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  • FIRST POST
    • stationcarparkticket2018
    • By stationcarparkticket2018 2nd Mar 18, 1:54 PM
    • 1Posts
    • 9Thanks
    stationcarparkticket2018
    Indigo Railway PCN - clarifying the process
    • #1
    • 2nd Mar 18, 1:54 PM
    Indigo Railway PCN - clarifying the process 2nd Mar 18 at 1:54 PM
    Ok, really truly I have read the Newbie thread and lots of recent threads on Indigo Railway tickets and the Railway Byelaw. I'm just trying to get the process and expectations clear in my head and for anyone else questioning an Indigo Railway PCN as of Feb 2018.

    I got a window ticket from Indigo for 'Obstruction' in a railway car park earlier this week. My car was parked at the end of a row of cars but not in a dedicated parking bay. You could have got a bus in between my car and any others. I wasn't blocking any entrance/exit/cars in/walkways etc but whatever, it's their opinion vs mine and no doubt anyone not in a parking bay is fair game to them. For info, I haven't responded at all yet and I am not the registered keeper (that's my husband).

    So I gather:

    First off, I should ignore the PCN and wait for the NtK.
    In the Newbie thread it says Indigo aren't getting details from DVLA any more, but then in another couple of threads it says they are...

    So assuming they do get registered keeper's details from DVLA and send a NtK, then I respond (in the keeper's name) with the standard BPA appeal template and refuse to name the driver.

    My appeal will no doubt be refused at which point Indigo won't issue me a POPLA code as BPA says they're no longer letting them use this process because of the Railway Byelaws issue.

    If I don't reply/pay up the next step will be getting letters from ZZPS which I can ignore or reply to, to string it out. Next stage will be getting letters from QDR Solicitors threatening to take me to court. Again I can reply/ignore to string it out and wait for the flood of threatening letters but once 6 months has passed from when the ticket is issued there can be no further action in Magistrates.

    And theoretically they could never take me to Magistrates anyway if they don't know who the driver was? Only the TOC can do that, and they have no incentive as any fines collected go to the Govt.

    Is that all correct? I'm not really interested in arguing technical points with them or complaining to my MP, Trading Standards or the ICO. I just want minimal involvement but will respond to letters keep things stringing along if needed.

    Finally, thank you all very much, you're doing a great job in providing all this info so regularly and in your own time - well done, it's absolutely invaluable.
Page 1
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 2nd Mar 18, 1:57 PM
    • 1,262 Posts
    • 1,713 Thanks
    twhitehousescat
    • #2
    • 2nd Mar 18, 1:57 PM
    • #2
    • 2nd Mar 18, 1:57 PM
    well done , you have sussed the indigo fiasco
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • waamo
    • By waamo 2nd Mar 18, 2:04 PM
    • 3,180 Posts
    • 4,207 Thanks
    waamo
    • #3
    • 2nd Mar 18, 2:04 PM
    • #3
    • 2nd Mar 18, 2:04 PM
    Ok, really truly I have read the Newbie thread and lots of recent threads on Indigo Railway tickets and the Railway Byelaw. I'm just trying to get the process and expectations clear in my head and for anyone else questioning an Indigo Railway PCN as of Feb 2018.

    I got a window ticket from Indigo for 'Obstruction' in a railway car park earlier this week. My car was parked at the end of a row of cars but not in a dedicated parking bay. You could have got a bus in between my car and any others. I wasn't blocking any entrance/exit/cars in/walkways etc but whatever, it's their opinion vs mine and no doubt anyone not in a parking bay is fair game to them. For info, I haven't responded at all yet and I am not the registered keeper (that's my husband).

    So I gather:

    First off, I should ignore the PCN and wait for the NtK.
    In the Newbie thread it says Indigo aren't getting details from DVLA any more, but then in another couple of threads it says they are...

    So assuming they do get registered keeper's details from DVLA and send a NtK, then I respond (in the keeper's name) with the standard BPA appeal template and refuse to name the driver.

    My appeal will no doubt be refused at which point Indigo won't issue me a POPLA code as BPA says they're no longer letting them use this process because of the Railway Byelaws issue.

