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  • FIRST POST
    • Polgara61
    • By Polgara61 8th Feb 18, 2:24 PM
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    Polgara61
    Multi rate electricity v one rate tariff
    • #1
    • 8th Feb 18, 2:24 PM
    Multi rate electricity v one rate tariff 8th Feb 18 at 2:24 PM
    My mother-in-law is 87 in sheltered housing and has economy 10 wet radiators on a multi rate tariff. SSE have offered her the option to change to a one rate tariff without the need to change meter. Does anyone know of any other companies who are offering this so I can compare prices.
Page 1
    • Hengus
    • By Hengus 8th Feb 18, 2:30 PM
    • 5,604 Posts
    • 3,433 Thanks
    Hengus
    • #2
    • 8th Feb 18, 2:30 PM
    • #2
    • 8th Feb 18, 2:30 PM
    My mother-in-law is 87 in sheltered housing and has economy 10 wet radiators on a multi rate tariff. SSE have offered her the option to change to a one rate tariff without the need to change meter. Does anyone know of any other companies who are offering this so I can compare prices.
    Originally posted by Polgara61
    Octopus has a flat single rate E7 tariff. You may have to contact them for a quote. I only know because my grandson and I were discussing this last night. He has just rented a property on E7 but the landlord has removed all the storage heaters.
    • Chrishazle
    • By Chrishazle 8th Feb 18, 3:59 PM
    • 466 Posts
    • 289 Thanks
    Chrishazle
    • #3
    • 8th Feb 18, 3:59 PM
    • #3
    • 8th Feb 18, 3:59 PM
    Are you sure it's an Economy 10 meter rather than Economy 7? I ask because my meter was incorrectly registered as E10, presumably when the house was completed in 1991 rather than when its first owners sold in 2003 or when we, as 3rd owners, bought in 2007. Only found out when I tried to switch from BG to Scottish Power. Took months back and forward with BG mainly (switch had to be reversed) before BG discovered the error on the main meter database and got it corrected.

    For E7 there are a few suppliers that will accept E7 meter reads (R1 and R2, day and night) on a single rate tariff. From my personal experience BG, Sainsburys energy and my current supplier Affect Energy, I'm certain there are others. On the comparison sites don't say you have an E7 meter while getting an online quote, but then phone and check before comitting.

    I have for years spreadsheeted my electricity consumption, and have always found that, with no storage heaters, a single rate tariff is cheaper than an E7 tariff.
    • Flowboy
    • By Flowboy 10th Feb 18, 12:43 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Flowboy
    • #4
    • 10th Feb 18, 12:43 PM
    • #4
    • 10th Feb 18, 12:43 PM
    If you have night storage heaters, charge them at night (with output turned right down) & never run them on boost in the day the charge per kwhr is half of the std day rate so can make sense. Particularly where you have no gas supply. But if you run them on boost in the day the charge is higher than std rate. If you turn the output up overnight when they are charging you gain little benefit. Like trying to fill a bottle when it has a big hole in the bottom. There will be little heat left in them for the day so to stay warm you turn them to boost & end up paying 2 or 3 times the std rate... That's my understanding of how the energy companies make money out of it.
    • molerat
    • By molerat 10th Feb 18, 12:57 PM
    • 18,380 Posts
    • 12,546 Thanks
    molerat
    • #5
    • 10th Feb 18, 12:57 PM
    • #5
    • 10th Feb 18, 12:57 PM
    My mother-in-law is 87 in sheltered housing and has economy 10 wet radiators on a multi rate tariff. SSE have offered her the option to change to a one rate tariff without the need to change meter. Does anyone know of any other companies who are offering this so I can compare prices.
    Originally posted by Polgara61
    All suppliers with over 50,000 domestic customers must offer you a single rate tariff. The Energy Market Investigation (Restricted Meters) Order 2016
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    • nicobrum
    • By nicobrum 11th Feb 18, 6:14 PM
    • 32 Posts
    • 20 Thanks
    nicobrum
    • #6
    • 11th Feb 18, 6:14 PM
    • #6
    • 11th Feb 18, 6:14 PM
    For E7 there are a few suppliers that will accept E7 meter reads (R1 and R2, day and night) on a single rate tariff. From my personal experience BG, Sainsburys energy and my current supplier Affect Energy, I'm certain there are others.
    Originally posted by Chrishazle
    Eon do as well.
    • matelodave
    • By matelodave 12th Feb 18, 4:14 PM
    • 3,507 Posts
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    matelodave
    • #7
    • 12th Feb 18, 4:14 PM
    • #7
    • 12th Feb 18, 4:14 PM
    Be very careful. If you've got an electric wet central heating system and check what sort it is and when it heat's. Some have a big storage tank which stores hea which gets circulated when it's required (a Thermal Store), others just heat on demand so you could find that you are not going to get the benefit of the off peak rates in the afternoon or you may run out of heat altogether depending on how it's configured.

