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  • FIRST POST
    • Jboy24
    • By Jboy24 5th Jan 18, 9:40 PM
    • 12Posts
    • 0Thanks
    Jboy24
    Made to start work 15 mins early without pay
    • #1
    • 5th Jan 18, 9:40 PM
    Made to start work 15 mins early without pay 5th Jan 18 at 9:40 PM
    Hi,
    The employees where my girlfriend works and potentially at other centres in the uk is being told to get to work for team meetings starting at 8.45 even though everyone is only paid from 09:00. Most of the staff are paid hourly including my girlfriend and for the people on minimum wage this means the are being paid less than the minimum. I know this is legally unlawful but can someone advise me on any statutes or government publications about this.

    Estimate cost of free labour the company is trying to get if across the whole company
    Estimated 400 staff on hourly *0.25 hours = 100 hours free labour per day
    Stores open 363 days a year *100 hours per day = 36300 free hours per year
    Minimum wage = £7.83 * 36300 =

    £ 284229 free labour per yer

    Thatís a healthy director payout every year.......

    Thanks in advance
Page 1
    • robpw2
    • By robpw2 5th Jan 18, 9:43 PM
    • 12,648 Posts
    • 26,388 Thanks
    robpw2
    • #2
    • 5th Jan 18, 9:43 PM
    • #2
    • 5th Jan 18, 9:43 PM
    Hi,
    The employees where my girlfriend works and potentially at other centres in the uk is being told to get to work for team meetings starting at 8.45 even though everyone is only paid from 09:00. Most of the staff are paid hourly including my girlfriend and for the people on minimum wage this means the are being paid less than the minimum. I know this is legally unlawful but can someone advise me on any statutes or government publications about this.

    Estimate cost of free labour the company is trying to get if across the whole company
    Estimated 400 staff on hourly *0.25 hours = 100 hours free labour per day
    Stores open 363 days a year *100 hours per day = 36300 free hours per year
    Minimum wage = £7.83 * 36300 =

    £ 284229 free labour per yer

    That!!!8217;s a healthy director payout every year.......

    Thanks in advance
    Originally posted by Jboy24
    Theres a certain bank who also does this mind they pay a yearly salary but your expecting to be there 15 mins before shift for team meeting each day

    I would ask if a team briefing is considered work ..

    Because if it is then he should be paying for those 15 mins
    Last edited by robpw2; 05-01-2018 at 9:47 PM.


    Slimming world start 28/01/2012 starting weight 21st 2.5lb current weight 17st 9-total loss 3st 7.5lb
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    • Jboy24
    • By Jboy24 5th Jan 18, 9:46 PM
    • 12 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Jboy24
    • #3
    • 5th Jan 18, 9:46 PM
    • #3
    • 5th Jan 18, 9:46 PM
    The phrase is at your employers disposal.... and if you are in a meeting about work you are at their disposal.
    Just found this at work smart
    OUR EMPLOYER ASKS US TO TURN UP 15 MINUTES BEFORE WORK STARTS, BUT DOESN'T PAY US FOR THIS TIME. SHOULDN'T THIS COME UNDER OUR PAID TIME?
    If you are an hourly-paid worker, you should be paid the agreed contractual rate (which must be at least the National Minimum Wage) for every hour you are required to work. 'Work' includes time spent at the employer's premises and at the employer's disposal, even when you are not physically engaged in any tasks yet because you are getting ready for your working day.

