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  • FIRST POST
    • celfighter
    • By celfighter 7th Jan 18, 7:59 PM
    • 82Posts
    • 8Thanks
    celfighter
    Metro Inn, Walsall
    • #1
    • 7th Jan 18, 7:59 PM
    Metro Inn, Walsall 7th Jan 18 at 7:59 PM
    Hi Everyone. I hope you can help me. This story is a little long-winded. I'll try to be clear as I can.

    On 08/11/2017 I received a letter from ZZPS about an alleged parking offence (PCN), which took place on 25/07/2017. ZZPS is obviously the debt collection company. I have not received any other correspondence before this letter, no NTK.

    I responded to them by email, as the vehicle in question was registered at the wrong address.

    Your Client: Civil Enforcement Ltd
    PCN: xxxxxxxxxxxxx
    Vehicle: xxxxxxxxxxx
    Location: Metro Inn, Birmingham Road, Walsall, WS5 3AB
    Issue Date: 27/07/2017
    Dear Sir/Madam,

    I refer to your Parking Charge Notice (“PCN”) Ref. xxxxxxxxxxxxx

    I confirm that at the time of this alleged incident, I was the vehicle’s keeper for the purpose of the corresponding definition under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (“POFA 2012”).

    I Must also inform you that you must write to me at a different address; I no longer live at xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx. Further correspondence should be sent to:-
    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

    Further:
    I received no Notice to Keeper at all and have no information about the issue.
    I require ZZPS to supply all photos and copies of all correspondence to me at xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

    Shortly after this email, I received a letter stating that their computer records have now been updated and further correspondence will be sent to the correct address. They said that their client has the photos and I would not be getting any copies unless of litigation .

    This matter has now been passed along to QDR solicitors (Quantum Debt Recovery??) who has raised the outstanding balance and is threatening a CCJ.

    I am wondering how to respond to this matter. Can anyone advise me? I have read the MSE newbies thread, but template letters advise what to do before a solicitor gets involved. I wondered about using this template:

    Dear {name of IPC member - only IPC members for this version!!!}

    Re PCN number:

    I am the keeper of the vehicle and am aware of your purported 'parking charge'. The driver will not be identified. I require the following information so that I can make an informed decision:

    1. Who is the party that contracted with your company and are they the landowner?
    2. Is your charge based on damages for breach of contract? Answer yes or no.
    3. Please provide photos of the signs that you say were on site, which you contend formed a contract with the driver.
    4. Please provide all photographs taken of this vehicle.
    5. Please provide proof that the timing of any camera or timer used was synchronised with all other cameras and/or systems & machines.

    Do not send debt collector letters and do not add any costs, which would be a thinly-veiled attempt at 'double recovery'. I will not respond to debt collectors and to involve a third party would be a failure to mitigate your costs as well as deliberate and knowing misuse of my data.

    Should you obtain the registered keeper's data from the DVLA without reasonable cause (e.g. if you do not fully comply with the IPC Code of Practice in terms of signage at this site, as seems likely based on my research) please take this as formal notice that I reserve the right to sue your company and the landowner/principal, for a sum not less than £250 for any Data Protection Act breach. Your aggressive business practice and unwarranted threat of court for the ordinary matter of a driver using my car without causing any obstruction nor offence, has caused significant distress to me. I do not give you consent to process data relating to me or this vehicle.

    I deny liability for any sum at all and you must consider this letter a Section 10 Notice under the DPA. You are required to respond within 21 days. I have kept proof of submission of this appeal and look forward to your reply.

