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  • FIRST POST
    • jackh123
    • By jackh123 6th Jan 18, 8:51 PM
    • 4Posts
    • 0Thanks
    jackh123
    Used car scandal
    • #1
    • 6th Jan 18, 8:51 PM
    Used car scandal 6th Jan 18 at 8:51 PM
    Hi everyone,

    So it transpires that car dealers should tell customers if the car they're interested in, is a previous lease/rental car.
    In the news:
    bristolpost.co.uk/news/motoring/drivers-second-hand-car-could-1016479
    and they have a dedicated website:
    usedcarscandal.co.uk/

    Both mine and my dads car's are former lease cars, which we didn't know until we got the log book. I'm wanting to make a claim on this, but I don't trust the website; the FAQ's refer to the 'terms and conditions', but does not publish them.

    Does anyone know of a best way to pursue a claim without having to use these?

    Thanks,
    Jack
Page 1
    • wgl2014
    • By wgl2014 6th Jan 18, 8:57 PM
    • 952 Posts
    • 607 Thanks
    wgl2014
    • #2
    • 6th Jan 18, 8:57 PM
    • #2
    • 6th Jan 18, 8:57 PM
    Did you ask if you were buying an ex-lease or rental car?

    Also bear in mind a private lease car will have been with one owner and serviced to spec, I get something like an ex-hire car from Hertz or similar may not appeal and is more likely to have been abused.

    Some people who have been deliberately misled or lied to may have a case somewhere down the line, lots of people have suffered no financial loss and will on a hiding to nothing.
    • Samsung_Note2
    • By Samsung_Note2 6th Jan 18, 9:02 PM
    • 706 Posts
    • 329 Thanks
    Samsung_Note2
    • #3
    • 6th Jan 18, 9:02 PM
    • #3
    • 6th Jan 18, 9:02 PM
    What did that Buffoon Clarkson say once "Hire cars are the fastest cars on the planet" or something similar.

    Id imagine it would have been abused to with in an inch of its life and would throw its self of a very high cliff given half the chance,of course assuming the car had a soul...which is highly doubtful unless its called Christine..https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJ5M11m9vI0
    Its really rather simple...I cant spell and your a Bully..Hang your head in shame.
    • Lorian
    • By Lorian 6th Jan 18, 9:12 PM
    • 4,591 Posts
    • 2,645 Thanks
    Lorian
    • #4
    • 6th Jan 18, 9:12 PM
    • #4
    • 6th Jan 18, 9:12 PM
    Where do people think the massive stocks of nearly new low miles cars come from....
    • House Martin
    • By House Martin 6th Jan 18, 9:18 PM
    • 1,427 Posts
    • 1,192 Thanks
    House Martin
    • #5
    • 6th Jan 18, 9:18 PM
    • #5
    • 6th Jan 18, 9:18 PM
    What did that Buffoon Clarkson say once "Hire cars are the fastest cars on the planet" or something similar.

    Id imagine it would have been abused to with in an inch of its life and would throw its self of a very high cliff given half the chance,of course assuming the car had a soul...which is highly doubtful unless its called Christine..https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJ5M11m9vI0
    Originally posted by Samsung_Note2
    Not a buffoon, just someone who knows the motoring trade.
    Our 3year old ex lease cars are certainly the most hammered cars in existence. We use them as meter reading cars stopping and starting every 100 yds for 5 days a week or thrashed down the motorway.
    Servicing consists of an oil change and ticking a lot of boxes once a year. Pity the poor punter who buys one of those three year old Skoda Citigo s or Citroen C1 s. They may only have 30k miles on the clock but they are 30k hard miles when they go to auction
    We use them for 3 years on non stop stop/start/thrash/crunch. Everything gets fully tested to the limit, steering,brakes,gears, engine . None of us check oil/water levels.
    .Around 8000 got to auction every 3 years from my company, G4S, now MDS who took over last year.
    It is a good law to make it obligatory to let people know where the cars have been for the 3 years since they left the factory.
    Last edited by House Martin; 06-01-2018 at 11:13 PM.
    • chrisw
    • By chrisw 6th Jan 18, 11:31 PM
    • 1,811 Posts
    • 1,040 Thanks
    chrisw
    • #6
    • 6th Jan 18, 11:31 PM
    • #6
    • 6th Jan 18, 11:31 PM
    On the other hand, anyone buying my ex lease cars and those of most of my colleagues would get a bargain. Driven hard now and again but never outright abused and any repairs carried out immediately with no expense spared.