    If it is entirely your choice whether you arrive 15 minutes early or not, and your employer cannot discipline you for not turning up until your contract start time, then this 15 minutes is unlikely to be working time for which you should be paid. However, if your employer requires you to be on the premises 15 minutes early, and could discipline you for not being there 15 minutes early, you should be paid for the extra 15 minutes and not paying you is an unlawful deduction of wages.
    • Jboy24
    • By Jboy24 5th Jan 18, 9:48 PM
    • 12 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Jboy24
    • #4
    • 5th Jan 18, 9:48 PM
    • #4
    • 5th Jan 18, 9:48 PM
    Still not a government statement....
    • ohreally
    • By ohreally 5th Jan 18, 9:49 PM
    • 6,654 Posts
    • 5,185 Thanks
    ohreally
    • #5
    • 5th Jan 18, 9:49 PM
    • #5
    • 5th Jan 18, 9:49 PM
    The employees where my girlfriend works and potentially at other centres in the uk is being told to get to work for team meetings starting at 8.45 even though everyone is only paid from 09:00. Most of the staff are paid hourly including my girlfriend and for the people on minimum wage this means the are being paid less than the minimum. I know this is legally unlawful but can someone advise me on any statutes or government publications about this.
    Originally posted by Jboy24
    Join a union, this would be an issue for them to organise around.
    • getmore4less
    • By getmore4less 5th Jan 18, 10:06 PM
    • 32,192 Posts
    • 19,351 Thanks
    getmore4less
    • #6
    • 5th Jan 18, 10:06 PM
    • #6
    • 5th Jan 18, 10:06 PM
    HMRC are responsible for the enforcement of min wage

    report them

    easy to find the form.
    • Unimaginativeusername
    • By Unimaginativeusername 6th Jan 18, 4:39 PM
    • 28 Posts
    • 21 Thanks
    Unimaginativeusername
    • #7
    • 6th Jan 18, 4:39 PM
    • #7
    • 6th Jan 18, 4:39 PM
    My place expect you to be there 10-15 minutes early to make sure you!!!8217;re logged on the your computer for 8am. I just refuse, it!!!8217;s not in my contract and they!!!8217;re not paying us for that time so get stuffed.
    Debt Collection Agent
    All views are my own.
    • sharpe106
    • By sharpe106 6th Jan 18, 5:00 PM
    • 343 Posts
    • 211 Thanks
    sharpe106
    • #8
    • 6th Jan 18, 5:00 PM
    • #8
    • 6th Jan 18, 5:00 PM
    Just tell them you can't get in for 15 minutes early and the reason you took the job was that you knew you would be unable to start any earlier.
    • theoretica
    • By theoretica 6th Jan 18, 5:25 PM
    • 5,215 Posts
    • 6,481 Thanks
    theoretica
    • #9
    • 6th Jan 18, 5:25 PM
    • #9
    • 6th Jan 18, 5:25 PM
    HMRC are responsible for the enforcement of min wage

    report them

    easy to find the form.
    Originally posted by getmore4less
    Exactly this, just report it as a kindness to all your colleagues. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/pay-and-work-rights-complaints
    But a banker, engaged at enormous expense,
    Had the whole of their cash in his care.
    Lewis Carroll
    • discat11
    • By discat11 6th Jan 18, 5:30 PM
    • 349 Posts
    • 426 Thanks
    discat11
    Poor attitude from the company to expect, or enforce, 15 minutes per day (a team meeting every single day? seriously?) 363 days a year doesn't take into account leave/sickness btw.

    I'm sure most staff realise that a professional company will indeed expect you to be ready for work at the time they start paying you from all the way until leaving not before the paid time, that will inevitably mean getting to work before the paid time & leaving after, although not at this sort of rate I am sure.

    I agree the employer cannot ask for more than this legally, although being proactive, flexible and a team worker has always been a pre requisite to any job I've had in the past 35 years and I don't suppose it'll ever change those staff who are regularly bang on time starting and leaving and never give 30 seconds to the company are usually the ones IME that whinge about being overlooked for promotion later on, that might be unfair, but it's 'normal'.

    a) If you genuinely believe NMW regulations are being breached you need to report it to the HMRC.

    b) Your GF needs to see if a union exists she can seek advice from or organise with other workers who aren't happy with the situation, otherwise she'll have to see her manager and make her feelings known alone.

