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  • FIRST POST
    • Pdmum
    • By Pdmum 5th Jan 18, 4:10 PM
    • 86Posts
    • 34Thanks
    Pdmum
    pcn to registered keeper
    • #1
    • 5th Jan 18, 4:10 PM
    pcn to registered keeper 5th Jan 18 at 4:10 PM
    Received pcn as registered keeper. I am not the driver. Put in appeal using template letter which has been rejected. reason for rejection is different to reason shown on PCN. Does this breach POFA 4. If so what do i do now, I have been issued with a POPLA CODE.
Page 8
    • Pdmum
    • By Pdmum 21st Jul 18, 3:27 PM
    • 86 Posts
    • 34 Thanks
    Pdmum
    Address i have on documents is PO BOX 527, SALFORD, M5 OBY.
    Email address is ccmcce-filing@justice.gov.uk.
    Is it best to stick with the address on the documents i have?
    I know the decision is ultimately mine, but would it be possible to comment on my final draft please, and also give thoughts on inclusion of the point i made about expired contract?
    Thank you for all your help.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 21st Jul 18, 3:42 PM
    • 59,958 Posts
    • 73,116 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Expired contract is something you can expand on at WS stage (don't tip them off yet, so no saying 'it's expired' in your defence!). As long as your defence mentions that you put them to strict proof that they have landowner authority and that you believe they do not, let them dig the holes for you to fill in on top of them, later, in spades!

    Address i have on documents is PO BOX 527, SALFORD, M5 OBY.
    Email address is ccmcce-filing@justice.gov.uk.
    Then that is where it must go, NOT to the usual email addy.

    Re your defence, remove this, too much detail; NO attachments at defence stage:

    (I have attached a copy of the wording from the Popla Annual Report 2015 for your information):

    Understanding keeper liability

    ''There appears to be continuing misunderstanding about Schedule 4. Provided certain conditions are strictly complied with, it provides for recovery of unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle.

    There is no 'reasonable presumption'; in law that the registered keeper of a vehicle is the driver. Operators should never suggest anything of the sort. Further, a failure by the recipient of a notice issued under Schedule 4 to name the driver, does not of itself mean that the recipient has accepted that they were the driver at the material time. Unlike, for example, a Notice of Intended Prosecution where details of the driver of a vehicle must be supplied when requested by the police, pursuant to Section 172 of the Road Traffic Act 1988,a keeper sent a Schedule 4 notice has no legal obligation to name the driver.[...] If {POFA 2012 Schedule 4 is} not complied with then keeper liability does not generally pass.''
    and remove this because they don't have to do a 'risk' assessment before getting data:

    and also proof of the risk impact assessment before they applied to the DVLA for keeper details and issuing the PCN.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Pdmum
    • By Pdmum 21st Jul 18, 4:06 PM
    • 86 Posts
    • 34 Thanks
    Pdmum
    Thanks again, will edit over weekend and send on Monday.
    • Pdmum
    • By Pdmum 7th Aug 18, 6:57 PM
    • 86 Posts
    • 34 Thanks
    Pdmum
    Letter from PC requesting Insurance documents in accordance with Pre Action Protocol, with the threat of obtaining an order from the court compelling me to submit.
    Is it worth responding to this when i send copy of DQ?
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 8th Aug 18, 6:59 AM
    • 2,954 Posts
    • 4,981 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    Is it worth responding to this when i send copy of DQ?
    It doesn't go with the DQ which is a scheduling form for the courts.

    You don't need to send it and they are inviting you to help their case as if it shows only 1 driver, it will help them.

    with the threat of obtaining an order from the court compelling me to submit.
    This is nonsense but they will likely complain if you don't send it. When you reply saying you do not intend to provide it, say that under the Data Protection Act 2018 they should not be requesting personal information that is unnecessary - and they know this. You do not have the permission of others to share their personal information.
    If you want to win - avoid losing first. Here are a few examples
    1. Failing to Acknowledge or Defend https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5760415
    2. Template defences that say nothing https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5818671&page=5#86
    3. Forgetting about the Witness Statement
    • DreamDetective1
    • By DreamDetective1 8th Aug 18, 9:19 AM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    DreamDetective1
    I would not even respond to this... I would tell them when we get to DISCOVERY of documents I will follow the order of the court.
    • Pdmum
    • By Pdmum 8th Aug 18, 6:07 PM
    • 86 Posts
    • 34 Thanks
    Pdmum
    Thanks both, thats pretty much what i thought.
    • Pdmum
    • By Pdmum 10th Aug 18, 2:49 PM
    • 86 Posts
    • 34 Thanks
    Pdmum
    Opted for a very simple refusal to the above.
    Would someone confirm if its absolutely necessary to include phone numbers on DQ, as dont want to encourage any unwanted phone calls. Will be providing an email address.
    Thanks
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 10th Aug 18, 2:53 PM
    • 3,049 Posts
    • 3,743 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    No need for phone numbers. Address and email is sufficient.
    • Pdmum
    • By Pdmum 10th Aug 18, 2:58 PM
    • 86 Posts
    • 34 Thanks
    Pdmum
    Thank you so much for your prompt response.
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