    Because they have to be returned in tip top condition to avoid severe financial penalties, mine is hand washed regularly and always parked at the empty end of the car park. Dents and scratches I’d probably just live with on my own car are avoided or repaired. Kerbing of the alloys is a big no-no.

    I would guess the the vast majority of family sized vehicles and above were lease vehicles initially.
    Last edited by chrisw; 06-01-2018 at 11:34 PM.
    • Crabman
    • By Crabman 6th Jan 18, 11:57 PM
    • 9,711 Posts
    • 7,146 Thanks
    Crabman
    • #7
    • 6th Jan 18, 11:57 PM
    • #7
    • 6th Jan 18, 11:57 PM
    Where do people think the massive stocks of nearly new low miles cars come from....
    Originally posted by Lorian
    It's obvious to those who are familiar with the sector but ex-hire cars are often explained away by salespeople as managers' cars, ex-demo cars, etc.

    Look at Motorpoint's or Motordepot's site - despite selling a significant number of ex-rentals, do they actually disclose this information? At least Motorpoint will reply honestly when you ask a salesperson who the previous owners were.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Savings & Investments, ISAs & Tax-free Savings, Public Transport & Cycling, Motoring and Parking Fines, Tickets & Parking Boards. I volunteer to help get your forum questions answered and keep the forum running smoothly. Board Guides are not moderators & don't read every post. If you spot a contentious or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this). Views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com

    • Herzlos
    • By Herzlos 7th Jan 18, 8:20 AM
    • 8,621 Posts
    • 7,915 Thanks
    Herzlos
    • #8
    • 7th Jan 18, 8:20 AM
    • #8
    • 7th Jan 18, 8:20 AM
    Do they need to? Any car could have had a hard life. If you're looking at a 6-12 month old car in a car supermarket it's almost certainly an ex rental.

    But with the punitive rates for damage and handling fines/tickets, I drive rental cars far more carefully than my own. It may have witnessed some poor gear changes and revving but you could say the same about any other car you haven't owned from new.

    I dare say that a decade or 2 ago it was a different story.
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 7th Jan 18, 10:03 AM
    • 17,992 Posts
    • 11,017 Thanks
    motorguy
    • #9
    • 7th Jan 18, 10:03 AM
    • #9
    • 7th Jan 18, 10:03 AM
    Hi everyone,

    So it transpires that car dealers should tell customers if the car they're interested in, is a previous lease/rental car.
    In the news:
    bristolpost.co.uk/news/motoring/drivers-second-hand-car-could-1016479
    and they have a dedicated website:
    usedcarscandal.co.uk/

    Both mine and my dads car's are former lease cars, which we didn't know until we got the log book. I'm wanting to make a claim on this, but I don't trust the website; the FAQ's refer to the 'terms and conditions', but does not publish them.

    Does anyone know of a best way to pursue a claim without having to use these?

    Thanks,
    Jack
    Originally posted by jackh123
    Genuinely and seriously - get over yourself.

    Theres no "scandal", and all your doing is trying to jump on the com-pen-say-shun bandwagon.

    For there to be a claim there needs to be a defined loss - whats your or your fathers financial loss?

    Did you ask and did you get it in writing that it WASNT an ex hire car BEFORE you bought the car?

    My Passat is an ex hire car. I bought it from a main VW dealer and because of the sheer amount of them available and competitiveness on price i got a fantastic deal on it.

    I'd a Golf previously bought the same way from the same dealer - fantastic saving compared to new, great little car.

