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  • FIRST POST
    • Doodakoff
    • By Doodakoff 28th Apr 17, 12:22 PM
    • 49Posts
    • 41Thanks
    Doodakoff
    SCS Law letter received regarding outstanding fines. Please help!
    • #1
    • 28th Apr 17, 12:22 PM
    SCS Law letter received regarding outstanding fines. Please help! 28th Apr 17 at 12:22 PM
    Hello,

    I am posting on behalf of my partner.

    My partner works for a company which is situated on a carpark owned by Britannia Parking.

    Today (28/04/2017), she has recieved a letter from a company called SCS Law R.E Debt owed to Britannia Parking Group LTD.

    It states that my partner owes over 3,000 from unpaid fines, and unless payment is made withing 14 days, we are instructed to issue court proceedings to recover the same and any of our client legal costs, without further recourse to you.

    I am incredibly worried that there may be no way back from this due to the amount of the fines. My partner is stressed beyond belief and I am desperately trying to keep a level head.

    We are currently awaiting a move in date for our first home and the only way of payment at this time is taking it out of my deposit, which would mean we won't buy our home.

    I really, really do not know what to do and I would greatly appreciate any help offered.
    Last edited by Doodakoff; 20-10-2017 at 10:07 AM. Reason: Spelling errors
Page 6
    • Doodakoff
    • By Doodakoff 25th Mar 18, 1:41 PM
    • 49 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Doodakoff
    Thank you The Deep.

    I'm in the process of writing to my MP, if anything good can come from such a high value ticket then I hope it's this scamming industry being gone with the wind come Christmas!
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 25th Mar 18, 6:58 PM
    • 63,872 Posts
    • 76,517 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Thank you for reading and I hope I've grasped and taken on board the advice given so far.
    Yes it's good. expect some sort of reply with a bit more info, wasting your time!
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • Doodakoff
    • By Doodakoff 26th Mar 18, 3:11 PM
    • 49 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Doodakoff
    Thank you Coupon-mad.

    And once again, thank you all.

    I shall send this off and eagerly await their next wonderful reply!
    • Avyi
    • By Avyi 5th May 18, 10:11 AM
    • 1 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Avyi
    I have the same letter and issue
    Thank you so much for this letter idea to send to SCS Law. This has really helped and I will adjust it accordingly, and send it off. It almost mirrors my situation and I was quite worried. Thanks
    • Doodakoff
    • By Doodakoff 6th Jul 18, 2:24 PM
    • 49 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Doodakoff
    Hi all - back again!

    Finally recieved another reply 10 weeks after I responded to them.

    [/url]


    In relation to my requests, they've refused to provide me with a copy of the letter of authority. I'm still wondering if they have one considering it took them over 10 weeks to reply to me and not actually supply me with anything.

    They've also threatened me with a court order to disclose the identity of the driver.

    Apart from question as to why it is taking so long to reply (causing more stress as I'm always in the realm of the unknown), I'm still going to ask for a letter of authority. I assume they are in their rights to withhold this letter?

    These people are awful!
    Last edited by Doodakoff; 18-07-2018 at 8:32 AM.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 6th Jul 18, 2:48 PM
    • 20,237 Posts
    • 31,923 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    They've also threatened me with a court order to disclose the identity of the driver.
    Can we see that please, it's a very serious misrepresentation and will be a major complaint for you to make with the BPA and DVLA. This could get them suspended.
    Please note, we are not a legal, residential or credit advice forum, rather one that helps motorists fight private parking charges, primarily at the 'front-end' of the process.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Doodakoff
    • By Doodakoff 6th Jul 18, 3:09 PM
    • 49 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Doodakoff
    Apologies umkomaas, that's a poorly written sentence from myself.

    What I meant was as per the attached letter, they've threatened to proceed with an application for a norwich pharmacal order in order for me to disclose the identity of the driver.

    I haven't got to that stage yet but anticipate it soon - if they stick to their 28 day threat.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 6th Jul 18, 3:21 PM
    • 63,872 Posts
    • 76,517 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    They've mentioned a Norwich Pharmacal Order, but they mentioned that last year, too. Did you ever use Johnersh's words from post #51? Your reply should include this:

    Where there is no legal requirement to provide the identity of a driver (and Parliament no doubt considered imposing such obligations when POFA 2012 came into being) it seems unlikely that the Court will make a Norwich Pharmacal order, where to do so would be both disproportionate to the sums in dispute and would, on the face of it, subvert the will of parliament.
    Did you email the DVLA to get a breakdown of every time your keeper data was accessed between 2016 to date, and by whom? No need for a V888 form. Just an email.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • Doodakoff
    • By Doodakoff 6th Jul 18, 3:37 PM
    • 49 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Doodakoff
    Hi Coupon-mad

    I did use the wording and shall include the wording you have provided above in my next reply - Thanks

    In relation to emailing the DVLA - I did email them but did not receive a reply. I'll do some digging and see if I have missed it but I think this is unlikely as I requested the information sent to my work email which I monitor closely.

