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  • FIRST POST
    • Meradowlark
    • By Meradowlark 14th Dec 16, 10:30 PM
    • 4Posts
    • 1Thanks
    Meradowlark
    Sky have "tagged" my landline number and won't let TT use it
    • #1
    • 14th Dec 16, 10:30 PM
    Sky have "tagged" my landline number and won't let TT use it 14th Dec 16 at 10:30 PM
    I just tried switching my phone/broadband from Sky to TT, but Sky have seized the number and won't release it. TT tell me that I must get a new number, even though I've had this one for nearly 40 years! Both companies blaming each other, Sky denying that it has been blocked, TT telling me it has.
    Surely they cannot do this? My contract with Sky is yet to end and I'm still using the number, but Sky won't let me take it when/if I do jump ship.
Page 1
    • Colin_Maybe
    • By Colin_Maybe 15th Dec 16, 9:24 AM
    • 2,239 Posts
    • 1,040 Thanks
    Colin_Maybe
    • #2
    • 15th Dec 16, 9:24 AM
    • #2
    • 15th Dec 16, 9:24 AM
    If you cancel it down with Sky rather than letting Talktalk transfer it for you that's what happens. This applies to all suppliers btw as I believe it's how the system works. If you're more than 31 days from cancellation you could stop the cancellation going through and then get TT to handle it for you perhaps.
    • LazyTyper
    • By LazyTyper 17th Dec 16, 11:56 AM
    • 368 Posts
    • 145 Thanks
    LazyTyper
    • #3
    • 17th Dec 16, 11:56 AM
    • #3
    • 17th Dec 16, 11:56 AM
    I don't know what is meant by "Sky have seized the number" but if they are currently providing service to you with the number in question then they will allow it to port.

    From what you have described it appears TalkTalk are speaking rubbish. They just need to issue the port request, as per their business as usual process.