    This is yet another attempt to drum up outrage and a scandal by the tabloids (it was "reported" in The Sun a few days ago) and is being jumped upon by ambulance chasing law firms who have ran out of things to do now that PPI claims are drying up and the "holiday sickness scandal" has been scuppered.
    "We have normality. I repeat, we have normality. Anything you still can't cope with is therefore your own problem."
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 7th Jan 18, 10:06 AM
    • 17,992 Posts
    • 11,017 Thanks
    motorguy
    Where do people think the massive stocks of nearly new low miles cars come from....
    Originally posted by Lorian
    Exactly.

    The newspapers mention the word "scandal" and all the vultures then circle hoping to get a few quid.

    Its genuinely shameful the way this country has got so claim obsessed.
    "We have normality. I repeat, we have normality. Anything you still can't cope with is therefore your own problem."
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 7th Jan 18, 10:10 AM
    • 17,992 Posts
    • 11,017 Thanks
    motorguy
    Not a buffoon, just someone who knows the motoring trade.
    Our 3year old ex lease cars are certainly the most hammered cars in existence. We use them as meter reading cars stopping and starting every 100 yds for 5 days a week or thrashed down the motorway.
    Servicing consists of an oil change and ticking a lot of boxes once a year. Pity the poor punter who buys one of those three year old Skoda Citigo s or Citroen C1 s. They may only have 30k miles on the clock but they are 30k hard miles when they go to auction
    We use them for 3 years on non stop stop/start/thrash/crunch. Everything gets fully tested to the limit, steering,brakes,gears, engine . None of us check oil/water levels.
    .Around 8000 got to auction every 3 years from my company, G4S, now MDS who took over last year.
    It is a good law to make it obligatory to let people know where the cars have been for the 3 years since they left the factory.
    Originally posted by House Martin
    This is NOT the situation being discussed here. This is the discussion of ex hire cars on a forecourt at a year old.

    It shouldnt be law - people should do simple due diligence when they buy a car. Check its history, see who owned it previously. Its as simple as asking to see the V5C.

    NOT doing your own simple due diligence does give people the right to subsequently claim.

    Thats the big problem these days - noone accepts responsibility for their own actions - theres always someone else to blame.
    "We have normality. I repeat, we have normality. Anything you still can't cope with is therefore your own problem."
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 7th Jan 18, 10:12 AM
    • 17,992 Posts
    • 11,017 Thanks
    motorguy
    It's obvious to those who are familiar with the sector but ex-hire cars are often explained away by salespeople as managers' cars, ex-demo cars, etc.

    Look at Motorpoint's or Motordepot's site - despite selling a significant number of ex-rentals, do they actually disclose this information? At least Motorpoint will reply honestly when you ask a salesperson who the previous owners were.
    Originally posted by Crabman
    Exactly - ask the questions, get the answers in writing if it bothers you that much.
    "We have normality. I repeat, we have normality. Anything you still can't cope with is therefore your own problem."
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 7th Jan 18, 10:19 AM
    • 19,716 Posts
    • 18,287 Thanks
    AdrianC
    Let's separate "hire cars" - by which I presume you mean the short-term hire fleet that you'd rent at the airport, say - and "lease cars".

    You want a new car. You get it on a finance package that means you simply hand it back at the end of the finance period... You leased it. That's a lease car. Does it make a big difference how the previous owner paid for it?
    • GunJack
    • By GunJack 7th Jan 18, 11:00 AM
    • 10,468 Posts
    • 7,829 Thanks
    GunJack
    Its genuinely shameful the way this country has got so claim obsessed.
    Originally posted by motorguy
    Yeah, way too American these days.....and NOT in a good way
    ......Gettin' There, Wherever There is......
    • waamo
    • By waamo 7th Jan 18, 11:18 AM
    • 4,908 Posts
    • 6,343 Thanks
    waamo
    Over regulation and a compensation culture will kill the used car market. Very often ex fleet and hire vehicles are very well looked after and maintained. To describe selling a car with full service history and that’s had minor defects corrected as a scandal is utterly misleading.