    If I don't reply/pay up the next step will be getting letters from ZZPS which I can ignore or reply to, to string it out. Next stage will be getting letters from QDR Solicitors threatening to take me to court. Again I can reply/ignore to string it out and wait for the flood of threatening letters but once 6 months has passed from when the ticket is issued there can be no further action in Magistrates.

    And theoretically they could never take me to Magistrates anyway if they don't know who the driver was? Only the TOC can do that, and they have no incentive as any fines collected go to the Govt.

    Is that all correct? I'm not really interested in arguing technical points with them or complaining to my MP, Trading Standards or the ICO. I just want minimal involvement but will respond to letters keep things stringing along if needed.

    Finally, thank you all very much, you're doing a great job in providing all this info so regularly and in your own time - well done, it's absolutely invaluable.
    Originally posted by stationcarparkticket2018
    Can I nominate this as the best ever first post by a Newbie?
    This space for hire.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 2nd Mar 18, 4:16 PM
    • 17,562 Posts
    • 27,763 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #4
    • 2nd Mar 18, 4:16 PM
    • #4
    • 2nd Mar 18, 4:16 PM
    Can I nominate this as the best ever first post by a Newbie
    Is it Coupon-mad in disguise?

    I agree @waamo - great understanding and great first post @stationcarparkticket2018. You really should come and join us.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 2nd Mar 18, 4:19 PM
    • 57,327 Posts
    • 70,927 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #5
    • 2nd Mar 18, 4:19 PM
    • #5
    • 2nd Mar 18, 4:19 PM
    I'll use this thread as an answer to the Q&A: 'My ticket is from Indigo at a railway, what do I do?'

    A perfect summary from a good researcher, a woman after my own heart. Stick around!
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Johno100
    • By Johno100 2nd Mar 18, 4:23 PM
    • 3,723 Posts
    • 4,324 Thanks
    Johno100
    • #6
    • 2nd Mar 18, 4:23 PM
    • #6
    • 2nd Mar 18, 4:23 PM
    I think we should bottle that OP and dispense it liberally on every new Indigo/Railway car park thread that is posted.

    (Sorry for food analogy, just caught up on last nights Masterchef and I'm now starving)
    • Redx
    • By Redx 2nd Mar 18, 9:21 PM
    • 18,096 Posts
    • 22,880 Thanks
    Redx
    • #7
    • 2nd Mar 18, 9:21 PM
    • #7
    • 2nd Mar 18, 9:21 PM
    the only error I can see is any use of the words "ME , MYSELF & I" , mainly in the second paragraph

    The vehicle was parked................................

    The VEHICLE was not causing..............................

    The DRIVER did...........................


    you should edit post #1 as if talking about a story that you heard , or you saw, but never about what anyone DID except the DRIVER and the KEEPER

    well done for grasping the whole concept of the sc@m

    so yes if an NTK arrives to the keeper, the keeper appeals it with the template

    then its IGNORE anything else except a formal LBC, and/or an MCOL , within 6 years

