Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 10th May 17, 1:46 AM
    • 43Posts
    • 27Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    Link Parking residently PCN
    • #1
    • 10th May 17, 1:46 AM
    Link Parking residently PCN 10th May 17 at 1:46 AM
    Back in January I had a friend visiting at my flat. They were parked in my allocated space and the vehicle was registered using their online process. A PCN was on the windscreen the next day.

    I appealed on behalf of the driver/keeper and the appeal was denied due to there being no record of the vehicle being registered for the parking bay. I took the appeal further and it was again denied because I couldn't prove I had registered the vehicle and Link Parking said that confirmation of parking is provided at point of registration. This is not true and I have video evidence to prove this.

    I later received a letter fro Link Parking requesting payment for the PCN. I emailed this and a copy of my lease to the management company for the site and they advised they will contact Link Parking. Since then I have received a letter before claim from Gladstone Brookes.

    I have told Link Parking that I am not the registered keeper or driver of the vehicle but they claim I have admitted that I am - although in my IAS appeal it states I am appealing on behalf of the keeper. I also have a lease that shows the space is assigned to me and photographs of unauthorised vehicles who have previously parked in my space and have not been ticketed.

    The main sign at point of entry just says parking is for residents only and the link parking signs don't explicitly say you need to register the vehicle on the website - it just says authorised vehicles only and this vehicle was authorised as it was parked in my space with my permission.

    I'm concerned about this going to court and just want to know where I stand
Page 4
    • Guys Dad
    • By Guys Dad 15th Jun 17, 8:14 AM
    • 10,460 Posts
    • 9,747 Thanks
    Guys Dad
    No point in telling Gladstones any more, it would overload
    their limited brain power

    Keep everything just in case
    Originally posted by beamerguy
    It's not brain power. They get paid, win or lose so they keep sending their sacrificial lambs out to be slaughtered in court knowing the client will pay regardless.
    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 15th Jun 17, 8:58 AM
    • 43 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    Landowners or Managing Agents.



    You need to state that clearly (again, in writing) so I say, you DO need to contact G's again, NOW. Keep proof of sending your email or letter (free proof of posting from the PO counter, NOT just posting a letter in a post box; NOT Recorded delivery).

    Otherwise they will use the letter they just sent you and will say ''look, she didn't reply, so it's only reasonable that we continued to believe she was driving.''
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    Thank you. I've emailed them this morning and have a digital and printed version of the email.
    I've explained to them again that when I said 'I received' it was in the literally sense, meaning the ticket was handed to me and that given it was relating to my parking space. I had already written to Link Parking to explain that.

    I also drew attention to the IAS case where Link reported that the appellant was the driver and keeper - by that stage I had already reported that as not being me and had named them in full for the appeal.

    I've also requested copies of the emails Link claim to have sent me when I authorised my personal vehicle. This whole argument is over me not being able to prove I registered the vehicle, with my counter argument being they never provide proof in the first place.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 15th Jun 17, 10:44 AM
    • 17,648 Posts
    • 27,902 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    I also drew attention to the IAS case where Link reported that the appellant was the driver and keeper - by that stage I had already reported that as not being me and had named them in full for the appeal.
    I've not read back through the entire thread, but if you are saying (above) that Link fed false information to the IAS and they accepted that over your statement, causing you to lose the case and bringing court proceedings raining down as a result, then you must complain to the DVLA (David Dunford), explain the circumstances and ask that he investigates this apparent perversion of the truth which is causing you great harm, harassment and distress.

    david.dunford@dvla.gsi.gov.uk
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 15th Jun 17, 1:20 PM
    • 43 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    I've not read back through the entire thread, but if you are saying (above) that Link fed false information to the IAS and they accepted that over your statement, causing you to lose the case and bringing court proceedings raining down as a result, then you must complain to the DVLA (David Dunford), explain the circumstances and ask that he investigates this apparent perversion of the truth which is causing you great harm, harassment and distress.

    david.dunford@dvla.gsi.gov.uk
    Originally posted by Umkomaas

    In the initial email I sent to Link on the day of the charge I worded it as 'I received a parking ticket' (foolish I know) but I worded it that way because I had received the ticket from the person whose vehicle it was and it was my parking space in question. I never explicitly stated it was my vehicle or that I was driving. I also emailed Link to advise this.


    In the IAS appeal for the motorist part I named the appellant as below:


    "You reported that the appellant was the driver and the registered keeper at the time the parking charge was issued. You reported that the appellant is being held liable for the parking charge. "


    Link Parking responded with:


    "The operator reported that...
    The appellant was the driver.
    The appellant was the keeper.
    The operator is seeking keeper liability in accordance with PoFA.."


