the maximum payout of £50,000.

    So my tip to you is to be very careful of taking advice or service from any advisor, you first question should be to any advisor, show me your career history, who have you worked for and why did you leave, bit like a job interview, after all you are employing them and paying their salary.

    I would also ask if they have had any complaints, ever had one upheld by the FSCS or the FOS (which can award compensation of £150,000).

    Better still learn to do this yourself and don't rely on advisors - you could be very badly burnt, like the 55,515 people have since April 2015.
Page 1
    • Keep pedalling
    • By Keep pedalling 4th Mar 18, 3:31 PM
    • 4,991 Posts
    • 5,554 Thanks
    Keep pedalling
    • #2
    • 4th Mar 18, 3:31 PM
    • #2
    • 4th Mar 18, 3:31 PM
    I would love to see a comparison of those who have been hard done by by advisors, and those who have managed to balls it up all by themselves.
    • capital0ne
    • By capital0ne 4th Mar 18, 4:13 PM
    • 475 Posts
    • 236 Thanks
    capital0ne
    • #3
    • 4th Mar 18, 4:13 PM
    • #3
    • 4th Mar 18, 4:13 PM
    I would love to see a comparison of those who have been hard done by by advisors, and those who have managed to balls it up all by themselves.
    Originally posted by Keep pedalling
    Actually that would be interesting, lets get the list going now, thanks for your suggestion
    • Tcquins
    • By Tcquins 4th Mar 18, 5:19 PM
    • 52 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    Tcquins
    • #4
    • 4th Mar 18, 5:19 PM
    • #4
    • 4th Mar 18, 5:19 PM
    No doubt phoenixing is a big issue, and drives other IFAs nuts as it tarnishes the reputation of the industry.

    Why the FCA does not de-authorise individuals like this I do not know.

    Most understand that there is good and bad in every industry, and the vast majority are hardworking, diligent individuals who have their clients best interests at heart.

    Must mean we should leave the general public to it; after all they never fall foul of investments like guaranteed mini-bonds...
    Last edited by Tcquins; 04-03-2018 at 5:21 PM. Reason: Annoying punctuation bug
    • Keep pedalling
    • By Keep pedalling 4th Mar 18, 6:53 PM
    • 4,991 Posts
    • 5,554 Thanks
    Keep pedalling
    • #5
    • 4th Mar 18, 6:53 PM
    • #5
    • 4th Mar 18, 6:53 PM
    Actually that would be interesting, lets get the list going now, thanks for your suggestion
    Originally posted by capital0ne
    Trouble is most people are not too happy to admit failures from either being duped by some flaky adviser, or making terrible financial decisions themselves, so I donít expect too many to come forward here.
    • Malthusian
    • By Malthusian 5th Mar 18, 10:39 AM
    • 4,095 Posts
    • 6,409 Thanks
    Malthusian
    • #6
    • 5th Mar 18, 10:39 AM
    • #6
    • 5th Mar 18, 10:39 AM
    I would love to see a comparison of those who have been hard done by by advisors, and those who have managed to balls it up all by themselves.
    Originally posted by Keep pedalling
    Hard done by by advisers
    Entitled to redress up to £150,000 from the Financial Ombudsman Service (the FOS can recommend larger awards, but sums above £150,000 are not binding)
    Those with larger losses are still entitled to redress via the courts
    If the company does not have the resources to pay, does not have professional indemnity insurance, and goes into liquidation, their compensation is instead paid by the Financial Services Compensation Scheme, up to £50,000 per investor

    Balls it up by themselves
    Lose all their money
    No redress
    No compensation scheme

    That's the comparison of the position. A comparison of the numbers involved is virtually impossible, as people who are the victims of scams tend to be vocal about it (very reasonably) and Ombudsman and court decisions are a matter of public record. People who balls it up by themselves tend to keep very quiet about it.
    • justme111
    • By justme111 5th Mar 18, 11:44 AM
    • 2,987 Posts
    • 2,879 Thanks
    justme111
    • #7
    • 5th Mar 18, 11:44 AM
    • #7
    • 5th Mar 18, 11:44 AM
    we all know builders whos fences fall and kitchens are fitted barely holding together; dentists who's fillings come out the day after they were placed time after time; plumbers who never turn up for jobs , banks that mess up etc etc. Does not mean the right course of action would be mending one's own teeth although many if they can do their kitchens themselves
    • Aegis
    • By Aegis 5th Mar 18, 12:19 PM
    • 4,894 Posts
    • 3,103 Thanks
    Aegis
    • #8
    • 5th Mar 18, 12:19 PM
    • #8
    • 5th Mar 18, 12:19 PM
    No doubt phoenixing is a big issue, and drives other IFAs nuts as it tarnishes the reputation of the industry.