    we will assume for now that the TOC is not going to issue a penalty under the bylaws and NOT take anyone at all to a magistrates court (we havent seen that happen yet and I doubt that it will ever happen)
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • L86
    • By L86 6th Mar 18, 11:18 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    L86
    • #8
    • 6th Mar 18, 11:18 PM
    • #8
    • 6th Mar 18, 11:18 PM
    This is extremely helpful thank you!
    To clarify they are getting details from DVLA as i received a NtK dated 31st Jan 2018
    I ignored it as i was away for work an have opened on the same day a ZZPS dated 1st march 2018
    My ticket was issued 20th October 2017 for being outside a marked bay.
    I was on a station side road (at the side of the station not in the car park, in a bay i was slightly out due to the car in front) There's no signage how to pay a ticket, or about the bays.
    I did pay as marked bays i assumed the car park was under the same company.
    I believe i'm too late to appeal the NtK, 6 weeks from the 6 Months ill carry on ignoring.
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 7th Mar 18, 12:00 AM
    • 1,262 Posts
    • 1,713 Thanks
    twhitehousescat
    • #9
    • 7th Mar 18, 12:00 AM
    • #9
    • 7th Mar 18, 12:00 AM
    This is extremely helpful thank you!
    To clarify they are getting details from DVLA as i received a NtK dated 31st Jan 2018
    I ignored it as i was away for work an have opened on the same day a ZZPS dated 1st march 2018
    My ticket was issued 20th October 2017 for being outside a marked bay.
    I was on a station side road (at the side of the station not in the car park, in a bay i was slightly out due to the car in front) There's no signage how to pay a ticket, or about the bays.
    I did pay as marked bays i assumed the car park was under the same company.
    I believe i'm too late to appeal the NtK, 6 weeks from the 6 Months ill carry on ignoring.
    Originally posted by L86
    in your case , it may NOT be a bylaw case , perhaps you should start a new thread
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 12th Mar 18, 3:17 PM
    • 9,203 Posts
    • 8,968 Thanks
    The Deep
    As you will no doubt already be aware, this is aqn industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of contracts for alleged parking offences. It is currently totally unregulated

    Parking Eye, CP, Smart,and a smaller company have already been named and shamed, as has Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each year). They nearly always lose) and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P.

    The problem has become so rampant that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers. Watch the video of the Second Reading in the HofC recently.

    http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41

    and complain in the most robust terms to your MP. With a fair wind most of these companies may well be put out of business by Christmas.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Shands1
    • By Shands1 11th Apr 18, 5:45 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Shands1
    Help please...
    This is my first post so I apologise for jumping onto someone else’s question/thread but it’s very similar to my situation, I parked at Barnt Green station and due to no mot bays I parked where a couple of other vehicles had parked assuming it was classed as an overflow (was new to the station) caused no obstruction, returned to a PCN from Indigo stating I was parker in an ‘unauthorised’ place. I contested it explaining there were no bays and other cars were parked there etc. Anyway received a response refusing my appeal stating it states on ‘Our T&Cs that all vehicles must be parked in a bay’ I made a trip to the car park on a Saturday just to make sure as I hadn’t recalled seeing any T&Cs. Hard to describe but you drive up and round to the left into the car park, the bays are in this section as well as the ticket machine and platforms. The only signage in this area is ‘have you paid and displayed’ nothing mentioning T&Cs - so I thought great I ‘have them’ then I spotted in the distance what appeared to be a signage anyway blow me it was but positioned as far away from the actual parking area as possible! I took photographic evidence showing that it isn’t anywhere near the parking bays or in fact anywhere where you would even walk past before heading to your train and also you couldn’t even see it from this area as well! So I decide to tweet Indigo of course they are quick to reply and apologise and offer to look into but of course ask you to direct message (away from the public) what started as a very helpful offer of help quickly turned into dealing with a robot who continued to say I must read the T&Cs before exciting my vehicle bla bla I tried to explain that the T&Cs signage is nowhere near to where you park etc but again was met with more or less the same answers but of course contradicting their previous answers as I was asking different questions they said the ‘site manager (that of course cannot be named) states the T&Cs signage is within the boundaries of the station and also at the entrance so is deemed ‘fine’ but then of course due to the By Laws etc I cannot appeal again, but told me to contact West Mids Trains as they dictate how often the car park is patrolled (as I questioned why it wasn’t obviously not being patrolled daily) but WMT said it was nothing to do with them but did agree that if other people are parking in this ‘overflow’ then it would be recommended Indigo need to make this area known that you cannot park there! Of course all responses have been ignored now from them via twitter messages - I have refused to pay the fine but had a letter from this Zzzz debt collectors asking for £170 from reading all the previous comments I’m guessing I just ignore this letter (and anymore going forward) and sit it out? Shall I tweet my local MP as per the links other people have supplied? What I find frustrating is Indigo are using bully tactics and you don’t seem to have any rights and nobody to say actually yeah you’re right it’s ‘we have an answer for everything’ even though it’s a load of rubbish! Thank you and sorry for the lengthy comment!
    • waamo
    • By waamo 11th Apr 18, 6:11 PM
    • 3,180 Posts
    • 4,207 Thanks
    waamo
    You should start your own thread rather than hijack one. Copy that text into a new thread and please put some paragraphs in, I couldn't read that giant wall of text.
    This space for hire.
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 11th Apr 18, 6:14 PM
    • 7,143 Posts
    • 6,599 Thanks
    KeithP
    This is my first post so I apologise...
    Originally posted by Shands1
    Shands1, welcome to the forums.