    A car is often the second biggest purchase you make. Would you buy a house after looking at it for 5 minutes and kicking the door frame? Buying a car should be approached with similar caution. Do a little research first.
    This space for hire.
    • House Martin
    • By House Martin 7th Jan 18, 7:05 PM
    • 1,427 Posts
    • 1,192 Thanks
    House Martin
    This is NOT the situation being discussed here. This is the discussion of ex hire cars on a forecourt at a year old.

    It shouldnt be law - people should do simple due diligence when they buy a car. Check its history, see who owned it previously. Its as simple as asking to see the V5C.

    NOT doing your own simple due diligence does give people the right to subsequently claim.

    Thats the big problem these days - noone accepts responsibility for their own actions - theres always someone else to blame.
    Originally posted by motorguy
    We are discussing ex lease/hire cars and the fact that the trade want to hide who the real former owner was.
    Our cars were all leased by Hitachi Capital. That in itself would not cause any alarm but dig a little deeper and you find that a meter reading comapny G4S utilities LTD used them and alarm bells should ring very very loud. ..
    Of course the trade would want the history of a thrashed to the limit ex lease /hire car to be kept quiet .It hurts their wallets and lowers the price if the true history is uncovered.
    we should nt have to do "due diligence of where these hammered cars have come from, it should be mandatory to provide a full background provenance of just where its spent its first 1 to 3 years of its life..Its NOT simple to dig deep to find out the true background. Big lease companies like Hitachi Capital sub lease to many smaller outlets.That would not appear on the log book.
    It is a fallacy that these cars are "looked after and well maintained ". Thats rubbish.As a meter reader I rarely checked oil or water, maybe once a year just before it went in for an oil change. One year even the garage skipped the much needed oil change. It went in with filthy black oil after 15k miles and came out with the same filthy black and low oil. They know they are fleet cars and bodge the services
    Personally I like ex Motobility cars . These are usually very low mileage and likely to have gentle usage
    Our local dealer of these cars is open and honest of their heritage and tells the truth.Hence he has won awards for being the best car dealer in our area. That is CEJ3000 in Doncaster
    Last edited by House Martin; 07-01-2018 at 7:10 PM.
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 7th Jan 18, 7:14 PM
    • 19,716 Posts
    • 18,287 Thanks
    AdrianC
    We are discussing ex lease/hire cars and the fact that the trade want to hide who the real former owner was.
    Our cars were all leased by Hitachi Capital. That in itself would not cause any alarm but dig a little deeper and you find that a meter reading comapny G4S utilities LTD used them and alarm bells should ring very very loud. ..
    Originally posted by House Martin
    Lease companies are almost always the registered keepers - no matter who leases the car.

    Of course the trade would want the history of a thrashed to the limit ex lease /hire car to be kept quiet .It hurts their wallets and lowers the price if the true history is uncovered.
    we should nt have to do "due diligence of where these hammered cars have come from
    Why do meter readers somehow inevitably and inherently "thrash" and "hammer" the cars?

    As a meter reader
    Ah...

    I rarely checked oil or water, maybe once a year just before it went in for an oil change. One year even the garage skipped the much needed oil change. It went in with filthy black oil after 15k miles and came out with the same filthy black and low oil. They know they are fleet cars and bodge the services
    Would you have treated your own car differently? If so, why do you think it acceptable to neglect and abuse your employer's asset? Maybe not all of your colleagues are quite like you...

