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  • FIRST POST
    • cosmic4z
    • By cosmic4z 11th Jan 18, 3:26 PM
    • 59Posts
    • 21Thanks
    cosmic4z
    Court Claim Form received - advice please.
    • #1
    • 11th Jan 18, 3:26 PM
    Court Claim Form received - advice please. 11th Jan 18 at 3:26 PM
    Hope you can help...

    We (my elderly mom is the defendant) received a Claim Form from the County Court Business Center (in Northampton) this morning, 11 Jan 2018; relating to a parking incident in December 2013.

    I've read through post #2 in the newbies thread a few times, and as the claimant has filled out the Particulars of Claim box, the next step for us seems to be Acknowledgement of Service.

    Worth noting, the PoC seem a bit sparse. The claimant (VCS ltd / BW legal) hasn't responded to our response to their Letter of Claim; which amongst other things, we requested more extensive information / evidence regarding their claim. Our response to their LoC was late though (38 days after their LoC). See thread: http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5767376

    I imagine that can be addressed later, and at this stage, I just need to send off the AoS.

    Is it better to use MCOL or return the AoS by post?

    I've tried not to include too much information here (don't want to include anything that would identify us), but if there's anything I've missed that would help us, please let me know and I'll include it in the thread.

    Kind Regards,
    Last edited by cosmic4z; 11-01-2018 at 3:33 PM.
Page 3
    • cosmic4z
    • By cosmic4z 2nd Mar 18, 4:54 PM
    • 59 Posts
    • 21 Thanks
    cosmic4z
    Thanks Coupon-Mad.

    Have completed the form. Should I send original back to the CCBC, and a copy to other side? Should I include any kind of cover note?

    Thanks.
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 2nd Mar 18, 7:17 PM
    • 3,760 Posts
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    nosferatu1001
    Original to CCBC, copy to C, no need for a cover note.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 6th Apr 18, 12:42 AM
    • 62,736 Posts
    • 75,677 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Let us know when your case gets allocated to your local court and you get the letter stating the hearing date and the date by which you MUST file your WS and evidence.

    Don't pop back the day before the hearing, having filed no WS/evidence!

    • cosmic4z
    • By cosmic4z 6th Apr 18, 2:05 PM
    • 59 Posts
    • 21 Thanks
    cosmic4z
    Thanks Coupon-mad,

    It's been allocated to our local court. We have not received a hearing date though.

    Is there anything I should be doing in the meantime?
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 6th Apr 18, 2:42 PM
    • 9,953 Posts
    • 10,256 Thanks
    KeithP
    Is there anything I should be doing in the meantime?
    Originally posted by cosmic4z
    As already mentioned, you should be thinking about your Witness Statement and gathering evidence.
    .
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 6th Apr 18, 3:32 PM
    • 62,736 Posts
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    Coupon-mad
    Read the NEWBIES thread post #2 again and click on the examples of WS/evidence, to get ready.
    • cosmic4z
    • By cosmic4z 6th Apr 18, 3:46 PM
    • 59 Posts
    • 21 Thanks
    cosmic4z
    This is the first time I've had to do anything like this, and as I've said before, I am completely overwhelmed and stressed by it all. I estimate I've sunk at least 50 hours in to this already (not to mention lost sleep), I know that may sound like a lot, but this is just not the kind of thing I have a natural affinity for.

    I just wanted some help dealing with this; but the amount and type of work required, it's a bit like learning a complete new foreign language. I also have a lot of other things stressing and pulling at my attention.

    I honestly don't think I have the right stuff to help my mom with this. She's unable to use the internet herself, and in any case would be more incompetent than I am to prepare a defence.

    Can you please refer me where I can point her to to get help? I did try some other site a month or so back, but they wouldn't help because there was an active thread on the matter here.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 6th Apr 18, 3:51 PM
    • 62,736 Posts
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    Coupon-mad
    See my post above, tells you where to find easy examples of WS. You CAN do this!

    You tried the BMPA and they told you to stay here (I know that because the person who runs it, told me!). You are getting all the advice you need here, take a look at where I told you to look!

