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  • FIRST POST
    • peacock403
    • By peacock403 9th Feb 18, 10:50 AM
    • 23Posts
    • 11Thanks
    peacock403
    Notice to hirer with no option for appeal
    • #1
    • 9th Feb 18, 10:50 AM
    Notice to hirer with no option for appeal 9th Feb 18 at 10:50 AM
    I have read the detailed newbies forum and have found the basis of appeal which I could use but would like a bit more help.

    I have received several notice to hirer letters dated this Jan 2018 that state I have lost the opportunity to appeal. They relate to PCNs from Sept to Dec 2017. Do I still go ahead and write to them using Edna Basher!!!8217;s letter to get them cancelled based on the POFA 13 and 14?
    The last response the PPC had from the lease firm with all the documents was sent out on 10/01/18 and I received the NTDs after the 21 days. The first was sent out to the ppc in Oct 17. I never received anything before this January. The vehicle is on a salary sacrifice scheme. Do I need to mention that I have not been given the right to appeal?

    The first contact with them was via a telephone call in January this year to my partner on his mobile asking for me in name. They have since called me asking for payment. Lease firm has confirmed they did not give out any mobile number (in fact never had his on record). Do I also tell them that I will be complaining to the DVLA and ICO on unlawful procurement of personal details, DPA section 55?

    Your advice is appreciated.
    Last edited by peacock403; 09-02-2018 at 10:58 AM.
Page 1
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 9th Feb 18, 11:18 AM
    • 57,564 Posts
    • 71,120 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #2
    • 9th Feb 18, 11:18 AM
    • #2
    • 9th Feb 18, 11:18 AM
    The DVLA won't give out telephone numbers either.

    I reckon the PPC or their debt firm have looked your partner up online (Facebook, Linked in?) and harvested the phone number. Block them.

    You can use Edna Basher's letter as a basis for response, making sure not to say who was driving!
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • peacock403
    • By peacock403 9th Feb 18, 12:19 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    peacock403
    • #3
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:19 PM
    • #3
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:19 PM
    Thanks for the advice. Although it is highly unlikely they would have gotten those details online. I will reply and let you know how it goes.
    • peacock403
    • By peacock403 9th Feb 18, 12:26 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    peacock403
    • #4
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:26 PM
    • #4
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:26 PM
    As the PPC is an IPC firm, do I just demand cancellation or request code for appeal as well?
    • pappa golf
    • By pappa golf 9th Feb 18, 12:27 PM
    • 8,706 Posts
    • 9,307 Thanks
    pappa golf
    • #5
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:27 PM
    • #5
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:27 PM
    who is the parking co involved here

    no "code" for ipc companies


    matches the non compliance with adhering to the IPC code of conduct


    company please?
    Save a Rachael

    buy a share in crapita
    • peacock403
    • By peacock403 9th Feb 18, 12:38 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    peacock403
    • #6
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:38 PM
    • #6
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:38 PM
    PPC is SIP
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 9th Feb 18, 12:42 PM
    • 2,516 Posts
    • 3,081 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    • #7
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:42 PM
    • #7
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:42 PM
    So standard "appeal" on newbies

    They would have just rejected your appeal anyway, even if they offered it, so youre just setting out that you responded to them in the unlikely event they try court.
    • peacock403
    • By peacock403 9th Feb 18, 12:49 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    peacock403
    • #8
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:49 PM
    • #8
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:49 PM
    Thanks, will keep you updated
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 9th Feb 18, 12:53 PM
    • 9,209 Posts
    • 8,980 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #9
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:53 PM
    • #9
    • 9th Feb 18, 12:53 PM
    Meanwhile, watch this

    http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41

    and write to your MP complaining about these scammers wasting your time.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • peacock403
    • By peacock403 9th Feb 18, 3:39 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    peacock403
    One last question; should i email them to their 'info@' email address as that's the only one I've found or send by post recorded delivery?
    • waamo
    • By waamo 9th Feb 18, 3:44 PM
    • 3,246 Posts
    • 4,299 Thanks
    waamo
    Do not used recorded delivery. It is a waste of money. Use first class lost and obtain free proof of posting.