    I named the appellant in full (name, address, postcode, vehicle registration) and it states that I am appealing on behalf of ________
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 15th Jun 17, 2:22 PM
    • 17,648 Posts
    • 27,902 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    Definite complaint to the DVLA.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 15th Jun 17, 3:15 PM
    • 43 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    Definite complaint to the DVLA.
    Originally posted by Umkomaas

    How much detail do I go into with a DVLA complaint. Do they need the whole backstory or just the IAS appeal and resulting court proceedings?
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 15th Jun 17, 3:29 PM
    • 17,648 Posts
    • 27,902 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    How much detail do I go into with a DVLA complaint. Do they need the whole backstory or just the IAS appeal and resulting court proceedings?
    Originally posted by lillianjcharlotte
    Well you do need to give them the background without wittering on about peripheral issues with no relevance. So a preamble to set the context, then, if you can, try to give them potent, one line bullet points to drive home the issue.

    That would be my style, but I'm conscious that people have their own style and preference for layout.

    But I wouldn't let it run to more than a maximum of 2 sides of A4.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 15th Jun 17, 4:40 PM
    • 9,209 Posts
    • 8,980 Thanks
    The Deep
    But I wouldn't let it run to more than a maximum of 2 sides of A4.


    I have had a lot of success in complaining, to Councils, utilities, banks, insurance companies, etc., etc., etc. My complaints rarely ever exceed one side of A4.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 15th Jun 17, 6:36 PM
    • 43 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    But I wouldn't let it run to more than a maximum of 2 sides of A4.


    I have had a lot of success in complaining, to Councils, utilities, banks, insurance companies, etc., etc., etc. My complaints rarely ever exceed one side of A4.
    Originally posted by The Deep

    So short, sweet and to the point?
    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 18th Jul 17, 11:26 AM
    • 43 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    So I've had another email from Gladstones, again reminding me of the charge and telling me I have 7 days to pay or legal action may be taken.

    In my last email I provided a letter from my landlord giving me a right to park, a copy of the IAS appeal stating I named the appellant as being the driver/keeper (the name was on there as well but I partially covered it for their protection) and the floor plan for the car park that shows the space is allocated to the flat I can as renting.
    I advised that I had provided proof of my right to park in the space and asked their client to provide proof that they could override that.

    This was the response I got:
    "
    As parking charges are placed on the windscreen of the vehicles in question our Client's position is that it is reasonable to assume that when an individual states they receive the parking charge notice, they themselves were the driver of the vehicle.

    From the documents provided, we cannot discern the details of the driver and keeper and therefore if you would like our Client to consider a transfer of liability at this stage we require their full name and serviceable address.

    Without seeing the contents of the agreement you speak of we cannot comment, however our Client is instructed to provide a service for which you also receive a benefit (i.e. the management of the parking space)."

    Do I even bother replying? I've already told them that I won't be naming the driver because a) I already did in the IAS stage and b) I'm not pursuing the charge against them. They parked with my parmission in a space I held parking rights to.

    I also asked Link to provide a copy of the emails they allegedly sent me when I registered my personal vehicle but that fell on deaf ears as well.
    It seems as though every time I write them they just waffle on and then threaten me with 7 days again.

    Any advice moving forward? Shall I keep asking for their rights to override mine or shall I just wait until any legal action surfaces?
    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 18th Jul 17, 11:34 AM
    • 43 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    I must admit I did laugh when they said I was benefiting from their service while at the same time trying to take legal action against me.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 18th Jul 17, 9:49 PM
    • 57,564 Posts
    • 71,135 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    I would respond in the style of the letters on hairray's thread.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Geoff1963
    • By Geoff1963 18th Jul 17, 10:19 PM
    • 1,055 Posts
    • 683 Thanks
    Geoff1963
    Can I ask about the web-site registration ?
    Must it be done in advance ? If you bought / borrowed / hired a car, would you be allowed a grace period of parking while you went into your property to log on with details, that you wouldn't know in advance ? What if you arrived home with a date ; would you be required to log onto the website, while they are wondering where you've gone ? Is there any contingency if the website fails ? If you registered but mis-typed a digit, would that make you liable for a charge ?
    If you ordered a taxi, could it wait in your space while the driver comes in to help with your luggage ; would that need registering ? What about workmen ?
    What if the police were visiting to take a statement ? How about an ambulance ?
    Seems all very badly thought out to me.
    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 19th Jul 17, 7:35 AM
    • 43 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    The registration needs to be done from the point you parked there. So when I have a guest over and they park in the space I do it as soon as they come to the flat.

    As far as the grace period I don't think there is one. A guy comes round with a list of vehicles on some paper and if your car isn't on the list you get a ticket. I don't think it matters if you've been there 5 minutes or 5 days.

    Taxis, workmen and police al park there. There's no cameras to record parking, they just check every other day or so or come if a resident complains about someone being parked in their space.

    And the website was failing. Link claim when you register a vehicle you get an authorisation code and an email sent out which acts as your 'proof' for situations like mine. Only thing is no such proof exists. I took a video of the registration process to show that it just reverts back to the homepage and doesn't offer any such proof.
    And as far as making a mistake on the registration.. I'm assuming you'd still get a ticket.