    Have you spoken with a manager at TalkTalk, or at least someone with a clue?
    • teddysmum
    • By teddysmum 17th Dec 16, 8:54 PM
    • 9,044 Posts
    • 5,393 Thanks
    teddysmum
    • #4
    • 17th Dec 16, 8:54 PM
    • #4
    • 17th Dec 16, 8:54 PM
    From posts 2 and 3, it's occurred to me that they have ceased (not seized) the number and this happens if you cancel with your current provider instead of requesting the new one to take over.There is usually a charge for cease, too.
    • Meradowlark
    • By Meradowlark 9th Aug 17, 12:07 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Meradowlark
    • #5
    • 9th Aug 17, 12:07 PM
    • #5
    • 9th Aug 17, 12:07 PM
    Taken me a long time to get back to this. Sky would not let another provider use my phone number. That's what I meant by "seized." I was going to switch to TT, but they told me I had to get a new number so I ditched that idea.
    I spoke to both TT and Sky at length and they both blamed each other an neither was willing to budge or to help.
    Eventually I went to Origin and they had no trouble using my existing number.
    I know the difference between "ceased" and "seized!" This was my phrasing, not what I heard.
    • iniltous
    • By iniltous 9th Aug 17, 12:17 PM
    • 1,600 Posts
    • 612 Thanks
    iniltous
    • #6
    • 9th Aug 17, 12:17 PM
    • #6
    • 9th Aug 17, 12:17 PM
    Taken me a long time to get back to this. Sky would not let another provider use my phone number. That's what I meant by "seized." I was going to switch to TT, but they told me I had to get a new number so I ditched that idea.
    I spoke to both TT and Sky at length and they both blamed each other an neither was willing to budge or to help.
    Eventually I went to Origin and they had no trouble using my existing number.
    I know the difference between "ceased" and "seized!" This was my phrasing, not what I heard.
    Originally posted by Meradowlark
    Taken a long time to get back to this , at 8 months a bit of an understatement
    The fact that you got what you wanted and ported to Origin, pretty much shows the problem was with TT and not Sky, after all the process used between Origin and Sky would have been exactly the same process TT could have used, the rules don't allow Sky to cherry pick providers they will play ball with and those they won't, and given that you say you had the number for decades the number must be a 'BT' number range number anyway ,sounds like for whatever reason TT were using the wrong process to port, or were trying to get you to accept a TT number for their own reasons
    Last edited by iniltous; 09-08-2017 at 12:26 PM.
    • AntonyStark
    • By AntonyStark 7th Dec 17, 11:53 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    AntonyStark
    • #7
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:53 PM
    • #7
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:53 PM
    I decided to switch telecoms provider for my landline. Like Meradowlark, I too am suffering in suspense, my situation is not about Sky but it is about tagging. Our house has had our landline number over 30 years, we moved from BT to TalkTalk and kept the number. I rang PO Telecoms re switching to them and they offered a cheaper deal but their confirmation letter has quoted a different landline number. I rang immediately to say this is a deal-breaker - that if I can't keep my existing number I don't want to change provider. Incredibly PO cannot tell me for sure, they say it is to do with differing technologies and ownership of numbers, and they don't seem able to tell me in advance. I rang PO again today, spoke to another person but got the same message. PO says I won't know until the day the switch happens, but fingers crossed! When I rang TalkTalk they said they do not prevent their customers from taking their existing numbers with them. Neither company used the words ‘tagging’ or ‘porting’ but that is what I want to do. PO seems to be saying it will try to port but can’t guarantee that it will succeed. Why not? It is difficult for me to gauge whether this is a widespread problem or not. I bet there IS a way for the 2 companies to confirm with each other IN ADVANCE whether or not a number can be ported. They just are not trying hard enough. I rang Ofcom who said it is up to each provider whether to offer a porting service or not. PO are saying yes they do but it might not work. Martin should highlight this potential problem in his money saving tips.
    • iniltous
    • By iniltous 8th Dec 17, 6:28 PM
    • 1,600 Posts
    • 612 Thanks
    iniltous
    • #8
    • 8th Dec 17, 6:28 PM
    • #8
    • 8th Dec 17, 6:28 PM
    I decided to switch telecoms provider for my landline. Like Meradowlark, I too am suffering in suspense, my situation is not about Sky but it is about tagging. Our house has had our landline number over 30 years, we moved from BT to TalkTalk and kept the number. I rang PO Telecoms re switching to them and they offered a cheaper deal but their confirmation letter has quoted a different landline number. I rang immediately to say this is a deal-breaker - that if I can't keep my existing number I don't want to change provider. Incredibly PO cannot tell me for sure, they say it is to do with differing technologies and ownership of numbers, and they don't seem able to tell me in advance. I rang PO again today, spoke to another person but got the same message. PO says I won't know until the day the switch happens, but fingers crossed! When I rang TalkTalk they said they do not prevent their customers from taking their existing numbers with them. Neither company used the words !!!8216;tagging!!!8217; or !!!8216;porting!!!8217; but that is what I want to do. PO seems to be saying it will try to port but can!!!8217;t guarantee that it will succeed. Why not? It is difficult for me to gauge whether this is a widespread problem or not. I bet there IS a way for the 2 companies to confirm with each other IN ADVANCE whether or not a number can be ported. They just are not trying hard enough. I rang Ofcom who said it is up to each provider whether to offer a porting service or not. PO are saying yes they do but it might not work. Martin should highlight this potential problem in his money saving tips.
    Originally posted by AntonyStark
    If you have had the number for 30 odd years then the number is originally from BT's number range , so you want to port a number from TT to the Post Office that is already ported from BT to TT, the PO are not saying they cannot get you the number you want , they just don't guarantee it ( in case things go wrong) ultimately it's your choice, take a chance with the PO , pick a provider other than PO or stay with TT,
    BT could probably guarantee to get the number , then port to the PO, but you would have to see out a minimum term with BT before switching to the PO , or pay BT an ETC, but that may not make financial sense