    I shall email them again.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 6th Jul 18, 4:05 PM
    • 20,237 Posts
    • 31,923 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    Even though you enquire via email, DVLA reply via snail mail. You need to provide your name and address, the address on the V5C and the vehicle's registration number.

    Send to this address:

    SubjectAccess.Requests@dvla.gsi.gov.uk
    Last edited by Umkomaas; 06-07-2018 at 9:27 PM.
    Please note, we are not a legal, residential or credit advice forum, rather one that helps motorists fight private parking charges, primarily at the 'front-end' of the process.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Doodakoff
    • By Doodakoff 6th Jul 18, 8:35 PM
    • 49 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Doodakoff
    Thank you Umkomaas.

    I found the email I sent which followed the guidlines above you mentioned and the link kindly provided by Coupon-Mad in post #98.

    I haven't had a reply so I will rewrite the email and ask for the information again.

    Whilst waiting (I believe it can take up to 40 days to get a reply though I'm not sure where I've seen that) I will begin drafting my next reply!
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 6th Jul 18, 9:32 PM
    • 20,237 Posts
    • 31,923 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    I did a check on my own VRM (for dates I'm in the UK) and got a postal reply within 7 days. No scum chasing me (because I take great care to avoid their car parks, or if I have to, read their signs very carefully).

    If everyone had a 'Nil Return' from the DVLA, guess what - the PPCs would be out of business (or landowners would have to be paying through the nose for their 'services' - yeah, right!).
    Please note, we are not a legal, residential or credit advice forum, rather one that helps motorists fight private parking charges, primarily at the 'front-end' of the process.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Doodakoff
    • By Doodakoff 17th Jul 18, 4:42 PM
    • 49 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Doodakoff
    Hi all,

    After a busy period with work I can finally begin drafting my response. I have sent another request to the DVLA and am awaiting their reply through the post. I have recieved a confirmation email from them that they have recieved my request but it says it may take a month to come in the post. Fingers crossed it arrives in time. I will change my reply accordingly should it not come intime for the postal deadline.

    ********

    Dear Sirs,

    Re: Britannia Parking Group Ltd

    I write further to your letter dated **** received **** and note the contents provided. I also note that it took you over ** weeks to respond to my previous letter.

    In relation to your threat to proceed with an application for a Norwich Pharmacal Order, and in reference to your previous letter dated ****, where there is no legal requirement to provide the identity of a driver (and Parliament no doubt considered imposing such obligations when POFA 2012 came into being) it seems unlikely that the Court will make a Norwich Pharmacal order, where to do so would be both disproportionate to the sums in dispute and would, on the face of it, subvert the will of parliament.

    (This may not make sense as I am waiting for the DVLA's response in relation to how many keeper enquirers were conducted. I will change this or remove it if I do not receive an answer in time and include it in my next letter.)
    Since your previous correspondence, I have contacted the DVLA in order to establish how many times keeper enquiries were conducted on my vehicle. The DVLA have informed me that your client requested this information **** times between the dates of *** and ****. You refuse to provide me with an underacted contract of agreement authorising the pursuit of old charges and it is my understanding that you have not only breached the Data Protection Act by doing so but also your obligations of a Private Parking Company.


    ******

    And that's where I am. This is still a massive work in progress and I have abit of time for tweaking and deleting the things that either don't make sense or sections I have gotten completely wrong!

    They have confirmed the signage displayed was present in the locations they provided on the map so I no longer require signs/dates of signage. Other than a request for a contact, I'm pretty much out of ideas as to what else to add on this reply!

    Any comments and criticism is again greatly appreciated and I will continue to try and bulk out this letter.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 17th Jul 18, 4:52 PM
    • 20,237 Posts
    • 31,923 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    You refuse to provide me with an underacted contract of agreement authorising the pursuit of old charges and it is my understanding that you have not only breached the Data Protection Act by doing so but also your obligations of a Private Parking Company.
    Unredacted.

    But ..... I don't think there is any breach of the DPA, nor of any 'obligations' of a PPC (whatever they are?).
    Please note, we are not a legal, residential or credit advice forum, rather one that helps motorists fight private parking charges, primarily at the 'front-end' of the process.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 17th Jul 18, 5:46 PM
    • 10,631 Posts
    • 11,020 Thanks
    KeithP
    They have confirmed the signage displayed was present in the locations they provided on the map so I no longer require signs/dates of signage.
    Originally posted by Doodakoff
    Well they would say that, wouldn't they?
    .
    • Doodakoff
    • By Doodakoff 17th Jul 18, 7:08 PM
    • 49 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Doodakoff
    Unredacted.

    But ..... I don't think there is any breach of the DPA, nor of any 'obligations' of a PPC (whatever they are?).
    Originally posted by Umkomaas
    Thank you Umkomaas. I've re read what I put and removed it.

    And thank you KeithP. I have thought about what you said and re wrote my letter. I hope it makes more sense this time around!

    ******************

    Dear Sirs,

    Re: Britannia Parking Group Ltd

    I write further to your letter dated **** received **** and note the contents provided. I also note that it took you over ** weeks to respond to my previous letter.

