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    • samsung laptop
    • By samsung laptop 4th Mar 18, 10:47 AM
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    samsung laptop
    Does community speed watch scheme work
    • #1
    • 4th Mar 18, 10:47 AM
    Does community speed watch scheme work 4th Mar 18 at 10:47 AM
    I've just read that a town I drive through daily is starting a community speed watch scheme but do they work. They say the watch is run by members of the community with the support of the police neighbourhood policing team. Recruited volunteers receive full training in using a speed monitoring device and is given a training pack with details of roads that have been risk assessed and a high viz jacket.There is no time limit, volunteers can stay on site as long as they like and leave when they see fit. When speeds have been recorded, all the results are sent back to the officers in charge and warning letters are issued to the registered owner of the vehicle if there is a second occurrence of speeding.
Page 1
    • EdGasketTheSecond
    • By EdGasketTheSecond 4th Mar 18, 10:53 AM
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    EdGasketTheSecond
    • #2
    • 4th Mar 18, 10:53 AM
    • #2
    • 4th Mar 18, 10:53 AM
    It probably works while they are watching, but I doubt has any lasting impact. A lot of these schemes are in 20mph zones and most road users exceed that speed in my experience and are quite aggressive when I drive at 20 and won't speed up.
    • Deastons
    • By Deastons 4th Mar 18, 10:56 AM
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    Deastons
    • #3
    • 4th Mar 18, 10:56 AM
    • #3
    • 4th Mar 18, 10:56 AM
    I've just read that a town I drive through daily is starting a community speed watch scheme but do they work. They say the watch is run by members of the community with the support of the police neighbourhood policing team. Recruited volunteers receive full training in using a speed monitoring device and is given a training pack with details of roads that have been risk assessed and a high viz jacket.There is no time limit, volunteers can stay on site as long as they like and leave when they see fit. When speeds have been recorded, all the results are sent back to the officers in charge and warning letters are issued to the registered owner of the vehicle if there is a second occurrence of speeding.
    Originally posted by samsung laptop
    When you say "Do they work?" are you asking as a resident who is concerned about speeding drivers who is considering starting their own community speed watch, or as a driver who doesn't want to add a couple of minutes to their commute and wants to know if they should bother slowing down?

    Because your post seems to simply describe the process.
    • photome
    • By photome 4th Mar 18, 11:36 AM
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    photome
    • #4
    • 4th Mar 18, 11:36 AM
    • #4
    • 4th Mar 18, 11:36 AM
    yes they work and you can get a fine and points...if that is what you are asking.
    • neilmcl
    • By neilmcl 4th Mar 18, 11:44 AM
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    • #5
    • 4th Mar 18, 11:44 AM
    • #5
    • 4th Mar 18, 11:44 AM
    yes they work and you can get a fine and points...if that is what you are asking.
    Originally posted by photome
    Only if the "neighbourhood policing team" are present.

    Although this may change as it was reported recently that the Chief Constable of Lincolnshire police is considering giving powers to the volunteers themselves allowing them to issue fines.
    • George Michael
    • By George Michael 4th Mar 18, 12:00 PM
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    • #6
    • 4th Mar 18, 12:00 PM
    • #6
    • 4th Mar 18, 12:00 PM
    yes they work and you can get a fine and points...if that is what you are asking.
    Originally posted by photome
    Not yet you cant.
    In many cases, the equipment issued to the speedwatch people isn't approved for enforcement purposes and even if it is, it is only the police or safety camera partnership officials (by way of manned points or camera locations) who can carry out speed checks for enforcement purposes.
    https://www.communityspeedwatch.co.uk/FRONT-Faq.php?m=50

    Does equipment need calibration on a regular basis?

    The most commonly used equipment are based on radar technology and although approved for use in the UK/EU, they do not necessarily figure on the list of Home Office approved devices. Home Office approval refers to equipment used for Enforcement. Devices in this category mostly use laser technology and require an annual calibration certificate as proof of accuracy when offence records obtained with this equipment is presented in court as evidence.

    For as long as Speedwatch remains an educational scheme, annual calibration is not required in most counties. Regular accuracy check of radar devices using accompanying tuning forks is recommended, however. When tested, an accuracy within +/- 1MPH is acceptable in most areas.
    A check of the police force or speedwatch websites in any area where this scheme operates will show the same.
    Here are a few examples from around the country.

    http://www.staffssaferroads.co.uk/my-community/community-speed-watch
    If it is identified that the vehicle has been caught speeding through any Speed Watch for the third time within 12 months, the background of the vehicle will be checked and information will be passed to the appropriate local policing team who will organise for the keeper to be visited and warned.