    Some heating systems are designed to work with E10 and you might find that just getting off-peak leccy between midnight and 7am isn't actually when you want it and it may be necessary to get some wiring changed to allow the heating to operate correctly.

    You really need to do your sums to see if a single rate would be more beneficial that either an E7 or E10 tariff as all the leccy will be charged at peak rates and wet electric heating systems flogging away all day on a peak rate could work out to be very expensive.

    All these grand schemes dreamed up by governments can have severe unintended consequences if you aren't careful because they dont suit everybody
    Last edited by matelodave; 12-02-2018 at 4:21 PM.
    Love makes the world go round - beer make it go round even faster
    Look after our planet - it's the only one with beer
  • E.ON Company Representative: Malc
    • #8
    • 13th Feb 18, 9:24 AM
    E.ON E7 meters
    • #8
    • 13th Feb 18, 9:24 AM
    Eon do as well.
    Originally posted by nicobrum
    Confirm that nicobrum. With our Economy 7 meters, we can add the day and night usage together and charge it all at a single rate. No need to change the meter. Customers need to ask for this or they can do it themselves online provided they've registered their account with our website.

    Malc
    Official Company Representative
    I am an official company representative of E.ON. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • Joules17
    • By Joules17 16th Feb 18, 12:18 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Joules17
    • #9
    • 16th Feb 18, 12:18 PM
    • #9
    • 16th Feb 18, 12:18 PM
    Confirm that nicobrum. With our Economy 7 meters, we can add the day and night usage together and charge it all at a single rate. No need to change the meter. Customers need to ask for this or they can do it themselves online provided they've registered their account with our website.

    Malc
    Originally posted by E.ON Company Representative: Malc

    If you have a dual rate and swap to a single tariff does that mean that the power will run to all units at all times? Currently the power supplied by EON to my "controlled unit" goes off during E10 peak hours - we want to remove the storage heaters for electric one and only heat as necessary as it is not a cold house. If I swap to a single rate - will the power to that controlled unit still go off during the peak times or will it run alongside the normal unit allowing me to have sockets in use and heating at the same time!!
    • Richie-from-the-Boro
    • By Richie-from-the-Boro 16th Feb 18, 12:37 PM
    • 6,376 Posts
    • 4,794 Thanks
    Richie-from-the-Boro
    Info only : Octopus

    Do you offer the Warm Home Discount?

    Unfortunately, we don't offer the Warm Home Discount at the moment. Instead, we've set our prices as low as possible to make our energy affordable for everyone
    Disclaimer : Everything I write on this forum is my opinion. I try to be an even-handed poster and accept that you at times may not agree with these opinions or how I choose to express them, this is not my problem. The Disabled : If years cannot be added to their lives, at least life can be added to their years - Alf Morris - !!!8476;
    • matelodave
    • By matelodave 16th Feb 18, 1:02 PM
    • 3,507 Posts
    • 2,171 Thanks
    matelodave
    If you have a dual rate and swap to a single tariff does that mean that the power will run to all units at all times? Currently the power supplied by EON to my "controlled unit" goes off during E10 peak hours - we want to remove the storage heaters for electric one and only heat as necessary as it is not a cold house. If I swap to a single rate - will the power to that controlled unit still go off during the peak times or will it run alongside the normal unit allowing me to have sockets in use and heating at the same time!!
    Originally posted by Joules17
    It depends how it's wired and switched. I suspect that you may have to get the meter replaced or the wiring changed.

    If it's the meter that does the switching either via teleswitching or via a external-time switch to a contactor so you only get power to certain circuits during off peak times then you'll need it to be rewired and probably have a meter change as well.

