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  • FIRST POST
    • johntaylor1980
    • By johntaylor1980 8th Jan 18, 9:38 PM
    • 11Posts
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    johntaylor1980
    Solicitor trying to charge more money after sale
    • #1
    • 8th Jan 18, 9:38 PM
    Solicitor trying to charge more money after sale 8th Jan 18 at 9:38 PM
    Hi,

    I recently completed on a house purchase, all paid up then the solicitors contacts me last week saying the land registry fee is a transfer of part so are demanding an extra 135. Any advice on how I should deal with this?
    Last edited by johntaylor1980; 12-05-2018 at 2:57 PM.
Page 1
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 8th Jan 18, 9:41 PM
    • 7,843 Posts
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    davidmcn
    • #2
    • 8th Jan 18, 9:41 PM
    • #2
    • 8th Jan 18, 9:41 PM
    You should send them the 135 so they can register your title.
    • Slithery
    • By Slithery 8th Jan 18, 9:41 PM
    • 725 Posts
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    Slithery
    • #3
    • 8th Jan 18, 9:41 PM
    • #3
    • 8th Jan 18, 9:41 PM
    If the solicitor is correct then you need to pay them.
    • johntaylor1980
    • By johntaylor1980 8th Jan 18, 9:47 PM
    • 11 Posts
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    johntaylor1980
    • #4
    • 8th Jan 18, 9:47 PM
    • #4
    • 8th Jan 18, 9:47 PM
    Can a solicitor refuse to register the title if I don't pay? I don't want to be awkward but the solicitors have been useless throughout and this seems like the final kick in.
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 8th Jan 18, 9:50 PM
    • 7,843 Posts
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    davidmcn
    • #5
    • 8th Jan 18, 9:50 PM
    • #5
    • 8th Jan 18, 9:50 PM
    Can a solicitor refuse to register the title if I don't pay?
    Originally posted by johntaylor1980
    Yes, of course they can. They're talking about the Land Registry fee, which you'd have to pay even if you weren't using a solicitor. Just pay it. If you think they warrant a complaint for otherwise being useless then make a complaint.
    • Davesnave
    • By Davesnave 8th Jan 18, 10:00 PM
    • 25,312 Posts
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    Davesnave
    • #6
    • 8th Jan 18, 10:00 PM
    • #6
    • 8th Jan 18, 10:00 PM
    Your title is wrong. The solicitor isn't 'trying to charge more money;' they're just passing on an expense incurred in the registration process.
    If you are finding huge gaps between your paragraphs and use Firefox, MSE know about the problem. However, they aren't necessarily doing anything about it yet....
    https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5844460
    • debsy42
    • By debsy42 8th Jan 18, 10:17 PM
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    debsy42
    • #7
    • 8th Jan 18, 10:17 PM
    • #7
    • 8th Jan 18, 10:17 PM
    We had the exact same thing happen when we bought our house, we received an email from our solicitor requesting an extra 135 for the Land Registry fee.

    When I queried this with our solicitor they reviewed the charge and said that the Land Registry had made the error and that the original fee of 135 was correct (Something along the lines of a discount should have been applied but wasn't)

    We received an apology from our solicitors for their error and heard no more.

    Definitely query this first before stumping up any cash
    ITV Winners Club #87
    • johntaylor1980
    • By johntaylor1980 8th Jan 18, 10:29 PM
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    johntaylor1980
    • #8
    • 8th Jan 18, 10:29 PM
    • #8
    • 8th Jan 18, 10:29 PM
    Thanks for the advice. What I don!!!8217;t get is the part transfer? We have bought all the property as a freehold.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 8th Jan 18, 11:19 PM
    • 44,452 Posts
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    G_M
    • #9
    • 8th Jan 18, 11:19 PM
    • #9
    • 8th Jan 18, 11:19 PM
    Thanks for the advice. What I don!!!8217;t get is the part transfer? We have bought all the property as a freehold.
    Originally posted by johntaylor1980
    Then query the charge.

    As others ave said, if it genuinely reflects the relevant Land Registry fee involved, then either pay the solicitor, or register the Title yourself (which will involve pying the fee!).

    But if the solicitor has made an error, then query it.

    If you want more detailed advice as to the appropriateness of the fee, you'll ned to give us fuller information

    * exactly what you have bought and
    * exactly how the fee is described.
    • charlie792
    • By charlie792 9th Jan 18, 3:13 AM
    • 1,653 Posts
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    charlie792
    Thanks for the advice. What I don!!!8217;t get is the part transfer? We have bought all the property as a freehold.
    Originally posted by johntaylor1980
    Whilst you may be buying the whole feeehold it is possible the property is being transferred out of a larger title, i.e. A new build, or the seller is only selling part of the land they own to you.
    I am surprised however this was not explained to you and you should have been given a TP1 (as opposed to a TR1) for signature which sets out exactly what you are buying.