    The WS is easy peasy, just a statement of what happened, 'I did this, then this happened'. Think about what evidence she wants to show (photos? case transcripts that were mentioned in the defence?).
    • Redx
    • By Redx 6th Apr 18, 3:55 PM
    • 19,697 Posts
    • 24,978 Thanks
    Redx
    you or she wont get better help than on here and the people replying know more about the topic than any place like the CAB or a "standard" solicitor , plus that BMPA person also posts on here too

    I think you are expecting far too much for free, the people replying are volunteers giving up their time and overwhelmed by the sheer number of threads about court cases etc

    nobody will do it for you and although you could try legal beagles or pepipoo forums you will likely find a few of the same people responding anyway

    read my signature, MSE is not a legal advice forum, but the people here do their best to advise people like yourself or your relative , but charity starts at home and somebody like a friend or family member needs to step up here and do what they are being advised by the goodwill volunteers on here who do so for free

    nobody would do this on a paid basis as it would cost far too much if you totted up the hours worked and even got 7.80p per hour for them, tot up your own hours and see that it is not economic for you , never mind anyone else

    it takes as long as it takes and some prisoners (and/or their relatives or friends) have worked on their own cases free of charge for years when appealing etc

    so either you or someone near to the defendant needs to step up and take onboard what has been said , especially when people like coupon mad have taken the time to digest the story and reply

    your mom did it for you and wiped your backside and cooked , cleaned , washed and ironed etc for you when you were younger, nobody trained her either but I bet she did a good job and its up to you or somebody similar to step up and return the favour, especially as she put YEARS into getting you to where you are now with many hardships along the way

    ps:- you have already had free legal advice from a qualified solicitor (LOC123) and she had to learn fast about this topic and so her advice was invaluable and will always be so (you wont find many solicitors that understand this topic and they charge a lot for their services too, whether they do or dont know about this topic)
    Last edited by Redx; 06-04-2018 at 4:09 PM.
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • cosmic4z
    • By cosmic4z 9th Apr 18, 7:00 PM
    • 59 Posts
    • 21 Thanks
    cosmic4z
    Please do not confuse my frustration, with a lack of appreciation for all the help, expertise and advice I've been given so far. I know I must sound ungrateful, and I'm sorry if I give that impression, but it is not the case. I am most appreciative for all the helpful advice and encouragement I've received on this forum. Thank you.

    For what it's worth, I believe my frustration is largely due to my not really grasping the fundamentals of the law, and legal processes involved in these cases. It's like playing chess without understanding how the pieces move, or the strategies involved; but just blindy repeating moves at someone else's instruction. Fine while the person instructing you is present, but once they're gone, you're on your own, and you're in trouble (because you have no understanding of what you're actually doing and why).

    That's how I feel, overwhelmed, confused and unclear how to progress. I do want to progress though. I want to get through this thing, knowing I've given it my best shot.

    Trying to stay calm and focus on what needs doing; the witness statement and evidence. I found the relevant part of post #2 in the newbies thread. I'll read through that, and the examples given, a few times, and do my best with it.

    Thank you all for your patience.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 9th Apr 18, 7:09 PM
    • 62,736 Posts
    • 75,677 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Trying to stay calm and focus on what needs doing; the witness statement and evidence. I found the relevant part of post #2 in the newbies thread. I'll read through that, and the examples given, a few times, and do my best with it.

    Good, honestly you can do this bit:

    - the story of what happened and what letters were received and why you are not liable

    plus

    - all the photos you want to use, and case law and transcripts, and the POFA Schedule 4, and Henry Greenslade's words about 'understanding keeper liability' from the POPLA Annual report 2015, and the Equality Act EHRC CoP for Service Providers *where it makes it clear about 'indirect discrimination' not having a defence of the trader not knowing about an individual's disability. Not that the driver of the car has ever been established, but you were an occupant of the car!

    This is your argument to prove with evidence, so go back over your defence and stop every time the defence cites some case law or evidence, and go and get that as an attachment, so you have a series of evidence pieces.



