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  • FIRST POST
    • theblackfox
    • By theblackfox 18th Oct 17, 5:18 PM
    • 63Posts
    • 31Thanks
    theblackfox
    Gladstones / Euro Car Parks / CCJ / Wrong Address
    • #1
    • 18th Oct 17, 5:18 PM
    Gladstones / Euro Car Parks / CCJ / Wrong Address 18th Oct 17 at 5:18 PM
    Hey all!

    I've spent the past week living in these forums reading post after post and it has provided me with some fantastic information with my query which I will explain shortly, I just require a little bit of guidance to make sure I am heading in the right direction.

    ===============
    SITUATION

    After a recent trip to the mortgage advisers last weekend I have recently discovered there is an open CCJ claim against me for a parking fine from Europarkingservices/Gladstones Solicitors registered in February of this year. This is the first I have heard about it as I received no letters or paperwork regarding this because they have been sending everything to an old address which I moved out of at the end of 2014 which can be proven by banking statements, credit check and electoral roll.

    I did not bother to pay or contact them about the parking ticket as I feel it was unjustified and have photo evidence to prove this waiting for them to contact me, but as they were contacting the wrong address I had no chance to appeal or defend it. I assumed they were not pursuing it due to not hearing from them.

    I cannot confirm or deny if the registered keeper details were correct as the car has been sold.

    ===================

    N224 / WITNESS STATEMENT / DEFENCE

    I followed the Saggi case and have based my N244 and Witness statement almost identical to that but have the following query's :

    1. I'm not sure when/where I should add the photo evidence I have in regards to the perfectly parked car with a valid ticket or if I should even mention this at all?

    2. In Saggi's case it is not Gladstones or Euro Car Parks, does that make any part of the witness statement invalid?

    3. In notes of the N244 document, it says "Please indicate in a covering letter any dates that you are unavailable within the next six weeks. I have dates I can't do, how/where do I write this and what's a covering letter?

    ============

    Any other help and advice would be much appreciated.

    I can send or post any further information if requested.

    Cheers
    Last edited by theblackfox; 18-10-2017 at 5:27 PM. Reason: Removed real name
Page 6
    • Le_Kirk
    • By Le_Kirk 10th Jul 18, 3:55 PM
    • 3,209 Posts
    • 2,128 Thanks
    Le_Kirk
    In your points 2, 3, 4, 5 & 6 you state you have not received particulars of claim (POC) then go on in 7 to state that the POC do not meet the requirements. How do you know if you never received them?
    • theblackfox
    • By theblackfox 12th Jul 18, 10:43 AM
    • 63 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    theblackfox
    URGENT

    Just about to post off my documents and Gladstones send me an email containing their witness statement (The first i've ever seen of)

    My witness statement and parts of my defence are based on never receiving any documents. So now I feel I have no time to re-write my documents.

    At least I finally know that the charge was for 'Not Parked Correctly Within Markings'

    I've gone into a flurry of panic because their defence points seem to respond quite strongly to mine
    Last edited by theblackfox; 12-07-2018 at 10:47 AM.
    • Katkaland
    • By Katkaland 12th Jul 18, 11:44 AM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Katkaland
    Hello Lovely Helpers,
    Where do I stand legally?
    This is a brand new PCN case starting from scratch.

    I went on a business trip to Nottingham and parked in a signposted carpark at 10:55, called Pemeberton St Car Park. The machine swallowed £2 of my cash saying it had an error. I paid again and this time managed to pay the full price of £5 and I got my daily ticket for the car-park, which I clearly displayed on my car's dashboard. My ticket lasted until 22:55. When I returned around at 16:00, I found a Penalty Charge Notice placed on my windscreen right above the clearly displayed ticket. (About 1.5 hrs later I was already in a different city, having a drink with a friend with a receipt and picture to prove it.)

    The car park was spread over on both sides of the street, with clear signs for the play and display ticket system. I parked the car on one side and paid at the available ticket machine on the other side of the street.

    Upon my return, I saw a workmanís car near where I parked, and I noticed that the workman is opening a fence, behind which there was another ticket machine. This was neither visible to me before nor physically accessible when I entered the car-park. As the workman opened the fence at 16:00-ish, this ticket machine become accessible. On my return, I made a video showing the car-park tariff sign next to where I parked. The workman was also captured on the video.