    Without more knowledge of your actual setup it's not a question that can be answered easily
    Love makes the world go round - beer make it go round even faster
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    • Joules17
    • By Joules17 16th Feb 18, 1:19 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Joules17
    I am also of that opinion. I spoke to EON and they had no clue what I was talking about. Their advice was that perhaps my consumer unit was malfunctioning and that I should contact the manufacturer of the unit or an electrician!!!
    • molerat
    • By molerat 16th Feb 18, 1:26 PM
    • 18,380 Posts
    • 12,546 Thanks
    molerat
    If you have a dual rate and swap to a single tariff does that mean that the power will run to all units at all times? Currently the power supplied by EON to my "controlled unit" goes off during E10 peak hours - we want to remove the storage heaters for electric one and only heat as necessary as it is not a cold house. If I swap to a single rate - will the power to that controlled unit still go off during the peak times or will it run alongside the normal unit allowing me to have sockets in use and heating at the same time!!
    Originally posted by Joules17
    If you change to a single rate tariff with a multi rate meter any circuit directly timed by the meter, as is the case with most E7/E10 heating systems, will be switched on and off at the appropriate times according to the type of metering unless you get an electrician to alter the wiring. The only exception to this would be if the circuits are controlled by a consumer unit mounted timer where you are in control of those times and use it to coincide with the off peak timings.
    www.helpforheroes.org.uk/donations.html
  • E.ON Company Representative: Malc
    E.ON Economy 10 meters
    If you have a dual rate and swap to a single tariff does that mean that the power will run to all units at all times? Currently the power supplied by EON to my "controlled unit" goes off during E10 peak hours - we want to remove the storage heaters for electric one and only heat as necessary as it is not a cold house. If I swap to a single rate - will the power to that controlled unit still go off during the peak times or will it run alongside the normal unit allowing me to have sockets in use and heating at the same time!!
    Originally posted by Joules17
    I am also of that opinion. I spoke to EON and they had no clue what I was talking about. Their advice was that perhaps my consumer unit was malfunctioning and that I should contact the manufacturer of the unit or an electrician!!!
    Originally posted by Joules17
    Hello Joules17 and welcome to the Forums.

    My post above acknowledging nicobrum was about Economy 7 meters only. It's different for Economy 10 meters.

    Economy 10 meters are mainly designed for all electric properties with storage heaters and electric water immersion heaters. To work, the meters are wired directly into the heating/water heating circuits. This lets them automatically switch the storage heaters on and off during the off-peak times.

    Do you have a two or three rate Economy 10 meter? If it's a two rate, all electricity used during the 10 off-peak hours will be charged at this rate. If it's an older, three rate, meter then only the 5 hours at night covers all electricity used. During the other 5 hours (in the afternoon and evening), only electricity used for heating/hot water and coming through the dedicated circuits will be off-peak.

    We've a specialist team currently looking at multi-rate meters like Economy 10. This is our Simpler Metering team and they're the best people to talk to. As your looking to take out your storage heaters, it might be best to change the meter too. If you were to go for a single rate or Economy 7, this would also give you more tariff options both with us and with the other suppliers.

    As matelodave says, a lot depends on the actual set up at your property and this is where our Simpler Metering advisors will be able to help more. They'll be able to let you know if there are any charges too. Some meter exchanges aren't charged at all. Again, it depends on the set up at your flat.

    Hope this helps point you in the right direction Joules17.

    Malc
    Official Company Representative
    I am an official company representative of E.ON. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • mal01502
    • By mal01502 1st Mar 18, 8:57 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    mal01502
    EON economy 10
    I've recently moved into a flat which had E 18 meter with wet type radiators. The meter stopped working so EON have just replaced it with an E 10 one. I only got the choice of E7 or E10. Was not told about the single rate one! I've tried to find out the difference in costs as I now do not have enough cental heating time. I am a pensioner at home all day and evening. EON have phased out the E18 apparently. After hours on the phone to EON they say I can have a single rate meter but can't tell me the overall cost. Also why does the meter turn off my central heating after the economy times when I am willing to pay for extra on a normal rate? Would appreciate some advice please.
    • molerat
    • By molerat 1st Mar 18, 9:31 AM
    • 18,380 Posts
    • 12,546 Thanks
    molerat
    It turns off because that is the way it is designed, only using the cheap off peak electric. To get the heating to stay on you need an electrician, at your cost, to alter the wiring so that the heating side of the consumer unit is connected to the on peak meter output. Depending on how your meter is connected he may need to involve the DNO to alter the tails from the meter or remove the main fuse.
    Last edited by molerat; 01-03-2018 at 9:35 AM.
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    • matelodave
    • By matelodave 1st Mar 18, 12:04 PM
    • 3,507 Posts
    • 2,171 Thanks
    matelodave
    When we moved into this place it had storage heaters & the immersion heater connected a separate distribution panel which was switched by the meter so it was only powered during the off-peak periods.