    * Google it, go and download it!
    Last edited by Coupon-mad; 09-04-2018 at 7:12 PM.
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 9th Apr 18, 7:13 PM
    • 37,527 Posts
    • 21,738 Thanks
    Quentin

    Can you please refer me where I can point her to to get help? I did try some other site a month or so back, but they wouldn't help because there was an active thread on the matter here......
    Originally posted by cosmic4z
    Interesting


    Can you tell us where this was
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 9th Apr 18, 7:19 PM
    • 62,736 Posts
    • 75,677 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    It was the BMPA, Quentin; I am a founder member (but I don't run it or reply to people on the website, nor can I take the credit for writing the very useful pages of info - the author knows who they are and how much the resource is appreciated, I hope).

    The BMPA emailed me a while back about this case and checked we were OK to keep it here where the OP was getting lots of good advice the BMPA was happy with. Saves duplication of work.
    • cosmic4z
    • By cosmic4z 19th Jun 18, 11:45 AM
    • 59 Posts
    • 21 Thanks
    cosmic4z
    Just to update. We got witness statement from other side this morning. Is it automatic case lost if we haven't filed one? Can we request to pay amount owed (if we lose) in instalments?
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 19th Jun 18, 11:48 AM
    • 37,527 Posts
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    Quentin
    1) No - but why didn't you??


    2) You can ask, but bear in mind that if you do lose and don't pay it off in full within a month from the judgement then the CCJ remains on the record (and your credit files) for 6 years irrespective of when you finally clear it off
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 19th Jun 18, 11:49 AM
    • 62,736 Posts
    • 75,677 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Just to update. We got witness statement from other side this morning. Is it automatic case lost if we haven't filed one? Can we request to pay amount owed (if we lose) in instalments?
    Originally posted by cosmic4z
    Obviously you file one this week, even if late, and don't draw attention to it.

    You been here MONTHS, you know a WS is needed and it's only the simple story of what happened and your defence in your own words...really EASY stage but vital because it's when you get to file your evidence, transcripts of cases, photos, etc.

    Right now, you have no evidence filed. You have dropped the ball so kick it back in!
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 19th Jun 18, 11:51 AM
    • 3,760 Posts
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    nosferatu1001
    Indeed, and why havent you filed one? You knew of the date well in advance. It could not have been a surprise.

    Just get one written TODAY and file post hast e- one to court, one to claimant. Do it. Dont prevariacte and ask if you really can, yes, you can, just GET ON WITH IT
    • cosmic4z
    • By cosmic4z 19th Jun 18, 12:27 PM
    • 59 Posts
    • 21 Thanks
    cosmic4z
    I very much want to file one.


    I apprecieate it seems easy to you guys; to me though, it just looks like a big pile of mush that I can't make any coherent sense of. It's like my brain has just gone in to meltdown, brain-freeze, nervous breakdown kind of thing, over this. It's not a simple task like laying a brick wall; it's more like being asked to write a story, only, in a language that you don't understand; you can't 'just GET ON WITH IT'. I think when you're overwhelemend, and you don't know how to do a thing, people shouting at you doesn't really help; what actually helps is patience, an appreciation that someone is struggling (finding incredibly hard something you yourself consider incredibly easy), and a willingness to break things down for that person in such a way they can comprehend and achieve: i.e. bite sized, digestable chunks.



    Anyhow, right now, I have a witness statement template; just the header bit.

    I'm intending to populate it with what happened on the day, from the perspective of my mom.


    I'm going to add items of evidence after that. I can't think right now what they might be, other than copy paste webpage relating to the Norwich City Council case against Blue Badge Holder.
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 19th Jun 18, 12:41 PM
    • 37,527 Posts
    • 21,738 Thanks
    Quentin
    I very much want to file one.

    . ......It's not a simple task like laying a brick wall; it's more like being asked to write a story, only, in a language that you don't understand; you can't 'just GET ON WITH IT'.....
    Originally posted by cosmic4z

    But you do write it in your own language (not in legal speak!) - see the examples linked in the FAQ (#2)
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 19th Jun 18, 12:47 PM
    • 3,760 Posts
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    nosferatu1001
    You hadnt explained any of that before, so how could we guess? We cannot mind read. We know the info you put here, nothing more.

    Youre not writing in legal language. You are writing a simple, concise account of the events around this case. Set it out logically - the defendant is the keeper of vehicle X on the date in question, then what happened on the day if you know, what happened after etc.

    You need eivdnce to support your defence.
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