    Yours faithfully,
Page 5
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 10th Nov 18, 10:05 AM
    • 37,942 Posts
    • 22,055 Thanks
    Quentin
    Ignore their request!
    • beamerguy
    • By beamerguy 10th Nov 18, 10:16 AM
    • 9,302 Posts
    • 12,231 Thanks
    beamerguy
    A few days ago I received an email from CEL telling me they wish to settle. Please view part of the email below.
    "
    In keeping with the Overriding Objective as set out in the CPR, we are we are willing to Settle the above Claim. If you wish to discuss this, please respond to our email, call us on 0870 919 55 77, or alternatively, provide us with a telephone number to contact you on. "

    "
    Surely this is an admission that they haven't got a leg to stand on?
    Originally posted by fisherp123
    Who knows how the tiny minds of CEL work

    Guess they want a last ditch attempt to extort money from you before they discontinue.
    RBS - MNBA - CAPITAL ONE - LLOYDS

    DISGUSTING BEHAVIOUR
    • celfighter
    • By celfighter 10th Nov 18, 2:09 PM
    • 82 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    celfighter
    Ignore it?? I am in Thailand, after all
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 10th Nov 18, 3:23 PM
    • 20,238 Posts
    • 31,930 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    Ignore it?? I am in Thailand, after all
    Originally posted by fisherp123
    Two chances of a happy ending.
    Please note, we are not a legal, residential or credit advice forum, rather one that helps motorists fight private parking charges, primarily at the 'front-end' of the process.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • celfighter
    • By celfighter 12th Nov 18, 11:02 AM
    • 82 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    celfighter
    Here's the email they sent after I asked how a settlement could be reached...
    " As our cover letter stated, you can make the payment of £100 , by calling our automated payment line on 0115 822 5020, or alternatively you can send us a cheque or a postal order. The Court will be informed, and no further action will be taken. "

    To be honest I am feeling a bit annoyed by it all. I feel like saying this :

    " I have an alternative proposal for you...
    You pay me my £255 back and I won't pursue additional costs, as outlined in my costs schedule. "
    What do you think? If they had a strong case they would see me in court and push for all of it, ie, £347 plus costs...
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 12th Nov 18, 12:24 PM
    • 3,921 Posts
    • 4,720 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    Yep, thats one response
    Youre expected to continue communicating and to avoid court time, if possible.

    respond, state you are surprised they think their proposal is acceptable given they have no prospect of success, and that your couter proposal is the sum of £255 to cover your setaside, and you will not pursue the costs in my costs schedule (attached)
    • celfighter
    • By celfighter 12th Nov 18, 12:34 PM
    • 82 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    celfighter
    Thank you so much Nosferstu ��
    I'll get on to this right away!
    • celfighter
    • By celfighter 13th Nov 18, 12:21 PM
    • 82 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    celfighter
    Ok, here's the response from CEL Legal team. Bear in mind, I still haven't seen their witness statement or proof that a breach of terms took place.
    I have asked them to email me WS and Proof for further consideration...

    "We refuse your offer, and as a proof of our goodwill, we still wish to settle the above claim. You have already received our Witness Statement, and all the attached evidence proving a breach of the terms and conditions. We believe this amount is fair and reasonable in the circumstances as it covers the cost, as well as the time spent, particularly given that you failed to correspond with us before the claim was issued, as you have not informed the DVLA about your change of address since December 2015 to 25 of July 2017, when we received the details from the DVLA.

    Please also find attached our Schedule of costs.

    If you still wish to settle the claim or make an offer, please do not hesitate to contact us by phone on 0870 919 55 77, or by email.





    Yours faithfully,



    Legal Team
    "
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 13th Nov 18, 12:31 PM
    • 37,942 Posts
    • 22,055 Thanks
    Quentin
    End of correspondence then!
    • celfighter
    • By celfighter 13th Nov 18, 12:36 PM
    • 82 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    celfighter
    I've asked my dad to open my mail at my house and see what their WS and evidence looks like.
    I hope he can do it soon. I am very intrigued now. Do you think CEL are still bluffing?? Their costs schedule come to almost £350
    • celfighter
    • By celfighter 13th Nov 18, 3:43 PM
    • 82 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    celfighter
    Ok, they emailed me their WS and evidence. Here it is. What do you all think?
    Last edited by celfighter; 13-11-2018 at 4:00 PM. Reason: Mistake
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 13th Nov 18, 3:47 PM
    • 37,942 Posts
    • 22,055 Thanks
    Quentin
    Assuming your initials are pf you need to get your user name changed to something completely anonymous by email to MSE.