    The car-park signs clearly stated to me that this is the same car-park with the same tariff on both sides of the street, as the tariff signs were looking the same where I paid and where I parked. To my belief this was the very same car-park due to clear signs. If it was not the same car-park then not only it was deliberately misleading, but one of the machines were physically inaccessible.

    This PCN was from a private parking company called CPS Midlands Ltd (Management & Enforcement). It was not from the council. On the ticket, I can see the handwriting stating the site title of the PCN as "Pemberton St" I wrote a complaint to the company in which I said, "I parked at the Pemberton St car park at such and such date etc..." I explained in the letter, that I believe the PCN was in error and I accept their apologies, otherwise, I am prepared to take the matter further. I attached the photocopy of my purchased parking ticket to this letter and sent it to them with recorded delivery. I displayed my car-registration and my name as Ms Surname, as well as I, gave them my postal address.

    They then sent me a letter back saying: "You failed in your appeal to confirm you were the driver if you wish to CPs midlands to consider a drivers appeal, complete the form overleaf and return within the specified time indicated thereon.Ē They say overleaf that unless I sign their form that I was the driver and send it back within 14 days, they will proceed with the PCN. They are also asking for my full postal address, business address, and e-mail address, but unclear in their wording about this.

    Firstly, I was complaining to them because I clearly paid for the parking. Secondly, they did not give me their e-mail address or phone number and I donít think they have the right to get these details from me. Finally, I am unsure if at all I am obliged to communicate with them further. Or if I made a mistake to even communicate with them in the first place.

    I am a free-lance starting out a brand-new business to try to make ends meet as my partner have not worked for more than a year. We are not on and have never been on benefits because I am confident I will make ends meet. As a result, my time is precious. If this company wants to take me to court I would want to claim for lost income and various costs in having to deal with them and make them think twice before they would try to pressure honest people into unlawful PCN payments.
    Where do I stand legally? Am I even obliged to reply to them?

    Can you please help me? I am looking for a fast and effective way to get them off my back without paying for their proposed unlawful fine and without having to keep writing letters and spending time with this.

    Many thanks
    Katkaland
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 12th Jul 18, 12:01 PM
    • 37,323 Posts
    • 21,513 Thanks
    Quentin
    @ Katkaland


    Delete the post above, (hijacking someone elses thread won't get you any help) then read up on this in the newbies faq thread near the top of the forum


    If you then have unanswered questions start your own thread
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 12th Jul 18, 3:59 PM
    • 61,792 Posts
    • 74,683 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    URGENT

    Just about to post off my documents and Gladstones send me an email containing their witness statement (The first i've ever seen of)

    My witness statement and parts of my defence are based on never receiving any documents. So now I feel I have no time to re-write my documents.

    At least I finally know that the charge was for 'Not Parked Correctly Within Markings'

    I've gone into a flurry of panic because their defence points seem to respond quite strongly to mine
    Originally posted by theblackfox
    it's just a template. You can pull it apart at the hearing.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • theblackfox
    • By theblackfox 12th Jul 18, 4:05 PM
    • 63 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    theblackfox
    Thanks coupon-mad, always there to calm me down haha.

    Papers posted this morning to the court. I now sit and count the days.

    If anyone has some spare time to have a look at their defence and mine and offer any advice that would be lovely!

    Thanks again
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 12th Jul 18, 10:20 PM
    • 61,792 Posts
    • 74,683 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    They are the Claimant so don't have a defence, for obvious reasons!

    Show us their WS and evidence by hosting it as shared images on Dropbox.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • theblackfox
    • By theblackfox 16th Jul 18, 11:36 AM
    • 63 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    theblackfox
    Here is their WS and evidence, looking forward to hearing your thoughts and advice:

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/bkntgr9nudhl5iv/claimantBundle.pdf?dl=0
    Last edited by theblackfox; 17-07-2018 at 10:54 AM.
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 17th Jul 18, 3:37 AM
    • 3,310 Posts
    • 5,582 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    In looking at the pics, it is difficult for any driver to be aware what is a legitimate bay and what is not. So can see the judge waiving this one through for you.

    But there is an interesting phrase in their own contract, the one supposedly signed by the supposed owner (did you check). It is in the first part (definitions) where it says:

    Any vehicle that does not comply with the Enforcement Policy is considered a nuisance (to the extent of 'trespassing'), it is contravening the Terms and Conditions of the car park and is therefore to be issued with an Enforcement Notice.