    You still have not provided a copy of signs on display, with times and dates these were taken, or a dated plan of their position in the car park as they were displayed.

    Your previous letter states that you previously supplied me with photographs of the signage which was present at the site when the parking charge notices were issued. You further state that your client has confirmed that the signage of the photographs provided to me were the same for each day the vehicle was issued with a parking charge notice. Simply stating that the signage was present during the period the parking charge notice relates to is not good enough.

    It has taken you over a year and a half to provide me with the information I have requested thus far. The correspondence received has been confusing and intentionally misleading. I am aware that you have changed the signage at the location after the period of time the notices were issued to my vehicle. I cannot take your word that the signage was as indicated by your site map, as the time when your correspondence has thus far been dishonest.

    You have provided 23 unclear images that each contain a picture of signage without any clear explanation as to where these signs were located during the period of the notices received. You have provided an unclear map of the site that does not clearly state the boundaries within the site. The site map itself contains 12 small red dots which I assume are signage of the site. Yet the 23 images you have provided of the site either contain one or more images of signage, not stating their location, not stating their correlation to the site map and not time or dated.

    I therefore again request a clear time and dated map showing the boundary within the site, purportedly operated by Britannia Parking Group Ltd., as opposed to the other parking operators also operating at this location. I also request time and dated photographs of the signage which was present at the site when the parking charge notices were issued in correlation to the site map.

    In relation to your threat to proceed with an application for a Norwich Pharmacal Order, and in reference to your previous letter dated ****, where there is no legal requirement to provide the identity of a driver (and Parliament no doubt considered imposing such obligations when POFA 2012 came into being) it seems unlikely that the Court will make a Norwich Pharmacal order, where to do so would be both disproportionate to the sums in dispute and would, on the face of it, subvert the will of parliament.

    *******

    Work in progress!
    • Doodakoff
    • By Doodakoff 24th Jul 18, 11:17 AM
    • 49 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Doodakoff
    Hi all,

    I've been working on a reply in between work since my previous post and beginning to feel like I'm failing quite miserably. I'm struggling with what else to include without using old material written in my past replies. It feels like I'm scraping the bottom of the barrel!

    Can anyone let me know if the above letter is okay if sent as is?

    Also (and this may sound quite defeatist of me) the total of the fines is over 5k. If this were to go to small claims court, does anyone reckon there might be a chance I would have to pay more than that? These people constantly threaten me with this and that and insist a counter claim will be made to cover their costs.

    The reason I ask is this has been looming over our heads now for over a year and a half. It's made my partner ill, put a strain on almost everything etc etc - so I have been putting in heaps of overtime to save this money. I am now considering just paying it off in order to have it all behind us and I can't risk inuring more charges should it proceed to court.

    I know it sounds silly after all the work I've put in thus far - it's just niggling at the back of my mind now I have a way of ending this once and for all and finally being able to think of something else other than when the next letter will come!

    Thank you all once again for your tremendous help.
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 24th Jul 18, 11:21 AM
    • 37,942 Posts
    • 22,052 Thanks
    Quentin
    Were you to lose in court then you can expect the court fees to be added as well as claimant's allowable expenses and interest
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 24th Jul 18, 12:28 PM
    • 20,237 Posts
    • 31,923 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    Can anyone let me know if the above letter is okay if sent as is?
    Can you remind us what you are trying to achieve with it?

    It states that my partner owes over 3,000 from unpaid fines,
    28/04/18

    Also (and this may sound quite defeatist of me) the total of the fines is over 5k.
    24/07/18

    How come it's risen by 2,000 in the space of 3 months?

    Defended well, with (just) 8 tickets @ 100 a pop, this is never going to get to 3k, let alone 5k.
    Please note, we are not a legal, residential or credit advice forum, rather one that helps motorists fight private parking charges, primarily at the 'front-end' of the process.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Doodakoff
    • By Doodakoff 24th Jul 18, 1:26 PM
    • 49 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    Doodakoff
    Thank you Quentin for clarifying potential costs.

    Hi Umkomaas,

    The information I am still yet to receive from these people is a dated plan of the car park including dated photos of the signage for the period the PCN's relate to. The reason I am asking for this information is because there are 2 other car parks at this location and the one I am receiving PCN's for. The boundaries of each car park are not that clear.

    One car park is separated via a raised kerb but had similar parking restrictions. The other one can actually be accessed via dropped kerb from the car park I am receiving PCN's for.

    The signage at the site has since changed after the period for my PCN's relate to and I want clarification where the signs were.

    In relation to how it' risen in price, I was previously receiving 2 separate letters from them with different PCN's. These included duplicated PCN's. In post #89, after requesting some clarity from them, I finally received a totality of PCN's that amount to more than 30 tickets and and to over 5,000.

    The original charge of each ticket was 100, discounted to 60 if paid within 28 days. As they were not paid, they increased to 160. That's an extra 100 per ticket. They haven't actually explained the reason for the extra 100 either.
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