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  • FIRST POST
    • nikkilou
    • By nikkilou 31st Jan 18, 1:50 PM
    • 3Posts
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    nikkilou
    Santander PPI Claim Rejected
    • #1
    • 31st Jan 18, 1:50 PM
    Santander PPI Claim Rejected 31st Jan 18 at 1:50 PM
    I have just had a Store Card PPI complaint rejected by Santander (for a Principles Store Card opened in 1997).

    They sent 2 letters - 1st says the claim against the insurer was rejected on the grounds that 1) I was in f/t employment so could have claimed if I needed to and 2) They have a copy of the agreement I signed and say its clear there was PPI included.

    They say the claim against GE Money (now Santander) is not upheld as it is 'time-barred'
    as more than 15 years passed between the PPI being taken out and the date I made the complaint.

    Has anyone else had a similar response from Santander?

    They haven't sent a copy of the agreement I signed so I can't see myself. Also, as part of reviewing this complaint, they contacted me and asked me details about any sick pay or redundancy pay I would have been entitled to. As a Civil Servant, I am entitled to 6 months full sick pay then 6 months half sick pay. There was also little chance of me being made redundant. I answered these questions but unfortunately have no proof.

    Just wondering if anyone else has had a similar experience, or had a rejected claim subsequently upheld by by the ombudsman based on the same issues as me. Does anyone know if the sick pay point is worth pursuing with the ombudsman?

    Thanks
Page 1
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 31st Jan 18, 3:16 PM
    • 92,142 Posts
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    dunstonh
    • #2
    • 31st Jan 18, 3:16 PM
    • #2
    • 31st Jan 18, 3:16 PM
    1st says the claim against the insurer was rejected on the grounds that 1) I was in f/t employment so could have claimed if I needed to and 2) They have a copy of the agreement I signed and say its clear there was PPI included.
    Both points seem reasonably answered. point one confirms you were eligible. So, no reason to refund on that basis and the second point confirms you chose to have it.

    Also, as part of reviewing this complaint, they contacted me and asked me details about any sick pay or redundancy pay I would have been entitled to. As a Civil Servant, I am entitled to 6 months full sick pay then 6 months half sick pay. There was also little chance of me being made redundant. I answered these questions but unfortunately have no proof.
    You dont need proof as they will have the sick pay benefits on file for each major employer (and a lot of smaller ones). However, sick pay only really matters if its an advised case (not non-advised) or where the PPI would not pay out in addition to sick pay. So, if yours was non-advised (which is likely) and it pays out in addition to sick pay then the policy is still fine.

    Redundancy does not affect payouts on PPI. And lots of civil servants have been made redundant. You would have to police or a judge as they cannot be made redundant.

    Just wondering if anyone else has had a similar experience, or had a rejected claim subsequently upheld by by the ombudsman based on the same issues as me.
    Do you have access to the ombudsman? The 15 year timebar rule does not apply to FCA regulated cases. It can be used under the FLA I believe (hopefully someone who knows that side more will know and say). FLA cases dont get access to the FOS.

    Does anyone know if the sick pay point is worth pursuing with the ombudsman?
    Only if it was an advised case. I would expect Santander to mention that in their response.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • nikkilou
    • By nikkilou 31st Jan 18, 5:29 PM
    • 3 Posts
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    nikkilou
    • #3
    • 31st Jan 18, 5:29 PM
    • #3
    • 31st Jan 18, 5:29 PM
    Thanks dunstonh

    Re the complaint against Santander (as opposed to the Insurance Co) they state "Your complaint against SCUKL has been assessed under the general legal principles (including time-bar) whereas the FCAs dispute resolution 'DISP' rules apply to your complaint against the Insurer.
    We consider your complaint against SCUKL is time barred because under general legal principles, you have 15 years from the point of sale of the PPI to bring a mis-selling claim against SCUKL"

    In the letter rejecting the complaint against the Insurer it gives me the details to take to FOS
    • Deewm76
    • By Deewm76 31st Jan 18, 5:40 PM
    • 22 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    Deewm76
    • #4
    • 31st Jan 18, 5:40 PM
    • #4
    • 31st Jan 18, 5:40 PM
    can I ask when you submitted your claim? I have a claim going through at the moment and I have a feeling that mines is about to be rejected for the same reason. I submitted my claim in November for a store card taken out in 1997.
    • nikkilou
    • By nikkilou 31st Jan 18, 5:56 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    nikkilou
    • #5
    • 31st Jan 18, 5:56 PM
    • #5
    • 31st Jan 18, 5:56 PM
    I submitted the claim in September direct with Santander. I am surprised they found the account at all because I couldn't even remember what year I opened it (just knew it was late 90s).

