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  • FIRST POST
    • savity
    • By savity 26th Jan 18, 8:59 AM
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    savity
    PCN received after 14 days - doesn't mention POFA though
    • #1
    • 26th Jan 18, 8:59 AM
    PCN received after 14 days - doesn't mention POFA though 26th Jan 18 at 8:59 AM
    Good morning - Apologies for this new thread before submitting an initial appeal, but just wanted a bit of advice on what to focus the appeal on for best result.

    I received a NTK from Highview parking requesting a payment of 100 for an overstay at a local retail park. The driver is alleged to have entered on 27/12/17 at *lunchtime* and left at *evening*. This in itself is false - the driver dropped some bottles off at recycling containers, and would have stayed for 15 minutes. The driver later returned to Sainsbury's at *evening* to get some snacks for a party. The PCN is of the ANPR kind, and shows incredibly grainy pictures, one of the front, one of the back. The front you can see the number plate. The back you can only see a couple of red lights and there is no visibility of the number plate. Underneath each picture they have placed a readable image of the number plate, but both are white (so front plates).

    From a signage perspective it all looks above reproach, it mentions ANPR, mentions they could ask DVLA for keepers details, the charge value is the most prominant text. It doesn't mention who their contract is with as landowners, so I am not even sure if it is Sainsbury - there are lots of other retail units on the same site - but all one car park.

    However, I was wondering if I just appeal on an non-compliant NTK. The date of the alleged overstay was 27/12/17. The date of notice (as printed specifically on the NTK) is 18/01/18 - therefore out of the 14/15 day required window for sending a NTK. The NTK does not mention POFA though, so I guess their first rebuttal will be that they don't have to send it within 14 days if they are not quoting POFA. Does this mean I can just say I am under no legal duty to name the driver, and they are not compliant with POFA to transfer liability to the keeper?

    I'd rather quash this early on a technicality, than having to go through the process of arguing the case - although I feel that no overstay was made by the driver.

    Many Thanks for your considered opinion
    Last edited by savity; 26-01-2018 at 10:52 AM. Reason: redacting data
Page 1
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 26th Jan 18, 9:16 AM
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    Fruitcake
    • #2
    • 26th Jan 18, 9:16 AM
    • #2
    • 26th Jan 18, 9:16 AM
    Just start by sending the initial appeal template from the NEWBIES thread. You could add that the NTK is non POFA compliant so suggest they save themselves the PoPLA fee and cancel now.

    If it gets rejected then you construct a PoPLA appeal where non POFA compliant NTK will be one of your winning appeal points.

    It's all copy and paste and edit as the template appeal points are already written for you.

    What happened when you complained to the landowner?

    By the way, the keeper can be identified on here by the very precise dates and times. I would suggest you edit them and just call it a double dip of x - hours.
    Last edited by Fruitcake; 26-01-2018 at 9:22 AM.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
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    • waamo
    • By waamo 26th Jan 18, 9:18 AM
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    waamo
    • #3
    • 26th Jan 18, 9:18 AM
    • #3
    • 26th Jan 18, 9:18 AM
    Highview nearly always fold as soon as they see a forum appeal. They know they can!!!8217;t win so give up
    This space for hire.
    • savity
    • By savity 26th Jan 18, 10:56 AM
    • 5 Posts
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    savity
    • #4
    • 26th Jan 18, 10:56 AM
    • #4
    • 26th Jan 18, 10:56 AM
    Thanks - I've edited the specifics, I was unsure whether I should send the full version of the initial appeal template, or just a cut down version highlighting the POFA / 14 days error.

    I am unsure of the Landowner, so haven't spoke to them - the Landowner is not on the signs. I could go speak to Sainsburys and see if they are the landowner and if they can do anything before sending the appeal - is that the best way?

    Thanks
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 26th Jan 18, 11:09 AM
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    Umkomaas
    • #5
    • 26th Jan 18, 11:09 AM
    • #5
    • 26th Jan 18, 11:09 AM
    I am unsure of the Landowner, so haven't spoke to them - the Landowner is not on the signs. I could go speak to Sainsburys and see if they are the landowner and if they can do anything before sending the appeal - is that the best way?
    Ordinarily we always recommend a complaint to a landowner, especially a retailers car park. It may not be Sainsbury!!!8217;s, but they may be able to direct you to who it is.

    But as this is a HV ticket, just whip in the full initial appeal and you!!!8217;ll get a very quick response of a cancellation - often quicker than you can get the Sainsburys phone number and make the call.

    We!!!8217;ve had tickets cancelled in under 2 hours of the appeal being sent. Go and beat that!
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 26th Jan 18, 11:27 AM
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    The Deep
    • #6
    • 26th Jan 18, 11:27 AM
    • #6
    • 26th Jan 18, 11:27 AM
    By the way, the keeper can be identified on here by the very precise dates and times. I would suggest you edit them and just call it a double dip of x - hours.


