Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • mrmench
    • By mrmench 11th Jan 18, 3:34 PM
    • 12Posts
    • 13Thanks
    mrmench
    Horizon Parking Hearing Tommorow- No information received from the other side
    • #1
    • 11th Jan 18, 3:34 PM
    Horizon Parking Hearing Tommorow- No information received from the other side 11th Jan 18 at 3:34 PM
    Hi All,

    A couple of months ago I successfully defended a claim against Horizon Parking/Gladstones Solicitors, in which the Judge found in my favor due to various holes in their defense including evidence of a robo claim, no evidence the maps they included in their witness statement related to the parking site in question, and further no contract being formed between the driver and them.

    I am in court tomorrow for another claim against me, for the same parking site but different dates.

    The court ordered us both to file anything which we seek to reply upon by a certain date (i.e. witness statements, defences etc) to which I complied with. To date I have received nothing from Gladstones solicitors apart from a particulars of claim.

    Do I go to court tomorrow and tell the Judge that the last claim (same circumstances) was found in my favor, and this is clear evidence they have no respect for the court in filing robo claims and they are now seeking to ambush me in court therefore the claim should be thrown out.

    Any advice would be appreciated.

    Thanks
    MM
Page 1
    • Half_way
    • By Half_way 11th Jan 18, 3:40 PM
    • 4,152 Posts
    • 5,888 Thanks
    Half_way
    • #2
    • 11th Jan 18, 3:40 PM
    • #2
    • 11th Jan 18, 3:40 PM
    if you don't turn up it will probably end up at a default judgment against you.

    who's car park is this?
    From the Plain Language Commission:

    "The BPA has surely become one of the most socially dangerous organisations in the UK"
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 11th Jan 18, 3:51 PM
    • 2,406 Posts
    • 4,285 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    • #3
    • 11th Jan 18, 3:51 PM
    • #3
    • 11th Jan 18, 3:51 PM
    I am in court tomorrow for another claim against me, for the same parking site but different dates.
    This is the normal approach by PCM who just throw people at court.

    if you don't turn up it will probably end up at a default judgment against you.
    Not always but it can happen. Better to play safe.

    The main issue with these claims is that by not pushing the claim, the can issue others unless you go along and ask the judge to rule them to be vexatious litigants. The alternative is to get a judgement against them on the facts and then use the principal of Res Judicata to spike any further claims at the site.

    a matter that has been adjudicated by a competent court and therefore may not be pursued further by the same parties.
    Idiots please note: If you intend NOT to read the information on the Notice of Allocation and hand a simple win to the knuckle dragging ex-clampers, then don't waste people's time with questions on a claim you'll not defend.
    • logician
    • By logician 11th Jan 18, 4:03 PM
    • 194 Posts
    • 76 Thanks
    logician
    • #4
    • 11th Jan 18, 4:03 PM
    • #4
    • 11th Jan 18, 4:03 PM
    Hi All,

    A couple of months ago I successfully defended a claim against Horizon Parking/Gladstones Solicitors, in which the Judge found in my favor due to various holes in their defense including evidence of a robo claim, no evidence the maps they included in their witness statement related to the parking site in question, and further no contract being formed between the driver and them.

    I am in court tomorrow for another claim against me, for the same parking site but different dates.

    The court ordered us both to file anything which we seek to reply upon by a certain date (i.e. witness statements, defences etc) to which I complied with. To date I have received nothing from Gladstones solicitors apart from a particulars of claim.

    Do I go to court tomorrow and tell the Judge that the last claim (same circumstances) was found in my favor, and this is clear evidence they have no respect for the court in filing robo claims and they are now seeking to ambush me in court therefore the claim should be thrown out.

    Any advice would be appreciated.

    Thanks
    MM
    Originally posted by mrmench
    [QUOTE=IamEmanresu;73700892]This is the normal approach by PCM who just throw people at court.



    /QUOTE]

    The OP says this is Horizon not PCM

    @ MrMench - you must turn up and prepare a costs schedule..

    Do a brief skeleton now to hand to the judge first thing.

    Include in this the previous judgment in your favour.