    From the way I read their response, the time wouldn't be an issue when reviewing the complaint on behalf of the insurer. The time is only an issue when they were reviewing the complaint from their pov. I read it that whilst reviewing the claim against the insurer, if they had felt it was mis-sold they have upheld my complaint.

    I am going to direct complaint to FOS anyway - nothing to lose - and I genuinely feel as though the PPI would not have been clear on the paperwork and certainly not made obvious by the sales assistant. I was 18 back then - I am a lot wiser to these things now....
    • sun73
    • By sun73 31st Jan 18, 10:40 PM
    • 402 Posts
    • 127 Thanks
    sun73
    • #6
    • 31st Jan 18, 10:40 PM
    • #6
    • 31st Jan 18, 10:40 PM
    It might help to get hold of a copy of the credit agreement and ppi policy document from Santander as it will prove if you did select ppi at the time, or,if it was an opt out or pre ticked box. also you will see the name of the underwriter in the small print.

    Santander rejected my store card ppi complaint, so I referred it to Genworth who also rejected it but this gave me access to FOS, who later advised me to re-send the complaint to Financial Insurance Company Ltd (a subsidiary of Genworth now Axa) and it was eventually upheld. Hope this helps.
    • NickArmitage
    • By NickArmitage 1st Feb 18, 1:07 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    NickArmitage
    • #7
    • 1st Feb 18, 1:07 PM
    Abbey Mortgage PPI not upheld by Santander
    • #7
    • 1st Feb 18, 1:07 PM
    I received a letter from Santander re: a mortgage that I took out with Abbey in the early 2000's. The mortgage was ended 5 years ago and no paperwork remains with me, the property was sold during a divorce. However, the letter from Santander states 'whilst a PPI policy was added to your account to protect your payments, our records indicate that no PPI premiums have in fact been charged to the account since the policy was added.' Which begs the question as to why the policy was added if it was not then used ? Any ideas ? I will of course appeal to the Financial Ombudsman but I find their reply odd.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 1st Feb 18, 1:24 PM
    • 92,142 Posts
    • 59,299 Thanks
    dunstonh
    • #8
    • 1st Feb 18, 1:24 PM
    • #8
    • 1st Feb 18, 1:24 PM
    I received a letter from Santander re: a mortgage that I took out with Abbey in the early 2000's. The mortgage was ended 5 years ago and no paperwork remains with me, the property was sold during a divorce. However, the letter from Santander states 'whilst a PPI policy was added to your account to protect your payments, our records indicate that no PPI premiums have in fact been charged to the account since the policy was added.' Which begs the question as to why the policy was added if it was not then used ? Any ideas ? I will of course appeal to the Financial Ombudsman but I find their reply odd.
    Originally posted by NickArmitage
    So, you have never paid any premiums but you are going to the FOS. Why?

    Maybe it was added and you changed your mind. Or it was set up to be in place but never activated. Or it was offered free for a period but never went beyond that.

    Whatever the reason, if you didnt pay premiums then there is nothing to refund.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • Moneyineptitude
    • By Moneyineptitude 1st Feb 18, 1:51 PM
    • 19,999 Posts
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    Moneyineptitude
    • #9
    • 1st Feb 18, 1:51 PM
    • #9
    • 1st Feb 18, 1:51 PM
    Ino PPI premiums have in fact been charged to the account since the policy was added.' I will of course appeal to the Financial Ombudsman .
    Originally posted by NickArmitage
    The Ombudsman won't (and can't) award you a "refund" of money you didn't pay.

    Don't waste any more time with this.
    • hilbil21
    • By hilbil21 2nd Feb 18, 1:31 PM
    • 48 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    hilbil21
    My husband has received an identical response this morning. Not sure whether to bother taking it any further or not.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 2nd Feb 18, 3:15 PM
    • 92,142 Posts
    • 59,299 Thanks
    dunstonh
    My husband has received an identical response this morning. Not sure whether to bother taking it any further or not.
    Originally posted by hilbil21
    And the same comments posted above apply to him

    If he didnt pay any premiums, then what is he expecting them to refund?
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • hilbil21
    • By hilbil21 2nd Feb 18, 6:37 PM
    • 48 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    hilbil21
    And the same comments posted above apply to him

    If he didnt pay any premiums, then what is he expecting them to refund?
    Originally posted by dunstonh
    I mean an identical letter to the letter the OP received, not the person who posted about a mortgage. He paid plenty premiums through the time he had the card
    • chrissy100
    • By chrissy100 5th Feb 18, 12:53 PM
    • 35 Posts
    • 25 Thanks
    chrissy100
    Santander and Fair trade practice
    I have been using an agency Fair Trade Practice to sort out my PPI claims.