    As we removed all the storage heaters we had the meter changed to a single rate and the distribution boards were connected in parallel so they are both powered.

    The second board now supplies our heat-pump and associated circuits (boost heater and immersion) together with a couple of extra socket where the old storage heaters used to be.
    Love makes the world go round - beer make it go round even faster
    Look after our planet - it's the only one with beer
  • E.ON Company Representative: Malc
    E.ON Economy 18
    I've recently moved into a flat which had E 18 meter with wet type radiators. The meter stopped working so EON have just replaced it with an E 10 one. I only got the choice of E7 or E10. Was not told about the single rate one! I've tried to find out the difference in costs as I now do not have enough cental heating time. I am a pensioner at home all day and evening. EON have phased out the E18 apparently. After hours on the phone to EON they say I can have a single rate meter but can't tell me the overall cost. Also why does the meter turn off my central heating after the economy times when I am willing to pay for extra on a normal rate? Would appreciate some advice please.
    Originally posted by mal01502
    Hello mal01502 and welcome to the Forums.

    We're currently looking to phase out several different types of Restricted Hour Tariff (RHT) meters like Economy 18. This project is being looked after by our specialist Simpler Metering team. I'm sorry you've already spent a fair amount of time on the phone but do you know if you spoke to this team? If you haven't, I would suggest talking to them. They'll be able to go through the options we've available and let you know the unit prices per kWh and daily standing charges for your area. Please call the general number on your bills or our website and ask to be put through to them.

    As you previously had 18 hours of off peak electricity for your heating and hot water, I suspect we originally offered Economy 10 as this is the nearest current equivalent. These meters have 10 off peak hours rather than 7 with Economy 7 and none with a single rate option.

    Like Economy 18, Economy 10 meters are wired directly into the dedicated heating circuits at properties. This lets them turn the connected heating on/off at the set times. They, too, split the off peak hours into 3 periods at night, during the afternoon and in the evening. With our recent two rate Economy 10 meters, all electricity used during the 10 off peak hours is charged at the lower rates. Whereas, with most Economy 18 meters, only the 5 hours at night cover all the electricity used.

    RHT meters like Economy 10 and 18 are designed to give customers off peak electricity at set times during each 24 hour period and are wired into the dedicated circuits to allow this. As molerat says, a qualified electrician might be needed if you are thinking of changing the wiring at your flat. Again, our Simpler Metering advisors will be able to talk to you about this.

    Hope this helps point you in the right direction mal01502.

    Malc
    Official Company Representative
    I am an official company representative of E.ON. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • Sian2769
    • By Sian2769 2nd Mar 18, 10:41 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Sian2769
    Hiya, we have been with E on for 19 years and was on the Heatwise meter for our storage heaters. We also was made to have our meter took out last March due to phasing out these meters. After talking to E on for over 2 hours trying to find out how this would affect us financially we had to decide on either E7 or E10 meter. We opted for E10 but was blind as E on couldn't tell us the tarriff per KWH for both E7 and E10. After the meter was fitted we found out how much more we are going to have to pay. See below.

    Heatwise -
    Peak rate was 13.21 per kwh
    Off peak was 8.28 per kwh
    Standing charge was 15.64 per day

    E10 tarriff now -
    Peak rate is now 18.29 per kwh
    Off peak is now 10.05 per kwh
    Standing charge 15.64 per day

    This has put our yearly bill up by approx 360 a year. We are now going through the energy ombudsmen as E on are not taking responsibility in there appalling customer service.

    My advice would be to get off E10 and onto E7 and get away from E on as quick as possible. They just rip you off and there prices are very expensive. If you go with a cheaper company on E7 or a single rate meter you will save money.

    Sian x
    • mal01502
    • By mal01502 3rd Mar 18, 10:42 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    mal01502
    Thank you for that information Sian. Unfortunately we are stuck with EON as they have control of all the 22 flats here. I have spent several hours phoning EON being put on hold and transferred to different departments without getting an answer!! When I feel up to it I will try what Malc suggested but don't hold out much hope Mal x
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