    If a transfer of part then registration at Land Registry cannot be done electronically and therefore a higher fee is payable - 270 non electronic or 135 electronically (assuming the value of the property based on the fee quoted)
    Last edited by charlie792; 09-01-2018 at 3:17 AM.
    • Margot123
    • By Margot123 9th Jan 18, 10:09 AM
    • 844 Posts
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    Margot123
    Go back through the initial letter of engagement from your solicitor. This should mention 'disbursements', and that includes such things as Land Registry fees as being at additional cost.

    My solicitor detailed this charge (property not electronically registered) before me even contracting them to do the work. Some do, some don't.
    • NineDeuce
    • By NineDeuce 9th Jan 18, 12:01 PM
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    NineDeuce
    I dont know what your exact rights here are. I think you would probably have to pay it.

    The other posters on here are right in saying that you have to pay this and that this is not profit for the solicitors. However, the solicitor is at fault for not mentioning this in the original quote. By omitting a fee from the quote, this could make easily have persuaded you to use this company over another. This is misleading, however unintentional. They have been negligent

    Someone may argue that you should know this but I dont think so. If they have provided you with a quote to see through a house sale/purchase, then they should be obliged to stick with it.

    What would be their reaction if you said to them that you felt like taking some money off?
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 9th Jan 18, 12:17 PM
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    davidmcn
    Someone may argue that you should know this but I dont think so. If they have provided you with a quote to see through a house sale/purchase, then they should be obliged to stick with it.
    Originally posted by NineDeuce
    They will probably have been quite clear in stating that the third party disbursements are merely estimates, and will depend on the eventual detail of the transaction (e.g. they won't necessarily know at the outset whether a transfer of part is going to be involved), and whether the third party varies their fees or is simply indecisive about what they're going to charge.

    If they had overestimated by 135, the solicitors wouldn't be entitled to pocket the surplus money, so I think the converse ought to apply.
    • NineDeuce
    • By NineDeuce 9th Jan 18, 12:36 PM
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    NineDeuce
    They will probably have been quite clear in stating that the third party disbursements are merely estimates, and will depend on the eventual detail of the transaction (e.g. they won't necessarily know at the outset whether a transfer of part is going to be involved), and whether the third party varies their fees or is simply indecisive about what they're going to charge.

    If they had overestimated by 135, the solicitors wouldn't be entitled to pocket the surplus money, so I think the converse ought to apply.
    Originally posted by davidmcn
    They will know about a land registry fee though wont they?
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 9th Jan 18, 12:41 PM
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    davidmcn
    They will know about a land registry fee though wont they?
    Originally posted by NineDeuce
    Yes, they'll know what the (then) standard registration fee will be, but at the point of quoting the fees won't necessarily know anything about the title or what complications might be involved in registration.

    Similarly, SDLT will be quoted at the standard rate for the price, not taking account of any surcharges or exemptions arising from the client's personal circumstances.
    • Lucky Duck
    • By Lucky Duck 9th Jan 18, 12:52 PM
    • 173 Posts
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    Lucky Duck
    I would have expected the completion statement - which is presumably what the OP has already paid - to have the 'proper figures' for disbursements and the like rather than carrying over an estimates from the original quotation
    • NineDeuce
    • By NineDeuce 9th Jan 18, 1:06 PM
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    NineDeuce
    Yes, they'll know what the (then) standard registration fee will be, but at the point of quoting the fees won't necessarily know anything about the title or what complications might be involved in registration.

    Similarly, SDLT will be quoted at the standard rate for the price, not taking account of any surcharges or exemptions arising from the client's personal circumstances.
    Originally posted by davidmcn
    Well yes, I can understand SDLT because that is percentage variable, but the land registry fee?
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 9th Jan 18, 1:35 PM
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    davidmcn
    Well yes, I can understand SDLT because that is percentage variable, but the land registry fee?
    Originally posted by NineDeuce
    What is it you don't understand about it? The fee will depend on how many titles are affected by the transaction, which deeds require to be registered, whether there are transfers of part involved, whether the Land Registry changes its fees during the course of the transaction...an initial quote will assume it's straightforward, but it might not be.
    • parkrunner
    • By parkrunner 9th Jan 18, 2:00 PM
    • 1,154 Posts
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    parkrunner
    What is it you don't understand about it? The fee will depend on how many titles are affected by the transaction, which deeds require to be registered, whether there are transfers of part involved, whether the Land Registry changes its fees during the course of the transaction...an initial quote will assume it's straightforward, but it might not be.
    Originally posted by davidmcn
    But why would things change after receiving the final bill? I understand your points but surely they would have known about it all prior to the final account unless of course some kind of addendum was added to that bill implying it wasn't final.
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 9th Jan 18, 2:16 PM
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    davidmcn
    But why would things change after receiving the final bill? I understand your points but surely they would have known about it all prior to the final account unless of course some kind of addendum was added to that bill implying it wasn't final.
    Originally posted by parkrunner
    I was more responding to Ninedeuce's comments about them using an attractive quote to compete at the outset rather than discrepancies in the final account - yes, they should have a better idea by the time you get to completion, but even then the "final" account may be subject to change as not everything has actually happened yet. At the end of the day the solicitor's accounts have to reflect the actual costs incurred.
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