Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • BobSmith5
    • By BobSmith5 7th Feb 18, 6:09 PM
    • 27Posts
    • 12Thanks
    BobSmith5
    NTK Received After 4 Weeks
    • #1
    • 7th Feb 18, 6:09 PM
    NTK Received After 4 Weeks 7th Feb 18 at 6:09 PM
    Hi all,

    I was wondering if I could get some advice on a parking ticket I received. The company is ParkingEye, and they have rejected my initial appeal, so now I have a POPLA code.

    The driver had parked in a hotel car park, and used a blue badge. Seems it was not clear that blue badge holders were still required to pay. In any case, the event was on the mid November, and the date of issue is more than three weeks later. However, there is a discrepancy as it also states that the date issued is the nearer Christmas, in the black box with the fine amount. I received the letter on the mid December.

    I understand that based on POFA (2012), there is a time limit for when the ticket must be received. Which seems to be 14 days.

    Is it possible to win the POPLA appeal based on this? Are there any other considerations I ought to make?

    Thank you in advance.
    Last edited by BobSmith5; 07-02-2018 at 9:56 PM.
Page 1
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 7th Feb 18, 6:16 PM
    • 6,651 Posts
    • 5,851 Thanks
    KeithP
    • #2
    • 7th Feb 18, 6:16 PM
    • #2
    • 7th Feb 18, 6:16 PM
    Is it possible to win the POPLA appeal based on this?
    Originally posted by BobSmith5
    Yes it is.


    Are there any other considerations I ought to make?
    Originally posted by BobSmith5
    Yes.
    As well as no keeper liability consider -
    Signage
    No Landowner Authority

    These, and others, are all explained in post #3 of the NEWBIES FAQ sticky/pinned thread.


    Also, you need to edit your opening post to remove any clues to the driver's identity.

    For example, your second paragraph should perhaps start with something like:
    The driver had parked in a hotel car park...

    Is your forum username your real name?
    If so, you would be wise to get MSE to change it to something more anonymous.
    To do that, click on the 'Report' button on your post and ask the MSE Forum Team for their help.
    Last edited by KeithP; 07-02-2018 at 7:10 PM.
    .
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 7th Feb 18, 6:20 PM
    • 36,564 Posts
    • 82,825 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    • #3
    • 7th Feb 18, 6:20 PM
    • #3
    • 7th Feb 18, 6:20 PM
    Edit your post to remove information about who did what. Only ever refer to The Driver and The Keeper. Hopefully you didn't reveal the driver's identity when the keeper appealed.

    Where ANPR is used the NTK must arrive by day 14 for keeper liability to apply. Usually where parking lie fail to meet the deadline you get a NTK with the bit about the POFA missing. I think there is an example of what it looks like in the NEWBIES thread.

    If you didn't give away the driver's identity then non POFA compliant NTK will be your winning point at PoPLA.
    Use all the template appeal points available to you from the NEWBIES and post your draft appeal here for checking before you send it.

    What happened when you complained to the hotel manager?
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 7th Feb 18, 7:04 PM
    • 17,307 Posts
    • 27,258 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #4
    • 7th Feb 18, 7:04 PM
    • #4
    • 7th Feb 18, 7:04 PM
    Is there any mention on your NtK of PoFA. Is there a paragraph (usually on the reverse of the NtK) that states <If, after 29 days ...... >?

    Please provide info on above.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • BobSmith5
    • By BobSmith5 7th Feb 18, 7:42 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 12 Thanks
    BobSmith5
    • #5
    • 7th Feb 18, 7:42 PM
    • #5
    • 7th Feb 18, 7:42 PM
    Hi all,

    Thank you for the responses.

    I did not reveal the driver when appealing to ParkingEye. I did not contact the hotel manager regarding the fine. I just appealed via ParkingEye's online system. They seemed to generate an automated reply, which did not address the point I made about the NTK being late.

    There's no paragraph regarding PFA on my NTK.