    Areas where speeding issues remain may also be targeted for enforcement activity.
    https://surrey.police.uk/policies-and-procedures/community-speed-watch-procedure-for-initiation-and-operation/
    After a first recorded offence, the registered keeper of the vehicle will be sent a yellow warning letter by post.
    After a second recorded offence, a further warning letter will be sent to the registered keeper. This can also be posted or, for maximum impact, hand delivered by the CRO, if there is the resource to do so.

    A maximum of two letters in total will be sent to the same registered keeper. If CSW activity identifies a vehicle on a third occasion, where possible, the registered keeper will be visited by a CRO who will undertake a document check and give general driving/speeding advice. After this visit, the vehicle details should be circulated for possible targeted police intervention, with a view to prosecution, or other appropriate sanction.

    http://speedwatch.info/community-speedwatch-faqs.html
    Can motorists be prosecuted?

    No these checks are about educating motorists.
    https://www.kent.police.uk/advice/community-support/speedwatch/
    The owners of vehicles who've been repeatedly seen speeding or have been recorded at more than 50% over the limit are sent a letter of advice.
    • Warwick Hunt
    • By Warwick Hunt 4th Mar 18, 12:01 PM
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    Warwick Hunt
    • #7
    • 4th Mar 18, 12:01 PM
    • #7
    • 4th Mar 18, 12:01 PM
    Only if the "neighbourhood policing team" are present.

    Although this may change as it was reported recently that the Chief Constable of Lincolnshire police is considering giving powers to the volunteers themselves allowing them to issue fines.
    Originally posted by neilmcl
    But only if the neighbourhood policing team are present.
    • giraffe69
    • By giraffe69 4th Mar 18, 12:08 PM
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    giraffe69
    • #8
    • 4th Mar 18, 12:08 PM
    • #8
    • 4th Mar 18, 12:08 PM
    We have one in a local village. It would be dangerous to drive through it a 40+ miles per hour but the limit is, of course, 20 for no very good reason (it's 30 past the local primary school)
    Some local busy bodies stand by the village hall and look disapproving whilst licking their pencils before recording your car reg. It is effective as it is easier for me to take an alternative route than face the pensioner's army.
    The letter received for driving at more than 20 (no specific speed mentioned) wags a metaphorical finger, says that "on this one occasion" blah blah and make non specific threats about a second or subsequent "offence". Not sure how they would have the evidence to issue a speeding ticket based on a notebook and the dodgy eyes of the observers. I think it is a smoke and mirrors type of operation with no real teeth.
    • Johno100
    • By Johno100 4th Mar 18, 12:37 PM
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    • #9
    • 4th Mar 18, 12:37 PM
    • #9
    • 4th Mar 18, 12:37 PM
    It'll be effective if they are doing it in this weather for a few hours and it ends up killing some of the old farts off.
    • JJ Egan
    • By JJ Egan 4th Mar 18, 12:55 PM
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    JJ Egan
    Small village we will slow the traffic down with our speed guns .
    Then we will be free to speed as we always do in our village and speed in your village as well.
    • Jackmydad
    • By Jackmydad 4th Mar 18, 1:00 PM
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    Jackmydad
    I can see it's possibly a good thing in some places where things are really bad.
    But then if things are that bad, why not a proper speed camera?
    I wouldn't do it myself though. It reminds me of this too much somehow.
    "Luck happens where hard work meets opportunity"
    • Mids_Costcutter
    • By Mids_Costcutter 4th Mar 18, 1:48 PM
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    Mids_Costcutter
    the limit is, of course, 20 for no very good reason (it's 30 past the local primary school)
    Originally posted by giraffe69
    RoSPA point out in their 20mph road safety factsheet that the fatality risk for pedestrians is 1.5% when hit at 20mph but 8% at 30mph.

    https://www.rospa.com/rospaweb/docs/advice-services/road-safety/drivers/20-mph-zone-factsheet.pdf

    Is that good enough reason?
    • shaun from Africa
    • By shaun from Africa 4th Mar 18, 1:59 PM
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    shaun from Africa
    RoSPA point out in their 20mph road safety factsheet that the fatality risk for pedestrians is 1.5% when hit at 20mph but 8% at 30mph.

    https://www.rospa.com/rospaweb/docs/advice-services/road-safety/drivers/20-mph-zone-factsheet.pdf

    Is that good enough reason?
    Originally posted by Mids_Costcutter
    But that still doesn't make much sense with regard to the post you quote where the limit in question ia 20mph through the village but 30mph past the local primary school.
    As the risk of death is far lower with the reduced speed, why not have the limit at 20mph where there is a very good chance that many young children will be on or very near to the road?
    • Mids_Costcutter
    • By Mids_Costcutter 4th Mar 18, 2:22 PM
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    Mids_Costcutter
    The point I was trying to make is that a 20mph limit could benefit the whole village. I don't know why the lower limit wasn't extended to the school, maybe it should be, but trips on foot to the school will (at least partially) now be made on a road with a 20mph not 30mph limit. Perhaps the OP (with local knowledge) could shed some more light on the matter?
    • discat11
    • By discat11 4th Mar 18, 2:28 PM
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    discat11
    They probably work however I wrote in & complained when I got a letter completely incorrectly (I'd never even been to the damn village & still haven't and it was the other end of the country!) with a rather aggressively worded letter from the local Police.