    The sparse lacking POCs for this claim not compliant with CPR.

    the lack of evidence supplied by the Claimant

    If you draft something the forum will peer review this for you
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 11th Jan 18, 4:06 PM
    • 2,406 Posts
    • 4,285 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    • #5
    • 11th Jan 18, 4:06 PM
    • #5
    • 11th Jan 18, 4:06 PM
    The OP says this is Horizon not PCM

    Should have said this is the normal approach of Gladstones who just throw people at the court. Is this Oxford?
    Idiots please note: If you intend NOT to read the information on the Notice of Allocation and hand a simple win to the knuckle dragging ex-clampers, then don't waste people's time with questions on a claim you'll not defend.
    • logician
    • By logician 11th Jan 18, 4:14 PM
    • 194 Posts
    • 76 Thanks
    logician
    • #6
    • 11th Jan 18, 4:14 PM
    • #6
    • 11th Jan 18, 4:14 PM
    Absolutely Gladstones MO :-)




    Do I go to court tomorrow and tell the Judge that the last claim (same circumstances) was found in my favor, and this is clear evidence they have no respect for the court in filing robo claims and they are now seeking to ambush me in court therefore the claim should be thrown out.

    Any advice would be appreciated.

    Thanks
    MM
    Originally posted by mrmench
    You also have a duty to the court to assist with any pertinent facts. The fact you had a claim dismissed before is pertinent to the case especially if the facts turn on the same points

    I am aware of one case reported on the forums where the Defendant failed to disclose this and lost the second case. (and may be appealed?? I think this was indicated on PPP )



    I would also point you to CPR 39.3 regarding non attendance

    https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part39#39.3
    Failure to attend the trial
    39.3

    (1) The court may proceed with a trial in the absence of a party but !!!8211;

    (a) if no party attends the trial, it may strike out(GL) the whole of the proceedings;

    (b) if the claimant does not attend, it may strike out his claim and any defence to counterclaim; and

    (c) if a defendant does not attend, it may strike out his defence or counterclaim (or both).

    (2) Where the court strikes out proceedings, or any part of them, under this rule, it may subsequently restore the proceedings, or that part.

    (3) Where a party does not attend and the court gives judgment or makes an order against him, the party who failed to attend may apply for the judgment or order to be set aside(GL).

    (4) An application under paragraph (2) or paragraph (3) must be supported by evidence.

    (5) Where an application is made under paragraph (2) or (3) by a party who failed to attend the trial, the court may grant the application only if the applicant !!!8211;

    (a) acted promptly when he found out that the court had exercised its power to strike out(GL) or to enter judgment or make an order against him;

    (b) had a good reason for not attending the trial; and

    (c) has a reasonable prospect of success at the trial.
    Last edited by logician; 11-01-2018 at 4:20 PM.
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 11th Jan 18, 4:15 PM
    • 9,478 Posts
    • 9,231 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #7
    • 11th Jan 18, 4:15 PM
    • #7
    • 11th Jan 18, 4:15 PM
    You may be entitled to punitive costs for their unreasonable behaviour, but you will have to put up a very good argument, judges for some reason are loathe to award these costs, even when the motorist has wasted hours of their time on them.

    You can claim £19 an hour for your time, including that spent on research, visiting the site, attending court, reading and sending cotrrespondence, hobbling to the Post Office on your bad leg, etc., etc., etc.

    Google CPR27.14(2)(g). If the judge turns you down, do not accept his/her decision without an argument.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • mrmench
    • By mrmench 12th Jan 18, 10:49 AM
    • 12 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    mrmench
    • #8
    • 12th Jan 18, 10:49 AM
    • #8
    • 12th Jan 18, 10:49 AM
    Quick update- I'm at Oxford waiting for my hearing. Horizon's legal representative is saying she sent all the evidence they intend to rely upon via email on 15.12.17. However on 22.12.17 I emailed the court and Gladstones solicitors stating I had not received anything.

    I have not seen anything they intended to rely on it is not in my inbox or junk mail. She is refusing to let me see anything, and is saying she has no hard copies.

    What do I do?
    • Lamilad
    • By Lamilad 12th Jan 18, 11:01 AM
    • 1,353 Posts
    • 2,712 Thanks
    Lamilad
    • #9
    • 12th Jan 18, 11:01 AM
    • #9
    • 12th Jan 18, 11:01 AM
    Quick update- I'm at Oxford waiting for my hearing. Horizon's legal representative is saying she sent all the evidence they intend to rely upon via email on 15.12.17. However on 22.12.17 I emailed the court and Gladstones solicitors stating I had not received anything.
    They must have proof of postage. If they've emailed it do they have confirmation from you that you are happy to accept service by email and do they have proof that the emails were sent by them and received by you - such as a read report or a response from you?

    Bundles are large documents that take a lot of mb/gb. It may have been too large for your email server to accept, which is their responsibility.