    Everyone grumbles about work occasionally but if it ever becomes a regular 'us V them' thing you really need to look for another job.
    Last edited by discat11; 06-01-2018 at 5:44 PM.
    • WibblyGirly
    • By WibblyGirly 6th Jan 18, 5:31 PM
    • 383 Posts
    • 682 Thanks
    WibblyGirly
    A place I used to work at did that. I didn't argue it at the time though I did use to go the loo wether I needed it or not for 5 mins peace and quiet to try claim my time back in a sneaky way.
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 6th Jan 18, 7:08 PM
    • 16,756 Posts
    • 9,934 Thanks
    motorguy
    They cant make you attend as they're not paying you. End of.

    I would say its because they cant recharge the time to the client, however thats not your g/fs problem.
    "We have normality. I repeat, we have normality. Anything you still can't cope with is therefore your own problem."
    • Samsung_Note2
    • By Samsung_Note2 6th Jan 18, 8:38 PM
    • 457 Posts
    • 182 Thanks
    Samsung_Note2
    OP does your GF ever get to leave before the official finish time or do they work until exact official finish time.
    Same with lunch breaks are they strictly the exact and only the exact amount of time allowed...or do they vary slightly,same with having to pop out/loo breaks or smoke breaks etc.

    Might be worth making sure she complies with working hours before rasing it as an issue,as mentioned above smoke breaks...when i was a smoker id have 10/15/20 smoke breaks if i wanted,obviously that is company time and all added up.

    Just a thought...
    If my appalling spelling offends you that much...dont read my posts.
    • jobbingmusician
    • By jobbingmusician 6th Jan 18, 9:48 PM
    • 19,163 Posts
    • 19,646 Thanks
    jobbingmusician
    Also, what is the Union doing about this? And if, as I suspect, there isn't one, what are you and your colleagues doing to remedy this?
    I'm the Board Guide on the Matched Betting; Referrers and Jobseeking & Training boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge posts there. Board guides are not moderators and don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this). Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com.

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    • Jboy24
    • By Jboy24 7th Jan 18, 6:12 PM
    • 12 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Jboy24
    Hi when I worked out the 363 thatís the number of staff the stores have in every day so that is the minimum saving the company is making by getting people in 15 mins early.

    Basically at the moment the arrangement has been that they recommend staff should get into work roughly 15 mins before 9am so that they can open the store promptly at 9. This is also stated in the company employment handbook. That is a normal thing to request. Now they are changing the arrangement to you must be here 15mins before so they can have this meeting. So to ensure my gf gets there on time sheís possibly going to be arriving now possibly 30 mins before getting paid. The company is a disgrace and basically bully their staff into thinking if they donít comply they will lose their jobs. If Iím brutally honest most of the low paid staff donít understand their rights and seem to just roll over.

    Ps my girlfriend gets the minimum breaks ( unpaid obviously), she doesnít smoke, often has to stay a a little later to sort things out at the end of the day and doesnít get paid however if she is late by even a couple of minutes they will dock wages. All one sided.

    Terrible employer.
    • BorisThomson
    • By BorisThomson 7th Jan 18, 6:19 PM
    • 1,586 Posts
    • 3,426 Thanks
    BorisThomson
    Hi,
    The employees where my girlfriend works and potentially at other centres in the uk is being told to get to work for team meetings starting at 8.45 even though everyone is only paid from 09:00. Most of the staff are paid hourly including my girlfriend and for the people on minimum wage this means the are being paid less than the minimum. I know this is legally unlawful but can someone advise me on any statutes or government publications about this.

    Estimate cost of free labour the company is trying to get if across the whole company
    Estimated 400 staff on hourly *0.25 hours = 100 hours free labour per day
    Stores open 363 days a year *100 hours per day = 36300 free hours per year
    Minimum wage = £7.83 * 36300 =

    £ 284229 free labour per yer

    That!!!8217;s a healthy director payout every year.......

    Thanks in advance
    Originally posted by Jboy24
    Minimum wage is currently £7.50 per hour, £7.83 does not take effect until April. How much is she being paid?
    • Jboy24
    • By Jboy24 7th Jan 18, 7:20 PM
    • 12 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Jboy24
    My girlfriend is slightly higher than the minimum but a load of staff are on the minimum.
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