    Real any car can park there if they just know to register because Link don't query if you're a resident, all they care about is that your number plate is on their list. So by that logic they don't help residents at all.
    I've moved out of that building now but my car is still registered to that space as are all the previous tenants. So we could all park there and not get tickets.
    It makes no sense and it's the only Link operated car park I've seen (residential or otherwise) that doesn't use a permit system.
    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 19th Jul 17, 1:21 PM
    • 43 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    In regards to the issue with who's the driver/keeper - I named that person in full in the IAS appeal stage but Gladstones are saying 'From the documents provided, we cannot discern the details of the driver and keeper and therefore if you would like our Client to consider a transfer of liability at this stage we require their full name and serviceable address.'


    Does anyone know how much of the personal information the operator sees in the appeal stage? So, would they only see the information I entered as the person appealing or would they see who I was appealing on behalf of?
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 19th Jul 17, 1:50 PM
    • 57,564 Posts
    • 71,135 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Don't know.

    I would reply:



    Dear Gladstones,

    Given your well-known close connection with the IPC and IAS - a conflict of interests of course, no need to protest otherwise, your version will not be read - you (Mr Hurley and or Mr Davies) and your client would have seen the details at IAS appeal stage.

    So the parking firm has the name and address of the driver and cannot pursue anyone else. Any continued contact with me will be deemed harassment, since there is no debt for which I can be legally liable. I refer you to Ferguson v British Gas [2009] EWCA Civ 46 in this regard and require you and your notoriously rogue clients to cease and desist.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 19th Jul 17, 2:12 PM
    • 43 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    Thank you for that Coupon-mad, I really appreciate all the help you and everyone else has provided me throughout this thread and the forum in general.


    I'm writing up an email to Gladstones, reminding them again that the documents I sent show the appellants name and even though I partially covered it at this stage it clearly shows no resemblance to my own.


    I'm also able to obtain a written statement signed by the driver advising they were the appellant at the time, although there's no personal details other than a name/signature. Is it worth mentioning this or shall I leave it out?


    I've also advised them again that they have not provided any proof at any stage of vehicle registration and so have made it impossible for me to appeal against them successfully as it always works in their favour as a result.
    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 15th Feb 18, 6:50 PM
    • 43 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    Back again..

    I heard nothing from Gladstones since last year. Naively hoped that they had moved on from this but alas, I got another correspondence this year.

    I sent them multiple emails saying I'm not the driver/keeper.
    I even provided them screenshots of the IAS appeal where it states link parking are pursuing keeper liability and the keeper (appellant) was named as someone else. I've offered to send them as much personal info on myself as they need to verify I have no connection with that vehicle.

    They've know written back to say they need me to name the driver in full to them as they cannot find the drivers details complaint with POFA 2012.
    They then threatened me with 30 days to pay or provide the name or they take me to court.

    This is the 5th or 6th court action threat I've received from them.
    I've complained to the DVLA and heard nothing.
    Each email they send gets more threatening and I'm finding the whole process to be a complete nightmare.

    I would have thought that I am not obligated to name a keeper/driver or assist in a parking charge (on my allocated space) that I don't support.. is that right?
    Don't want to end up in court and have it held against me that I didn't provide this information.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 15th Feb 18, 7:02 PM
    • 57,564 Posts
    • 71,135 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    They've know written back to say they need me to name the driver in full to them as they cannot find the drivers details complaint with POFA 2012.
    They then threatened me with 30 days to pay or provide the name or they take me to court.
    Complain to your MP. The industry is rotten and MPs need to step in. If numpties didn't pay, and if the DVLA had not opened the gate a decade or so ago, to allow private firms to get data, the industry would not have grown like it has done, now out of control.

    Did you watch the Parliamentary debate on Friday 2nd February, linked here:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5787731

    Watch it in full & read the transcript also linked there. You need to know the lie of the land.


    I would have thought that I am not obligated to name a keeper/driver or assist in a parking charge (on my allocated space) that I don't support.. is that right?
    Yes, that is right. There is no obligation upon you and no liability.


    Don't want to end up in court and have it held against me that I didn't provide this information.
    It can't be held against you. We help people successfully defend cases, and we'll help you.
    Last edited by Coupon-mad; 15-02-2018 at 7:04 PM.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • lillianjcharlotte
    • By lillianjcharlotte 24th Feb 18, 5:12 PM
    • 43 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    lillianjcharlotte
    So I!!!8217;m going to court.
    Received the documents today - Court is in England and I!!!8217;m based in Wales.

    Their particulars of claim state that I was driving the vehicle and/or am the keeper.

    How is best to proceed? Shall my defence be based off of the situation as a whole or shall I just stand behind the fact that I!!!8217;m not the driver/keeper and have already named that person on the appeal
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

238Posts Today

2,223Users online

Martin's Twitter
  • It's the start of mini MSE's half term. In order to be the best daddy possible, Im stopping work and going off line? https://t.co/kwjvtd75YU

  • RT @shellsince1982: @MartinSLewis thanx to your email I have just saved myself £222 by taking a SIM only deal for £7.50 a month and keeping?

  • Today's Friday twitter poll: An important question, building on yesterday's important discussions: Which is the best bit of the pizza...

  • Follow Martin