    Just because they have copies of the documents isn't proof that they posted them, nor is them saying "yes we posted them" demand proof of postage or they're assertion of service must be rejected by the court.

    Say you are willing to state under oath that you have not received their bundle.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 12th Jan 18, 11:02 AM
    • 17,982 Posts
    • 28,467 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    Talk to the Court Usher if you have chance before going in - seek his/her advice.

    You will need to appraise the Judge at the commencement of proceedings - don!!!8217;t leave it until some way into the hearing.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Lamilad
    • By Lamilad 12th Jan 18, 11:09 AM
    • 1,353 Posts
    • 2,712 Thanks
    Lamilad
    If the judge is minded to adjourn so they can send you the docs, object strongly to this. Saying the claimant is a serial litigant with professional legal representation. They know the rules inside out.

    You have complied and you are litigant in person so they should be held to a higher standard. As such the court should not overlook a fundamental failing by them and should proceed on the basis they have provided no Witness statement or evidence to support their case.

    If it is adorned ask for a wasted costs order due to the claimant's failure to serve documents.
    £95 for a day off work or days leave.
    £xx for traveling and parking 45p per mile
    Last edited by Lamilad; 12-01-2018 at 11:13 AM.
    • mrmench
    • By mrmench 12th Jan 18, 11:09 AM
    • 12 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    mrmench
    We've been sent out to read each other's info. Apparently they hadn't received my witness statement which is what they are going to read now.

    They seem to have the EXACT SAME witness statement from the case I won in sepetember. The judge seems to be more friendly towards her. What I don't get is if the witness statement is the same as the case I won before why can't I win today?
    • Lamilad
    • By Lamilad 12th Jan 18, 11:17 AM
    • 1,353 Posts
    • 2,712 Thanks
    Lamilad
    You can't have the same ws for two separate events.

    You must tell the judge that you can't be expected to fully discern the claimants full bundle of documents and formulate a coherent response in a matter of minutes.

    Unless they can prove service of docs they must be held to account as I've stated above or the case should be adjourned with a wasted costs order awarded to you
    • mrmench
    • By mrmench 12th Jan 18, 11:20 AM
    • 12 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    mrmench
    The dates differ that's it- for which days parking was breached
    • mrmench
    • By mrmench 12th Jan 18, 11:22 AM
    • 12 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    mrmench
    How do I get the judge to reduce the payment as it looks like I will lose
    • Lamilad
    • By Lamilad 12th Jan 18, 11:23 AM
    • 1,353 Posts
    • 2,712 Thanks
    Lamilad
    Does the court have a copy of their bundle?

    And Can you prove your WS was sent?
    • mrmench
    • By mrmench 12th Jan 18, 11:32 AM
    • 12 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    mrmench
    The previous judge ruled in my favour as there was no evidence the signs in their witness statement related to the parking sight I was at. This judge is just disregarding that and seems to be on their side. I will go back in and try my best.
    • Lamilad
    • By Lamilad 12th Jan 18, 11:37 AM
    • 1,353 Posts
    • 2,712 Thanks
    Lamilad
    How do I get the judge to reduce the payment as it looks like I will lose
    Why do you suddenly think that?

    If it comes to that you state that according to statute law (PoFA) the only amount that can be recovered is the original PCN amount of £100, + court fee of £25, and (maybe) £50 legal costs if they can prove they've been incurred. Anything else is fake bolted on charges made up out of thin air. The original £100 is already a massively inflated charge which accounts for any of their admin and processing costs
    • Lamilad
    • By Lamilad 12th Jan 18, 2:24 PM
    • 1,353 Posts
    • 2,712 Thanks
    Lamilad
    How did you get on?
    • mrmench
    • By mrmench 12th Jan 18, 2:38 PM
    • 12 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    mrmench
    Update!

    So Gladstones Solicitor had a hearing at 2pm in Bristol and told the Judge she wasn't going to make it. I told the judge this is a blatant disregard for the court system, to which the judge (who at this point seemed damned to rule against me regardless) said it was best to adjourn as they hadn't received my witness statement and I hadn't received their witness statement.

    I asked for costs for the day off work to which the claimant said a litigant in person couldn't claim, and the judge said it was both our faults so we should adjourn.

    I have 2 weeks to file and serve a paper copy of my witness statement. Their witness statement is a typical roboclaim.

    What shall I do now?
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

4,214Posts Today

6,995Users online

Martin's Twitter