    Ironically , AFAIK , the Post Office use TT network to provide service
    Last edited by iniltous; 08-12-2017 at 6:31 PM.
    • AntonyStark
    • By AntonyStark 22nd Dec 17, 6:04 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    AntonyStark
    • #9
    • 22nd Dec 17, 6:04 PM
    • #9
    • 22nd Dec 17, 6:04 PM
    Thanks for this, iniltous. I delayed posting to see how my switch worked out in practice. Not well. When the switch from TalkTalk to PO Telecoms took place, it was with the new (wrong) number. I rang PO Telecoms to complain, they said wait 10 days (because the old number is held till then by TalkTalk), then we will try and get the old number back, but we can!!!8217;t guarantee. So I rang TT and asked if they still controlled the old number and if so could they guarantee to give it back to me. They said yes, come back to us as a new customer and we do guarantee. So TT told PO Telecoms I wanted to switch back to TT. However when the 2nd switch happened I was given the old (wrong) number which was ported from PO Telecoms. When I rang TT the story had changed, they no longer guaranteed, they said my original number was now controlled by PO Telecoms, whom I should ring. So I rang PO Telecoms and they said I was no longer their customer but they would do their best to get the old number back for me if I signed back up with them (the 3rd switch), but I would have to wait another 10 days. Due to holidays, that means 11 January apparently. I asked where my old number had gone, whether it could between now and 11 Jan be assigned to some other customer. They said it had gone to an Openreach place, but that recently released numbers are not normally reassigned to customers.

    So there IS a systemic problem in the way telecoms providers transfer customers. Also, until I used the word !!!8216;porting!!!8217;, no customer service agent used the word; and they seem remarkably unaware of how distressing it can be to long-standing customers who have published their landline number to many neighbours, friends and businesses suddenly to have their existing number taken away for what, in the customer!!!8217;s eyes, looks like no good reason.
    • iniltous
    • By iniltous 22nd Dec 17, 10:02 PM
    • 1,600 Posts
    • 612 Thanks
    iniltous
    If you have had the number for 30 odd years then the number is originally from BT's number range , so you want to port a number from TT to the Post Office that is already ported from BT to TT, the PO are not saying they cannot get you the number you want , they just don't guarantee it ( in case things go wrong) ultimately it's your choice, take a chance with the PO , pick a provider other than PO or stay with TT,
    BT could probably guarantee to get the number , then port to the PO, but you would have to see out a minimum term with BT before switching to the PO , or pay BT an ETC, but that may not make financial sense

    Ironically , AFAIK , the Post Office use TT network to provide service
    Originally posted by iniltous
    Thanks for this, iniltous. I delayed posting to see how my switch worked out in practice. Not well. When the switch from TalkTalk to PO Telecoms took place, it was with the new (wrong) number. I rang PO Telecoms to complain, they said wait 10 days (because the old number is held till then by TalkTalk), then we will try and get the old number back, but we can’t guarantee. So I rang TT and asked if they still controlled the old number and if so could they guarantee to give it back to me. They said yes, come back to us as a new customer and we do guarantee. So TT told PO Telecoms I wanted to switch back to TT. However when the 2nd switch happened I was given the old (wrong) number which was ported from PO Telecoms. When I rang TT the story had changed, they no longer guaranteed, they said my original number was now controlled by PO Telecoms, whom I should ring. So I rang PO Telecoms and they said I was no longer their customer but they would do their best to get the old number back for me if I signed back up with them (the 3rd switch), but I would have to wait another 10 days. Due to holidays, that means 11 January apparently. I asked where my old number had gone, whether it could between now and 11 Jan be assigned to some other customer. They said it had gone to an Openreach place, but that recently released numbers are not normally reassigned to customers.