    You need to read the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread to better understand the game you are now caught up in.

    Having done that, you might want to start you own thread to ask any questions. When doing so, you would be wise to break up that wall of text to allow others to read it easier.

    Many of the regulars on here won't bother with unreadable posts.
    Who can blame them?
    Help others to help you.
    .
    • Shands1
    • By Shands1 11th Apr 18, 6:37 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Shands1
    Thank you for your advice - sorry for the bulk (OTT informative hijack!) I couldn’t seem to see how/where I started my own comment.... thank you
    • bobthesod
    • By bobthesod 13th Apr 18, 5:23 PM
    • 65 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    bobthesod
    Will the posters who are in the position of asking for advice PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE amend all references to 'I parked here' and any other phrase that starts with the self incriminating word I delete them and replace the word I with the words THE DRIVER did etc etc
    This really should be a sticky advising all new enquiries to read as such,

    BEFORE POSTING PLEASE READ THIS

    We know the firms read these forums, the new poster may not
    Last edited by bobthesod; 14-04-2018 at 1:57 PM.
    • danslucky
    • By danslucky 24th Apr 18, 1:30 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danslucky
    Appeal to Indigo not lodged in time?
    The only situation not covered (at least I couldn't find it) is where an appeal to the Indigo NtK has not been lodged "in time". What should one do where no response at all has been sent to Indigo or debt collector's letters (ZZPS). ZZPS letters are threatening a private criminal prosecution for breach of Railway Byelaw 14. The PCN was issued in January. The NtK received beginning of March. The expiry of the 6 months period is not far away.

    Would you recommend responding to the Indigo NtK now using the template in any case? If so, worth responding to the ZZPS letter at the same time (or perhaps just fowarding to them the reply sent to Indigo?) - Or is it best to just continue to bury one's head in the sand at this stage and not engage either of them in any dialogue at all?

    Great advice on here thank you! I just wish it had been followed! but hope you won't mind advising on the current position in any case.

    Last edited by danslucky; 24-04-2018 at 1:35 PM.
    • waamo
    • By waamo 24th Apr 18, 2:14 PM
    • 3,180 Posts
    • 4,207 Thanks
    waamo
    There is no appeal timetable in a byelaws situation. The only timetable is one the company have artificially invented.

    Reply questioning where there time limits for appeal come from, is it statutory or due to codes of practice? They love tying themselves up in knots avoiding giving answers.
    This space for hire.
    • danslucky
    • By danslucky 24th Apr 18, 4:52 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danslucky
    thanks Waamo. So under the circumstances you advise replying with the template including a query in relation to the timelimits stated rather than continuing to ignore all letters received?

    If ultimately their claim is not going to go anywhere then one could just continue to ignore them, but if its helpful to engage in a bit of ping pong to delay things then at least one can say that the PCN was formally appealed at some point and leave the PPC to try to unpick it.
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 24th Apr 18, 4:54 PM
    • 2,430 Posts
    • 2,980 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    This isnt your thread. Start a new one
    ITs kinda rude to hijack someone elses, and is something you JUST agreed you would not do, when yuo signed up.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 24th Apr 18, 5:19 PM
    • 17,562 Posts
    • 27,763 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    This isnt your thread. Start a new one
    ITs kinda rude to hijack someone elses, and is something you JUST agreed you would not do, when yuo signed up.
    Originally posted by nosferatu1001
    The third separate interloper butting in on this thread. Total confusion, and sooner or later that confusion is going to cost someone dearly at court if advice for one is taken (erroneously) by another.

    And you just know who they will be blaming......!
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
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