    If a car (surely a driver) trespasses, only a landowner can take action as no offer of parking has been made. So their own contract is flawed and contradictory - but the pics should see it off.

    Send a list of costs into them too.
    If you want to win - avoid losing first. Here are a few examples
    1. Failing to Acknowledge or Defend https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5760415
    2. Template defences that say nothing https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5818671&page=5#86
    3. Forgetting about the Witness Statement
    • theblackfox
    • By theblackfox 25th Jul 18, 11:27 AM
    • 63 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    theblackfox
    Thanks Emanresu, I've added this to my notes.

    As this is the first time I've seen any Particulars of Claim I'm concerned my defence is not strong enough or detailed enough to argue their points, as I have constructed it based on the little information I had.

    What would be my strongest points to argue against them, I can put these together in my skeleton argument.

    I take it that as my documents have been filed in time for the deadline, that they can't be amended or changed?

    Thanks in advance.
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 25th Jul 18, 1:39 PM
    • 3,459 Posts
    • 4,317 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    Send in a skeleton argument a couple days before, pointing out the very late disclosure of any PoC, which still fail to disclose a cause of action.
    • theblackfox
    • By theblackfox 10th Aug 18, 4:06 PM
    • 63 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    theblackfox
    Just received an email from Gladstones asking to settle the claim before my hearing in September, I believe this is good news

    I've read the bit in the newbie forum about this and it advises to not pay etc, but do I need to reply to them at all?

    Also, it is possible to actually negotiate with them to drop the claim completely?

    Email below for your reference:

    -----------

    The email reads:

    We have received instructions from our Client to attempt a settlement negotiation prior to the hearing on the XX September 2018.

    If you are willing to conclude this matter prior to Court, then we kindly ask for you to contact XXXX@gladstonessolicitors.co.uk for further discussion as soon as possible.

    If a settlement has been agreed by both parties prior to the hearing, and payment of that settlement made in full, the Court would be notified to conclude the matter and no further action would be required.

    We look forward to your response.
    • theblackfox
    • By theblackfox 15th Aug 18, 2:50 PM
    • 63 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    theblackfox
    Had another email and now a missed called from Gladstones chasing me for a response.

    Any advice?
    Last edited by theblackfox; 15-08-2018 at 2:54 PM.
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 15th Aug 18, 2:57 PM
    • 9,312 Posts
    • 9,594 Thanks
    KeithP
    Continue to ignore.

    Do not answer any calls.
    .
    • theblackfox
    • By theblackfox 15th Aug 18, 3:06 PM
    • 63 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    theblackfox
    Thanks Keith,

    I noticed in the Newbie forum it says the following:

    If Gladstones write before the hearing, offering you a chance to 'settle' it usually means they know they will lose and are about to discontinue the case (in which case you are entitled to seek YOUR costs!). Here's a reply to Gladstones, 10 days before a hearing, by LOC123:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=73000370#post73000370

    Should I copy the example in that link, edit it to my circumstances and email them back? or just completely ignore them via email.
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 15th Aug 18, 3:13 PM
    • 3,459 Posts
    • 4,317 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    YOu could email them back giving your costs to date, and offering to settle for a reduced amount
    Say you expect payment in full within X days.
    • theblackfox
    • By theblackfox 15th Aug 18, 3:30 PM
    • 63 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    theblackfox
    Ah right! I thought what they meant by settle is for me to pay them! I'd much rather get something settled with them than go to court again. I'll write something up.
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 15th Aug 18, 3:43 PM
    • 3,459 Posts
    • 4,317 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    Who cares what they meant or want? We dont give two hoots for them

    Remmeber youre giving costs for unreasonable behaviour so #19 per hour.

    Title it "without predjudice save as to costs"
    • theblackfox
    • By theblackfox 15th Aug 18, 3:46 PM
    • 63 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    theblackfox
    Thank you nosferatu1001.

    I'm getting married Saturday so my head is all a flutter, i'll get them a reply tomorrow so I can get it out my head and enjoy my day haha!
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 15th Aug 18, 3:50 PM
    • 3,459 Posts
    • 4,317 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    Oh best of luck!

    Show us your intended response.
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