    So there IS a systemic problem in the way telecoms providers transfer customers. Also, until I used the word ‘porting’, no customer service agent used the word; and they seem remarkably unaware of how distressing it can be to long-standing customers who have published their landline number to many neighbours, friends and businesses suddenly to have their existing number taken away for what, in the customer’s eyes, looks like no good reason.
    Originally posted by AntonyStark
    TBH, I'm not sure it's a systemic problem, IMHO it's probably more a case of poorly trained advisors who have little knowledge of systems or process, and these advisors may well be incentivised to sign up potential customers at all cost, so over promise and quite often under deliver, what's more ( and it no criticism really ) customers that start the process of migration with a company, then cancel that order 'mid flight' and sign up with another company all add to the chance of something going wrong.
    If a company wants to import numbers from another company number range, they must also export numbers from their own number range to other company's on request, and numbers that are ported to another company and then effectively ' ceased' rather than migrated, are effectively returned to the original number range holder

    In your case it certainly was possible for your (originally BT) number that was successfully ported by BT to TT, to be 'ported' again to PO, provided both TT and PO deal with the order correctly, obviously something went wrong, and chances are you will never know for sure if it were TT or PO that messed up, but the chances are the number is now back with the original number range holder (BT)

    I'm guessing that given your choice of provider that you choosing to use BT for your service is not likely , but the chances are that because the number was originally a BT number , and is probably currently in 'quarantine' with them, before it becomes available again to be re-allocated to a BT customer, that becoming a BT customer is probably your best chance of you getting the number back
    • AntonyStark
    • By AntonyStark 23rd Dec 17, 8:09 AM
    • 4 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    AntonyStark
    Thanks for another very useful post, iniltous. Wise advice, I may well end up following it.
    • phillw
    • By phillw 28th Dec 17, 11:32 PM
    • 1,269 Posts
    • 822 Thanks
    phillw
    So there IS a systemic problem in the way telecoms providers transfer customers.
    Originally posted by AntonyStark
    No, there is a systemic problem with companies saying anything to stop you leaving. You let them make you indecisive and that is what caused your switching problems.

    One time my old mobile provider told me my new provider had quoted me vat exclusive prices when I told them the deal I was switching to, purely because they couldn't beat it. I've never had them tell me they wouldn't be able to port my number, because I'd have told them they don't need to offer a guarantee but if they don't transfer it then I'd be complaining to the ombudsman.
    Last edited by phillw; 28-12-2017 at 11:34 PM.
    • AntonyStark
    • By AntonyStark 26th Jan 18, 3:01 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    AntonyStark
    After further phone calls from me, I have been given back my old number by my new provider PO Telecoms.
    There was no undue pressure from either the old provider (TalkTalk) or the new provider (PO Telecoms) for me to proceed with the switch. The customer service staff of course did not know the technicalities of how the networks operate, who controls which landline numbers, etc. But when asked these questions, they would put me on hold but then not come back with the relevant answers., The providers need to find a way for this to happen. There are 3 systemic problems. 1: the customer service staff answering switching requests do not ask the customer if he/she wants to retain the existing number. It is an important question. 2: the customer service staff are unable to find out in advance of a switch of provider whether or not the number will be retained. When pressed, they say there is the possibility that it will be lost. When told this is a precondition for the customer, they say then in that case don't take the risk of switching. There must be people within the providers' organisations who can look at the number, and the exchange, and the providers!!!8217; respective systems, and know whether or not the number can be ported. 3: when something goes wrong and the number is released accidentally, they are not able to block it from re-release until such time as they can re-acquire it. The best that the new provider could say to me in December was "When the day comes in January that your switch has happened, we will try and get your number back for you. It probably won't get reissued by then but we have no control over it until then". And the old provider said: !!!8220;The number has been disconnected and we can!!!8217;t begin to see if we can reissue it to you until you become our customer again!!!8221;. That is why I say: an unsatisfactory system at both providers.
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