    Why the FCA does not de-authorise individuals like this I do not know.

    Most understand that there is good and bad in every industry, and the vast majority are hardworking, diligent individuals who have their clients best interests at heart.

    Must mean we should leave the general public to it; after all they never fall foul of investments like guaranteed mini-bonds...
    Originally posted by Tcquins
    Yep, it's infuriating to see this happen, and I'd like to see advisers responsible for this facing jail time and a permanent ban from regulated roles rather than being allowed to just wash away their liabilities and join a new firm to carry on ruining lives.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser
    Anything I say on the forum is for discussion purposes only and should not be construed as personal financial advice. It is vitally important to do your own research before acting on information gathered from any users on this forum.
    • justme111
    • By justme111 5th Mar 18, 12:46 PM
    • 2,987 Posts
    • 2,879 Thanks
    justme111
    • #9
    • 5th Mar 18, 12:46 PM
    • #9
    • 5th Mar 18, 12:46 PM
    blanket permanent ban would be too harsh and would have unintended consequences resulting in lower quality advice where advisors would practice even more defensively with even more paperwork and vastly increased cost
    • Superscrooge
    • By Superscrooge 5th Mar 18, 1:20 PM
    • 1,081 Posts
    • 775 Thanks
    Superscrooge
    There are over 5,000 IFA's and as in any profession there will be some cowboys. These articles always highlight the bad guys.

    It wouldn't be much of a story if the newspaper wrote an article describing how an IFA gave excellent investment and tax planning advice and saved the client a fortune in CGT, pension fees, IHT etc.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 5th Mar 18, 1:47 PM
    • 92,611 Posts
    • 59,921 Thanks
    dunstonh
    There are over 5,000 IFA's and as in any profession there will be some cowboys. These articles always highlight the bad guys.
    The total figure is actually quite interesting as there are a further 15000 FAs. The total figure has hovered around 20,000 since RDR. Go back 15 years and you were looking in the hundreds of thousands if you include insurance agents (who effectively had the same authorisations). At its peak, it was nearly 300,000.

    The articles in the media exist because the scenarios are newsworthy as they are not commonplace.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • Aegis
    • By Aegis 5th Mar 18, 3:49 PM
    • 4,894 Posts
    • 3,103 Thanks
    Aegis
    blanket permanent ban would be too harsh and would have unintended consequences resulting in lower quality advice where advisors would practice even more defensively with even more paperwork and vastly increased cost
    Originally posted by justme111
    When you're talking about company directors taking six or seven figure sums for putting client money into unregulated rubbish, I'd be all for a blanket ban unless they stick around to properly deal with the consequences of what they did. We have a mandatory exam on ethics and regulation, clearly the bosses of such firms either cheat in order to pass that exam or they completely ignore the content and just do whatever makes them the most money. Either way, they shouldn't be allowed to advise again.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser
    Anything I say on the forum is for discussion purposes only and should not be construed as personal financial advice. It is vitally important to do your own research before acting on information gathered from any users on this forum.
    • capital0ne
    • By capital0ne 5th Mar 18, 3:51 PM
    • 475 Posts
    • 236 Thanks
    capital0ne
    I would love to see a comparison of those who have been hard done by by advisors, and those who have managed to balls it up all by themselves.
    Originally posted by Keep pedalling
    I agree, but I do know 55,515 people who would come forward
    • capital0ne
    • By capital0ne 5th Mar 18, 3:57 PM
    • 475 Posts
    • 236 Thanks
    capital0ne
    The total figure is actually quite interesting as there are a further 15000 FAs. The total figure has hovered around 20,000 since RDR. Go back 15 years and you were looking in the hundreds of thousands if you include insurance agents (who effectively had the same authorisations). At its peak, it was nearly 300,000.

    The articles in the media exist because the scenarios are newsworthy as they are not commonplace.
    Originally posted by dunstonh
    So there are 20,000 I/FAs, so there could be quite a few bad ones, a few hundred I would guess.

    So folks, when you seek one out I would strongly suggest you interview them first, like a job interview, ask to see their career history for the past 10 years, ask them about their success stories, and their biggest mistakes and what they did to correct it.
    I would also want to see three references from their line managers, and customers.
    If they aren't willing to provide this information, move on to the next one.

    Then start your discussions and good luck, it's a jungle out there
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 5th Mar 18, 4:15 PM
    • 92,611 Posts
    • 59,921 Thanks
    dunstonh
    How does this differ from any other profession apart from your obsession with being anti-IFA?
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
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