    So the V5C says "Mrs Miggins" was the previous keeper. What does that tell you about her driving style and maintenance regime? More or less than "XYZ finance"? Even though it may well have been the same Mrs Miggins who leased it?
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 7th Jan 18, 7:24 PM
    • 17,992 Posts
    • 11,017 Thanks
    motorguy
    We are discussing ex lease/hire cars and the fact that the trade want to hide who the real former owner was.
    Our cars were all leased by Hitachi Capital. That in itself would not cause any alarm but dig a little deeper and you find that a meter reading comapny G4S utilities LTD used them and alarm bells should ring very very loud. ..
    Of course the trade would want the history of a thrashed to the limit ex lease /hire car to be kept quiet .It hurts their wallets and lowers the price if the true history is uncovered.
    we should nt have to do "due diligence of where these hammered cars have come from, it should be mandatory to provide a full background provenance of just where its spent its first 1 to 3 years of its life..Its NOT simple to dig deep to find out the true background. Big lease companies like Hitachi Capital sub lease to many smaller outlets.That would not appear on the log book.
    It is a fallacy that these cars are "looked after and well maintained ". Thats rubbish.As a meter reader I rarely checked oil or water, maybe once a year just before it went in for an oil change. One year even the garage skipped the much needed oil change. It went in with filthy black oil after 15k miles and came out with the same filthy black and low oil. They know they are fleet cars and bodge the services
    Personally I like ex Motobility cars . These are usually very low mileage and likely to have gentle usage
    Our local dealer of these cars is open and honest of their heritage and tells the truth.Hence he has won awards for being the best car dealer in our area. That is CEJ3000 in Doncaster
    Originally posted by House Martin
    Well fortunately the two ex hire cars i've bought in recent years have both been from major hire companies and both were Grade A condition and both were bought from the same VW main dealer.

    I would imagine some ex lease cars - and possibly ex hire cars - are used and abused by their drivers (a sad reflection on them as individuals) however the vast majority live normal existences and can make very decent used buys - just like most ex motability cars have been reasonably well looked after and some have a rough life.

    Where theres a risk a car has been a "working car" as opposed to merely a company car, then yes the risk of abuse by negligent drivers is likely to be higher.
    "We have normality. I repeat, we have normality. Anything you still can't cope with is therefore your own problem."
    • Ectophile
    • By Ectophile 7th Jan 18, 7:53 PM
    • 3,378 Posts
    • 2,164 Thanks
    Ectophile
    Quite a few years ago, I bought myself a used Mazda MX-5. It had 3 previous owners.

    Out of curiosity, I sent a payment to the DVLA, and got back the details of all the previous owners. The first was a hire car company. The next two were the showroom that sold it to me, under two different company names.

    No doubt some people would have been horrified by such an ownership history. In reality, it was a really reliable car that served me well for many years.

    I certainly don't deserve any compensation for it.
    If it sticks, force it.
    If it breaks, well it wasn't working right anyway.
    • House Martin
    • By House Martin 7th Jan 18, 8:04 PM
    • 1,427 Posts
    • 1,192 Thanks
    House Martin
    Lease companies are almost always the registered keepers - no matter who leases the car.



    Why do meter readers somehow inevitably and inherently "thrash" and "hammer" the cars?



    Ah...



    Would you have treated your own car differently? If so, why do you think it acceptable to neglect and abuse your employer's asset? Maybe not all of your colleagues are quite like you...

    So the V5C says "Mrs Miggins" was the previous keeper. What does that tell you about her driving style and maintenance regime? More or less than "XYZ finance"? Even though it may well have been the same Mrs Miggins who leased it?
    Originally posted by AdrianC
    Yes, I do treat my own car differently .Its not a work horse like my fleet car.
    Yes I know some motobilty cars can be abused too, just less chance of getting a real thrashed one.. My Corsa I bought from CEJ3000 had 3k miles on the clock.Now has 42 k without one problem in the 7 years I ve had. I drive it nice and gently !
    Its the nature of the job when you are under pressure from your boss to visit 800 house in a week more than once . We have deadlines to keep up and the company gets fined by the suppliers if they fail, hence its all pretty rapid work from 8 to 4.30 6 days a week. .
    If I cruised around carefully and slowly all day ..I get sacked !
    I considered myself a good employee by the way. The job is rough on cars by its very nature. Its probably one of the worst out there for testing how good a car is. .Motor manufacturers do not need to stress test their cars, just give them to a meter reading company for a while to see what breaks
    We got through Vauxhall Corsa steering racks in 20k miles alone
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