    One query I have is which is the date I should be going by? They are both outside the 14 day time frame, in any case.

    How should I structure the letter?

    Thank you again.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 7th Feb 18, 7:50 PM
    • 17,307 Posts
    • 27,258 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #6
    • 7th Feb 18, 7:50 PM
    • #6
    • 7th Feb 18, 7:50 PM
    You seem to have a Golden Ticket (look it up via a forum search) so you can kill it at POPLA.

    Have you had your POPLA Code from PE? If so, we will help you develop a winning appeal. Draft something up, using the advice in the NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #3.

    Easy enough, with the right amount of effort on your part. Go for it!
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 7th Feb 18, 8:00 PM
    • 56,207 Posts
    • 69,863 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #7
    • 7th Feb 18, 8:00 PM
    • #7
    • 7th Feb 18, 8:00 PM
    They seemed to generate an automated reply, which did not address the point I made about the NTK being late.
    Has that got a POPLA code? Golden tickets (non POFA) are nigh on impossible to lose at POPLA.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 7th Feb 18, 8:14 PM
    • 6,651 Posts
    • 5,851 Thanks
    KeithP
    • #8
    • 7th Feb 18, 8:14 PM
    • #8
    • 7th Feb 18, 8:14 PM
    I did not reveal the driver when appealing to ParkingEye.
    Originally posted by BobSmith5
    That's good to hear, but now edit your opening post as suggested earlier.

    This is not just petty pedantry. It is known that the PPCs trawl forums like this just looking for people to trip themselves up.

    You have a golden ticket - don't throw that away through carelessness.

    Just before Christmas I received a PM from a guy who had his PoPLA appeal denied because the PPC could prove that the appellant was the driver. They produced screenshots from this very forum which sunk his golden ticket appeal.

    And if you username is your real name... that makes it really easy for them to tie this thread to your PoPLA appeal doesn't it?
    Last edited by KeithP; 07-02-2018 at 8:26 PM.
    .
    • BobSmith5
    • By BobSmith5 7th Feb 18, 9:46 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 12 Thanks
    BobSmith5
    • #9
    • 7th Feb 18, 9:46 PM
    • #9
    • 7th Feb 18, 9:46 PM
    Yes, I have a POPLA Code. However, I'm just concerned that I'm missing something. Can I really win this due to the fact that they sent this late?

    I have edited out my post to remove the dates. BobSmith is not my real name, either.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 7th Feb 18, 9:48 PM
    • 56,207 Posts
    • 69,863 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    However, I'm just concerned that I'm missing something. Can I really win this due to the fact that they sent this late?
    100% yes, if you only appealed as keeper. A non-POFA PCN can only hold a driver liable.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 7th Feb 18, 9:51 PM
    • 6,651 Posts
    • 5,851 Thanks
    KeithP
    I think you need to re-read what I posted earlier:
    Also, you need to edit your opening post to remove any clues to the driver's identity.

    For example, your second paragraph should perhaps start with something like:
    The driver had parked in a hotel car park...
    Originally posted by KeithP
    .
    • BobSmith5
    • By BobSmith5 7th Feb 18, 9:56 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 12 Thanks
    BobSmith5
    I think you need to re-read what I posted earlier:
    Originally posted by KeithP
    Oh, thank you. I thought you were referring to the appeal letter.
    • BobSmith5
    • By BobSmith5 9th Feb 18, 3:15 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 12 Thanks
    BobSmith5
    Hi,
    I'm currently drafting my appeal letter, however I am not able get photos of the sign used. Will this be an issue?

    Would someone be able to check this over for me, please?

    Dear Sir/Madam,

    I am appealing this parking ticket, as ParkingEye's Parking Charge Notice is not compliant with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA) due to the dates and the wording used. I am the registered keeper of this vehicle.