    Legally if you can show it was posted it is deemed delivered unless the other party can demonstrate it wasn't. That is very difficult to do.
    This space for hire.
    • peacock403
    • By peacock403 9th Feb 18, 3:48 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    peacock403
    Understood. Thank you
    • peacock403
    • By peacock403 16th Feb 18, 5:07 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    peacock403
    I have received the response from SIP. I however think they may not understand schedule 4 of the POFA on the time limits or they've just decided to ignore it. Here's what they've said;

    "We acknowledge receipt of your challenge to dispute the above PCN.
    We obtain keeper details from the DVLA prior to sending out the notice to keeper letter which we did. As the vehicle is not owned by you the keeper provided us with your details to pass liability and named you the hirer/driver.
    We have not breached the POFA and as a valid parking session was not purchased the PCN was issued correctly and the charge will stand."


    They have gone on to ask for payment. Should I respond to them using mnavarra's template that explains in detail where they've gone wrong regarding POFA?
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 16th Feb 18, 5:18 PM
    • 1,287 Posts
    • 1,742 Thanks
    twhitehousescat
    and as a valid parking session was not purchased the PCN was issued correctly and the charge will stand."


    for what reason where the tickets issued?
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • StaffsSW
    • By StaffsSW 16th Feb 18, 5:24 PM
    • 5,448 Posts
    • 5,553 Thanks
    StaffsSW
    Our company gets this a lot from SIP - they assume that the hirer and driver are one and the same. It's clear that they just want their pound of flesh from someone and use bluster and subterfuge to get it.

    I have lots of fun with them asking them to explain exactly how "ABC Fleet Ltd" could be the driver of a vehicle.

    Have a look at section 13 & 14 of POFA here -
    http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedule/4/enacted - and see just how much they have failed to comply with. Para 14 2a is a common fail point, but specifically in your case it sounds like they have failed to comply with Para 14 5d and 7 a&b - any arrangements under which disputes or complaints (however described) may be referred by the hirer to independent adjudication or arbitration.

    I find that when they get a robust reply explaining why they have not complied with this, they do tend to back off, and divert it to the fairly safe to ignore DRP process
    <--- Nothing to see here - move along --->
    • peacock403
    • By peacock403 16th Feb 18, 5:47 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    peacock403
    I think I will do just that - go into detail as to why they have not complied to the rules on. I will draft one and post here for further advice.
    • peacock403
    • By peacock403 16th Feb 18, 5:49 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    peacock403
    and as a valid parking session was not purchased the PCN was issued correctly and the charge will stand."


    for what reason where the tickets issued?
    Originally posted by twhitehousescat

    Apparently that's their argument.
    • StaffsSW
    • By StaffsSW 16th Feb 18, 5:54 PM
    • 5,448 Posts
    • 5,553 Thanks
    StaffsSW
    Does the hire agreement name you personally, or your company/employers?

    Either way - if it names you personally, that doesn't mean that you are the only person permitted or insured to drive the vehicle.

    With your reply, don't forget to throw in some comment about Elliot v Loake not being appropriate, SIP have tried to level that at my company too - it's explained here if you havent come across it yet - http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/10/excel-parking-youve-been-gladstoned.html
    <--- Nothing to see here - move along --->
    • peacock403
    • By peacock403 16th Feb 18, 6:05 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    peacock403
    Agreement mentions me specifically. Thanks, I will add that case.
    • StaffsSW
    • By StaffsSW 16th Feb 18, 6:08 PM
    • 5,448 Posts
    • 5,553 Thanks
    StaffsSW
    Ok, so just remember to always refer to yourself as "the hirer", and you can allude to the fact that other people are permitted to use the car under that agreement, but you are under no obligation to name them.
    <--- Nothing to see here - move along --->
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