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  • FIRST POST
    • Kas22
    • By Kas22 20th Nov 17, 10:45 PM
    • 60Posts
    • 27Thanks
    Kas22
    Gladstones - Technical defence against PCM
    • #1
    • 20th Nov 17, 10:45 PM
    Gladstones - Technical defence against PCM 20th Nov 17 at 10:45 PM
    Hi All,

    Having looked over the site I can't seem to find any thread where there has been a post on technical dispute, unless I'm being sheer ignorant to searching (I apologise).

    To cut a long story short, I was issued an unjust ticket by PCM (those ex-clampers) stating I was "Parked within a restricted area" even though that wasn't the case as where the car was parked was not part of the controlled parking zone.

    Where the vehicle was parked used to be a shed for bicycle storage, so was not officially part of the car park, or the controlled area.
    The notice did not specify parking was inclusive of the area the vehicle was parked at and specified
    "Vehicles must be parked with a valid parking permit fully displayed within the windscreen and parked wholly within the confines of a marked bay appropriate for the permit on display..."

    I disputed this with PCM but received generic responses. I then took it to IAS who were also as useless as PCM (also found this out by reading threads on here and on pepipoo). I then started receiving letters from TRACE debt recovery which I ignored... and more recently I received a letter from Gladstones.

    Up to the point of disputing with PCM and the letters received from the debt recover firm, I was in touch with BMPA (British Motorists' Protection Association) who were very helpful... However BMPA cannot assist me any further as the claim is based on a technical defence and what my interpretation of the sign was. I therefore turn to yourselves for some help and guidance.

    The question is, should I respond with a template based on the following thread that @coupon-mad wrote /showthread.php?p=73401300#post73401300, or will this require some more thought?

    I am happy to see this through to court as I will not let them get money out of me on such grounds.

    Any help or advice on this matter would be greatly appreciated.
    I will post links to images once I am approved to do so.
Page 5
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 6th Aug 18, 1:17 PM
    • 3,626 Posts
    • 4,483 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    From what I read, why would you want a hearing?

    The judgement was set aside. They can object, but why wouldyo uobject? They have to then ask for there ot be a hearing, and contoinue, IF they accept the set aside order without challenging it.
    You cannot do anything at this stage.

    It looks to me like, based on your 3rd august post, the set asiide of the judgement was granted on the 2nd, but intead of it being a reset because it was the courts issue, thyey have treated it more like a claimant error - and so its up to the claimant to see what they want to do.

    If they dont do antyhing within a few days after the orders 7 days you could see if the claim now shows as "stayed".
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 6th Aug 18, 1:49 PM
    • 19,691 Posts
    • 31,162 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    What case have you got? What do you want to achieve?
    Originally posted by Umkomaas
    It's referring to the same case this thread is about.
    Originally posted by Kas22
    Well I guessed that, but this is the parking company's case against you. I'm not sure you are in any position to have it progress any further given that the set aside has now been given in your favour. It's the PPC who are in the position to pay to have it re-opened (but not many of them do it after it has once been thrown out by the court).

    I haven't gone back through the 80-odd posts, but did you issue a counterclaim at the time of the acknowledgement of service?

    Back to my second question (which you didn't answer) - what do you hope to achieve from having the case heard in court?
    The fact that I have commented on your thread does not mean I have become your personal adviser. A long list of subsequent questions addressed for my personal attention is unlikely to receive a reply.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Kas22
    • By Kas22 6th Aug 18, 1:50 PM
    • 60 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    Kas22
    Ideally I wouldn't want a hearing.

    Best case scenario is if the Claimant doesn't challenge the Order.

    I'll keep an eye on the MCOL status and see if anything changes this week.
    Last edited by Kas22; 06-08-2018 at 1:53 PM.
    • Kas22
    • By Kas22 6th Aug 18, 1:58 PM
    • 60 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    Kas22

    I haven't gone back through the 80-odd posts, but did you issue a counterclaim at the time of the acknowledgement of service?

    Back to my second question (which you didn't answer) - what do you hope to achieve from having the case heard in court?
    Originally posted by Umkomaas

    No, I filled out an AOS and sent a Statement of Defence.


    I was hoping to defend my case, but seeing as it's now been thrown out it's upto them to chase if they wish to pursue it further.
    • Kas22
    • By Kas22 24th Aug 18, 2:10 PM
    • 60 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    Kas22
    UPDATE:


    MCOL online shows that the defence was received, and today I received a letter from Gladstones with PCMs Directions questionnaire filled out.