    Under schedule 4, paragraph 4 of the POFA, an operator can only establish the right to recover any unpaid parking charges from the keeper of a vehicle if certain conditions must be met as stated in paragraphs 5, 6, 11, and 12. ParkingEye have failed to fulfil the conditions which state that an operator must have provided the keeper with a Notice to Keeper (NTK) in accordance with paragraph 9, which stipulates as mandatory, a set timeline and wording:-

    The notice must be given by:
    (a) handing it to the keeper, or leaving it at a current address for service for the keeper, within the relevant period; or
    (b) sending it by post to a current address for service for the keeper so that it is delivered to that address within the relevant period.

    The applicable section here is (b) because the Parking Charge Notice/NTK that I have received was delivered by post. Furthermore, paragraph 9(5) states:

    "The relevant period for the purposes of sub-paragraph (4) is the period of 14 days beginning with the day after that on which the specified period of parking ended."

    In fact, this NTK arrived over three weeks after the alleged event. This means that ParkingEye have failed to act within the 14 day relevant period. The date of the event in question was on xxxx. The NTK was received on xxxx, though issued on xxxx.

    There has been no proof of the driver of the vehicle, and therefore ParkingEye have failed to provide a POFA compliant NTK.

    Yours faithfully,
    ...
    Last edited by BobSmith5; 09-02-2018 at 3:36 PM.
    • BobSmith5
    • By BobSmith5 12th Feb 18, 12:10 AM
    • 27 Posts
    • 12 Thanks
    BobSmith5
    You seem to have a Golden Ticket (look it up via a forum search) so you can kill it at POPLA.

    Have you had your POPLA Code from PE? If so, we will help you develop a winning appeal. Draft something up, using the advice in the NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #3.

    Easy enough, with the right amount of effort on your part. Go for it!
    Originally posted by Umkomaas
    Apologies for bumping the thread, but would it be possible to check through my appeal above?

    Thank you.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 12th Feb 18, 12:19 AM
    • 56,207 Posts
    • 69,863 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    It's fine, submit it online, choosing 'registered keeper'. You win at POPLA, can't lose.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 12th Feb 18, 11:49 AM
    • 9,061 Posts
    • 8,746 Thanks
    The Deep
    Parking Eye were named and shamed in the HOC last week as scammers and legislation is in hand to close them down Watch this

    http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41

    Complain in robust terms to your MP. If everyone who gets a ticket from these scammers, the more brutal will be the sanctions they will have to endure, bot
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • BobSmith5
    • By BobSmith5 12th Feb 18, 3:45 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 12 Thanks
    BobSmith5
    It's fine, submit it online, choosing 'registered keeper'. You win at POPLA, can't lose.
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    Do I need to provide an upload of the letter I was sent, or will they have a copy of that?
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 12th Feb 18, 3:50 PM
    • 6,651 Posts
    • 5,851 Thanks
    KeithP
    Just submit your appeal.

    If they have not kept a copy of what they sent you, that's their problem, not yours.
    .
    • BobSmith5
    • By BobSmith5 12th Feb 18, 3:56 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 12 Thanks
    BobSmith5
    Just submit your appeal.

    If they have not kept a copy of what they sent you, that's their problem, not yours.
    Originally posted by KeithP
    I mean for appealing to POPLA. Parking Eye already rejected my appeal.
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 12th Feb 18, 3:57 PM
    • 6,651 Posts
    • 5,851 Thanks
    KeithP
    Oh wait... are you saying post #13 is a PoPLA appeal?
    .
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

3,026Posts Today

8,363Users online

Martin's Twitter
  • I'm sorry you feel that way. I'm retweeting this so people can judge my 'non-apology' for themselves. Yet I am gen? https://t.co/ALnjaDtZcm

  • I don't shush women. But did wrongly shush a woman, u, not due to gender, but as u patronisingly offered me an unpa? https://t.co/jCYTb7aFYt

  • Harassing people who are hospitalised for mental health issues helps no one. Giving breathing space to put finance? https://t.co/L02RzMDoEs

  • Follow Martin