    And your name is shown when accessing that link

    The ppcs monitor this forum and can use posts in your thread against you
    • Castle
    • By Castle 13th Nov 18, 3:59 PM
    • 2,008 Posts
    • 2,708 Thanks
    Castle
    Assuming your initials are pf you need to get your user name changed to something completely anonymous by email to MSE.

    And your name is shown when accessing that link

    The ppcs monitor this forum and can use posts in your thread against you
    Originally posted by Quentin
    Not only name but address, car reg and claim number!
    • celfighter
    • By celfighter 13th Nov 18, 3:59 PM
    • 82 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    celfighter
    Thanks Quentin. I have just tried to change my username but itndoesnt seem possible so I have removed the post instead.

    Did you see the evidence inside?
    Are they scaremongering in your opinion?
    • celfighter
    • By celfighter 13th Nov 18, 4:14 PM
    • 82 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    celfighter
    Post 88 indicates that CEL first attempted to contact the driver of the vehicle at my old address. The vehicle must of been still registered there. Somehow, CEL then managed to find my address previous to that (my parents address) and post their threatening ZZPS letters. I had no warning of any breach of contract for over 100 days after the actual alleged event.
    Surely they should of given the driver the opportunity to pay the first bill, which was £60.
    When I received the first letter they were already demanding £200.

    I have seen the photo evidence and I cannot say who the driver actually was that day.
    It looks as though he/she drove in the front entrance of the car park and stayed there for a while before leaving from the same entrance.

    CEL state that there are many signs around the carpark but it appears that the driver may have only had the opportunity to view x1 sign which was too far away to read as they were first entering the car park.
    I am going to rely on these facts in court, as already outlined in my WS and evidence.
    Last edited by celfighter; 13-11-2018 at 4:16 PM. Reason: Error
    • celfighter
    • By celfighter 13th Nov 18, 4:55 PM
    • 82 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    celfighter
    If anyone wishes to view the WS or evidence pls email me here and I will send you a link.

    Can anyone help me now? I am just not sure what to do for the best. Thank you
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 13th Nov 18, 5:50 PM
    • 37,942 Posts
    • 22,055 Thanks
    Quentin
    Thanks Quentin. I have just tried to change my username but itndoesnt seem possible so I have removed the post instead......
    Originally posted by fisherp123
    As advised - you get your name changed by emailing MSE!


    You can't DIY!
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 13th Nov 18, 5:56 PM
    • 10,664 Posts
    • 11,049 Thanks
    KeithP
    I have just tried to change my username but it doesn't seem possible...
    Originally posted by fisherp123
    To help with that, you might like to read this short extract from The MSE Forum Guide - Frequently Asked Questions & Rules:
    Q. How can I change my username?

    A.
    In most circumstances, this is not permitted.

    The only reason we will change your username is if it puts your privacy at risk. This usually means you've inadvertently registered using your name, email address or something that gives away your identity within your username.

    If you fall into this category, email forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com and request that it is changed, giving three alternative usernames in order of preference.
    .
    • celfighter
    • By celfighter 13th Nov 18, 6:26 PM
    • 82 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    celfighter
    Thank you. I have emailed them.
    Should I continue to fight them, in your opinion? They are offering to drop the case for £100 but I'll obviously lose my set aside fee.
    How can I show you their evidence and WS? It's in pdf format and I can't remove the personal details.
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 13th Nov 18, 6:38 PM
    • 10,664 Posts
    • 11,049 Thanks
    KeithP
    How can I show you their evidence and WS? It's in pdf format and I can't remove the personal details.
    Originally posted by fisherp123
    If you cannot remove identifying information then you cannot show it.

    It really is that simple. Forum rules forbid the posting of personal info.
    .
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