    Gladstones have responded that the PCM intend to request a special direction that the case be dealt with on the papers without the need for an oral hearing.


    They also write:


    "The request is simply because the matter is incur Client's opinion relatively straightforward and the costs incurred by both partied for attending an oral hearing would be disproportionate. We trust you agree.

    You will not our Client (PCM) has elected not to mediate. Its decision is not meant to be in any way obstructive and is based purely on experience, as mediation has rarely proven beneficial in these types of cases. Notwithstanding this, our Client would be happy to listen to any genuine payment proposals that you wish to put forward"



    I am yet to receive a Directions Questionnaire (form N180), but in the mean time am tempted to respond to Gladstones that I oppose, as per https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5546325
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 24th Aug 18, 2:13 PM
    • 3,626 Posts
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    nosferatu1001
    Nope, you do exactly as told
    You complete your own N180, includin gthe oppose cover letter, and sned to court and copy to claimant.
    Dont go out of order.
    • Loadsofchildren123
    • By Loadsofchildren123 24th Aug 18, 2:25 PM
    • 2,371 Posts
    • 3,954 Thanks
    Loadsofchildren123
    Received a letter titled "General Form of Judgement or Order' where it confirms that the judgement be set aside.

    It also states:

    "Because this Order has been made without a hearing, the parties have the right to apply to have the Order set aside, varied or stayed. A party making such an application must send or deliver the application to the court (together with any appropriate fee) to arrive within seven days of the service of this Order. If the application is one which requires a hearing, and
    a) the party making the application is the Defendant; and
    b) the Defendant is an individual,
    then upon filing of the application the claim will be transferred to the Defendant's home court. In all other cases requiring a hearing the claim will be transferred to the preferred court."

    I didn't understand the above so called CCBC who said the judgement had been completely set aside, meaning there will be no court hearing. I initially thought the Judgement of Claimant (in default) was to be set aside and I'd proceed to a court hearing, but guess not.


    So it now appears that the order has been set aside and I'm left to dispute this with PCM (without a court hearing?).

    Not sure what to do, but guessing I should wait for Gladstone!!!8217;s to raise another court claim and start the process again?

    Or, should I start a defence in the 'Response Forms' section of MCOL, which will incur a fee?
    Originally posted by Kas22
    To clear up this point:
    When an order is made without a hearing (in this case the order to set aside the wrongly given judgment in default) the court HAS TO provide that if anyone disagrees with its order they can apply to vary it or set it aside. So in other words, if you or the Claimant are dissatisfied and think the set aside order shouldn't have been made then you apply to vary/set aside THAT order. Obviously you won't want to do that. If the Claimant does, they'd be very stupid because the default judgment was set aside because of a procedural error.


    in other words, ignore it, it's meaningless


    As you were. The case will now proceed in the normal way - next you'll get a DQ form from the court with an order telling you when you must return it by (and send a copy to Gladstones), and provisionally allocating the claim to the small claims track. Once DQs are filed, the case will be transferred to your local court. Make sure in your DQ you object to the suggestion that the case is dealt with on paper and say that you want an oral hearing.
    Although a practising Solicitor, my posts here are NOT legal advice, but are personal opinion based on limited facts provided anonymously by forum users. I accept no liability for the accuracy of any such posts and users are advised that, if they wish to obtain formal legal advice specific to their case, they must seek instruct and pay a solicitor.
    • Kas22
    • By Kas22 5th Sep 18, 7:19 AM
    • 60 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    Kas22
    I'm a bit concerned as I haven't received a DQ (N180) form yet.



    The DQ received by Gladstones was on the 22nd August. It's been two weeks and I haven't received anything.



    I've logged onto MCOL where is displays that a DQ was filed by claimant on 24/08/2018.


    Is there anything I should do?
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 5th Sep 18, 9:18 AM
    • 3,626 Posts
    • 4,483 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    WEll how about downloading a N180 yourself and sending it in to court and claimant.
    • Kas22
    • By Kas22 5th Sep 18, 6:22 PM
    • 60 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    Kas22
    I guess I'll have to.
    • Kas22
    • By Kas22 21st Sep 18, 1:43 PM
    • 60 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    Kas22
    Received a letter of 'Notice of Transfer of Proceedings' so am now just waiting for notice of allocation.


    Should I be preparing a witness statement? Should it rely on my defence that was submitted?
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 21st Sep 18, 2:03 PM
    • 9,739 Posts
    • 10,095 Thanks
    KeithP
    Should I be preparing a witness statement? Should it rely on my defence that was submitted?
    Originally posted by Kas22
    Yes is the answer to both of those questions.
    .
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