    I particularly found the part about being considered for prosecution if reported twice ridiculous since there would be no proof whatsoever that would stand up to scrutiny since as far as I am aware they aren't equipped with photographic equipment -for one offence let alone two!

    Frankly, I think they may well 'work' but they're mostly there just to keep the locals concerned with speeding happy.
    • giraffe69
    • By giraffe69 4th Mar 18, 2:37 PM
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    giraffe69
    Is that good enough reason?
    No. Should it apply to all roads with pedestrians? Presumably if the fatality risk drops from 30 to 20 it will be even lower if people with red flags precede the car and there is a limit of 4mph. There has to be a balance between safety and progress. There is also a road near this village which is narrow and winding. It has no speed limit other than the national one but anyone driving at more than, say, 40mph would be a reckless lunatic. I fear that speed limits are often imposed to satisfy local feeling of old codgers and without proper regard to real issues of safety and without allowing for any degree of common sense. I like the French system of one motorway speed in dry conditions of about 82mph and a lower one rigorously enforced if there is heavy rain, snow and/or fog. Similarly if 20mph was sensible past a school at some times of the day it isn't hard to make it 30mph the rest of the time and during holidays. It's harder to get people to stick to the limit if it is held in general disregard (well at least with the resources available).

    No idea why the 20 mph limit is as it is but it covers the centre of the village and the school is just outside this zone.
    • Car 54
    • By Car 54 4th Mar 18, 3:36 PM
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    Car 54
    I particularly found the part about being considered for prosecution if reported twice ridiculous since there would be no proof whatsoever that would stand up to scrutiny since as far as I am aware they aren't equipped with photographic equipment -for one offence let alone two!
    Originally posted by discat11
    Why would they need photographic equipment?

    People were successfully prosecuted for centuries before the camera was invented, and still are.
    • Tarambor
    • By Tarambor 4th Mar 18, 4:08 PM
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    Tarambor
    Small village we will slow the traffic down with our speed guns .
    Then we will be free to speed as we always do in our village and speed in your village as well.
    Originally posted by JJ Egan
    I remember reading a story about a village where they'd campaigned for years for a speed camera and once they got one it was mostly the villagers who campaigned for it who were caught speeding.
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 4th Mar 18, 4:36 PM
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    AdrianC
    I'm quite happy for wake-up calls to be sent to people who can't wrap their heads around the potential issues posed by somebody in hivis waving a hairdryer at them - or who don't actually realise they're exceeding the speed limit...

    Perhaps it'll persuade them to pay a little more attention to the world outside their window, in case something more serious crops up?
    • Mids_Costcutter
    • By Mids_Costcutter 4th Mar 18, 5:45 PM
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    Mids_Costcutter
    No. Should it apply to all roads with pedestrians? Presumably if the fatality risk drops from 30 to 20 it will be even lower if people with red flags precede the car and there is a limit of 4mph. There has to be a balance between safety and progress. There is also a road near this village which is narrow and winding. It has no speed limit other than the national one but anyone driving at more than, say, 40mph would be a reckless lunatic. I fear that speed limits are often imposed to satisfy local feeling of old codgers and without proper regard to real issues of safety and without allowing for any degree of common sense. I like the French system of one motorway speed in dry conditions of about 82mph and a lower one rigorously enforced if there is heavy rain, snow and/or fog. Similarly if 20mph was sensible past a school at some times of the day it isn't hard to make it 30mph the rest of the time and during holidays. It's harder to get people to stick to the limit if it is held in general disregard (well at least with the resources available).

    No idea why the 20 mph limit is as it is but it covers the centre of the village and the school is just outside this zone.
    Originally posted by giraffe69
    I wasn't advocating 4mph, but 20mph is plenty within the built-up area where there will be more pedestrians and cyclists (not just school children). This makes hardly any difference to journey times compared to 30mph, so no need to be concerned with 'progress'. So what exactly is the 'local feeling of old codgers'? Perhaps they're afraid to cross the road? Yes, some motorists might need time to accept lower speed limits just as some have a complete disregard for any speed limit. However drink driving used to be socially acceptable for a majority and now no longer is.

    For me any time that community speed watch are out it's having a positive effect on driver behaviour and helping to support the police.
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