    Santander have agreed that I had 2 store cards that had PPI on them. but although I have filled in forms through FTP, Santander have sent me letters with forms asking me virtually the same questions, but in more depth. Asking for salary details, sick pay, redundancy pay. How would I have paid back monies owed. etc. I don't have details of these anymore. Is this likely to be thrown out because of it? We are talking about 12 - 15 yrs ago. After reading this thread I think they will find a reason not to pay out.
    • zx81
    • By zx81 5th Feb 18, 1:07 PM
    • 16,360 Posts
    • 17,384 Thanks
    zx81

    After reading this thread I think they will find a reason not to pay out.
    Originally posted by chrissy100
    Only if you don't have a valid complaint, which would seem fair enough.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 5th Feb 18, 1:23 PM
    • 92,142 Posts
    • 59,299 Thanks
    dunstonh
    Santander have sent me letters with forms asking me virtually the same questions, but in more depth.
    This generally means that on first pass they have not been able to identify any failures and require more info in certain areas.

    Asking for salary details, sick pay, redundancy pay. How would I have paid back monies owed. etc.
    Which suggests these points were highlighted as complaint reasons. Now, surely if you used them as your reason for complaint, you would know what they are. You say you used a CMC, so its more likely the CMC went down this route. Whilst some try-it-on complaints get lucky, others get caught when the lender asks for info.

    Did you actually have a complaint reason or was this just a try-it-on? - nobody can identify you. So, you can be honest about it.

    After reading this thread I think they will find a reason not to pay out.
    It's not over yet. If you don't know the information than say so. Most of the banks have a database of employer benefits that they have built up. They may just need the employer name to match against their database to see what you would have had. Or you may have had an employer that was not in their database and that is why they are asking questions.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • daztraction
    • By daztraction 5th Feb 18, 4:21 PM
    • 46 Posts
    • 12 Thanks
    daztraction
    For what it's worth, I was successful in a PPI claim against Santander last year for a store card that I took out in 1999, which is 18 years. I was a student at the time though.
    • chrissy100
    • By chrissy100 5th Feb 18, 5:16 PM
    • 35 Posts
    • 25 Thanks
    chrissy100
    I wasn't aware that I had had PPI with them. The cards were with someone that Santander have taken over. ie' GE money. I had a letter from Santander telling that I had 4 cards with them and 2 of them had PPI.

    I was unaware of the PPI and I know I was never asked if I wanted it. I was in full time employment at the time and had no reason to need it. I had full pay when it came to sick pay and would have had a really good redundancy payout, should that have arisen. So I wouldn't have agreed to having it.

    I have given them the same info as they asked FTP for.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 5th Feb 18, 5:47 PM
    • 92,142 Posts
    • 59,299 Thanks
    dunstonh
    I am not picking on you but just highlighting issues so you can see positives and negatives of your position.
    I wasn't aware that I had had PPI with them.
    yet it would have appeared as an entry on every statement it was paid.

    and I know I was never asked if I wanted it.
    Yet it was added and you never made any query or complaint whilst you were paying for it.

    I was in full time employment at the time and had no reason to need it.
    That is not a complaint reason. That is actually a reason for having it and verifies that you were eligible for it. daztraction, who you thanked for their response, said they got a refund because they were not employed. A clear missale reason. You say you were employed full time. So, not a missale reason.

    . I had full pay when it came to sick pay and would have had a really good redundancy payout, should that have arisen.
    Redundancy pay is only paid if the company can afford it. Not if the company fails. It has no overlap with most PPI. Although it can impact on a small number.

    Sick pay is an issue on advised cases but not non-advised or where the PPI would not pay out in addition to sick pay. However, if it pays out in addition to sick pay then its not an issue.

    I have given them the same info as they asked FTP for.
    if you are doing all the work, then why are you paying the CMC large amounts for it? (or will be if your complaint is successful).
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • Moneyineptitude
    • By Moneyineptitude 5th Feb 18, 5:56 PM
    • 19,999 Posts
    • 10,980 Thanks
    Moneyineptitude
    Fair Trade Practice
    Originally posted by chrissy100
    That's a misnomer if ever I heard one..
    • hilbil21
    • By hilbil21 5th Feb 18, 8:32 PM
    • 48 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    hilbil21
    The points above posted by dunstonh are basically exactly why my partners complaint was not upheld. I tend to see their point.
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