    Hardly matters with a double dip.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 26th Jan 18, 11:33 PM
    • 56,325 Posts
    • 69,947 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #7
    • 26th Jan 18, 11:33 PM
    • #7
    • 26th Jan 18, 11:33 PM
    Thanks - I've edited the specifics, I was unsure whether I should send the full version of the initial appeal template, or just a cut down version highlighting the POFA / 14 days error.
    Originally posted by savity
    Either the template from the NEWBIES thread, or this version, work very nicely, v Highview:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5612169

    No need to do anything else IMHO, they will fold.

    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Guys Dad
    • By Guys Dad 28th Jan 18, 4:55 AM
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    Guys Dad
    • #8
    • 28th Jan 18, 4:55 AM
    • #8
    • 28th Jan 18, 4:55 AM
    You don't even need the blue template when they have breached POFA. Simple 1 point appeal to HV will get the ticket cancelled. I have done this for 3 friends and got cancellation in 2-3 days.

    If you still want to use the blue template, then put your out of time point first and don't get it lost in the standard generics.
    • savity
    • By savity 13th Feb 18, 12:03 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    savity
    • #9
    • 13th Feb 18, 12:03 PM
    • #9
    • 13th Feb 18, 12:03 PM
    Just to respond to this with the outcome - in case anyone else finds my thread and wonders if the advice bore fruit.

    I took a little while to respond, due to other commitments, but got round to navigating their appeals website on Sunday 4th Feb.. After carefully avoiding the selection options that confirmed the driver, I submitted the suggestion in post #7 from coupon_mad (I can't duplicate the link here as a newbie)

    I had a response confirming my appeal within minutes, but stating that they were receiving a high volume of correspondence, so it may take a while to get back to us.

    I then received a response on Friday 9th Feb saying they had investigated and confirm that the Notice had been cancelled in full and no further action taken.

    So - thankyou for the advice on this thread and the forum, for making sure I was suitably informed about what to say or not to give me the best chance of it being cancelled.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 13th Feb 18, 12:07 PM
    • 56,325 Posts
    • 69,947 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Yay, as always!
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • pappa golf
    • By pappa golf 13th Feb 18, 12:12 PM
    • 8,706 Posts
    • 9,295 Thanks
    pappa golf
    the high level of correspondance may be because of a sudden drop in DVLA access for a few weeks (wonder why?) then a massive request for info afterwards

    either there "amstrad" broke down or perhaps they were not allowed access for a dew weeks , then had to chuck all the out of date ones in at once

    the figures are shown in kodoe 2017 volumes
    Save a Rachael

    buy a share in crapita
    • waamo
    • By waamo 13th Feb 18, 12:13 PM
    • 3,032 Posts
    • 3,940 Thanks
    waamo
    Simple wasn't it? It amazes me how many people can't cut and paste an appeal. They will argue for pages how each point doesn't apply to their unique case.

    This is how it should be done. Well done.
    This space for hire.
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 13th Feb 18, 12:28 PM
    • 9,095 Posts
    • 8,791 Thanks
    The Deep
    Have you watched the video where MPs say what naughty boys these chaps are? Here it us, watch it and complain to your MP.

    http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41

    They would not have cancelled if you had not taken the fight to them.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • ses6jwg
    • By ses6jwg 13th Feb 18, 12:34 PM
    • 5,202 Posts
    • 5,820 Thanks
    ses6jwg
    Hello all,


    I also received similar notice from New Generation parking for the driver allegedly being on double yellow lines in a "free" car park.


    There was no windscreen sticker and the alleged "offence" took place on the 23/12/2017.


    The notice is dated 8.2.2018, the car is a lease car however the letter was addressed to "the fleet department, my name, and my address"


    The car is pictured on double yellow lines, with rear lights and brake light showing as applied behind another vehicle immediately in front.


    Should I appeal using the template in the newbie thread but adding in a note about POFA and the 14 day period?


    They are part of IPC not BPA.
    Last edited by ses6jwg; 13-02-2018 at 12:37 PM.
    • waamo
    • By waamo 13th Feb 18, 12:45 PM
    • 3,032 Posts
    • 3,940 Thanks
    waamo
    Hello all,


    I also received similar notice from New Generation parking for the driver allegedly being on double yellow lines in a "free" car park.


    There was no windscreen sticker and the alleged "offence" took place on the 23/12/2017.


    The notice is dated 8.2.2018, the car is a lease car however the letter was addressed to "the fleet department, my name, and my address"


    The car is pictured on double yellow lines, with rear lights and brake light showing as applied behind another vehicle immediately in front.


    Should I appeal using the template in the newbie thread but adding in a note about POFA and the 14 day period?


    They are part of IPC not BPA.
    Originally posted by ses6jwg
    For your own unique case it's best to start your own unique thread. Let the op bask in the glory of this one without it getting blown off course by further questions.
    This space for hire.
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