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  • FIRST POST
    • jamski07
    • By jamski07 17th Jul 16, 11:50 PM
    • 88Posts
    • 14Thanks
    jamski07
    Claiming against Norwegian Airlines
    • #1
    • 17th Jul 16, 11:50 PM
    Claiming against Norwegian Airlines 17th Jul 16 at 11:50 PM
    Thought I would document the progress of my claim as I can't see anything specific to Norwegian on here.

    So we were 7.5 hours delayed due to a member of ground staff being ill. To date, long story short, they've tried to fob us off claiming exceptional circumstances and citing a case about a damaged engine, totally irrelevant!

    I refused their offer of reimbursing our expenses of £60, found a case that went against the airline that has the exact same circumstance as ours, and have issued a Notice before action today.

    Planning on taking this all the way myself as the NWNF solicitors would be taking pretty much half of the compensation.

    Any advise welcome, especially regarding the small claims court, as it's going to have to be European Small Claims Procedure I think, can't see a UK address anywhere for them.

    As recommended in Vaubans guide, I have given them 14 days to respond, so have a couple of weeks to do my research for the next phase. Thanks to those who have helped on here to date.
Page 7
    • Justice13075
    • By Justice13075 6th Jul 18, 2:07 PM
    • 1,427 Posts
    • 514 Thanks
    Justice13075
    Might as well, in relation to the hotel and food Norwegian should have put you up in a hotel and paid for the food so you can claim that back.
    • Keithl
    • By Keithl 6th Sep 18, 10:09 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Keithl
    Recent flight delay
    We were warned by text from Norwegiian that due to aircraft rotation our flight from Oakland to Barcelona would be 2 hours delayed. By the time the inncoming flight actually arrived, we made it to the gate at Barcelona 3 hours 15 minutes late. Arriving at the gate is the standard the EU regulation uses for arrival time.
    We made our delay claims the next day and they have been acknowledged as received. As my son and his family were compensated through this regulation on a BA flight - with no argument, I assumed there would be no problem. So you can imagine my disappointment reading the tales of woe on this forum.
    I did try the Bottonline site's claim check and they said it was outside their jurisdiction. So if Norwegian start playing silly I will only have the CAA route to pursue my claim .. correct?
    • Keithl
    • By Keithl 7th Sep 18, 12:08 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Keithl
    Recent flight delay
    We were warned by text from Norwegiian that due to aircraft rotation our flight from Oakland to Barcelona would be 2 hours delayed. By the time the inncoming flight actually arrived, we made it to the gate at Barcelona 3 hours 15 minutes late. Arriving at the gate is the standard the EU regulation uses for arrival time.
    We made our delay claims the next day and they have been acknowledged as received. As my son and his family were compensated through this regulation on a BA flight - with no argument, I assumed there would be no problem. So you can imagine my disappointment reading the tales of woe on this forum.
    I did try the Bottonline site's claim check and they said it was outside their jurisdiction. So if Norwegian start playing silly I will only have the CAA route to pursue my claim .. correct?
    • Justice13075
    • By Justice13075 7th Sep 18, 12:15 AM
    • 1,427 Posts
    • 514 Thanks
    Justice13075
    No, CAA is useless Google and download Vaubans guide and go from there.
    • LESHERE
    • By LESHERE 8th Sep 18, 8:28 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    LESHERE
    Check Vaubans but I think it needs to be more than 4 hours delay on long haul
    • Justice13075
    • By Justice13075 8th Sep 18, 8:32 AM
    • 1,427 Posts
    • 514 Thanks
    Justice13075
    No it is still 3 hours but if the arrival delay is between 3&4 hours compensation is halved to 300 euro for flights over 3500 km. Between 1500km and 3500km it is 400 euro
    • LESHERE
    • By LESHERE 8th Sep 18, 9:44 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    LESHERE
    Hi
    See links above to Vauban site. You have 6 years which to claim. However strike action might well be outside the airlines control so not eligible for delay payment
    • Aurora65
    • By Aurora65 11th Sep 18, 3:31 PM
    • 8 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Aurora65
    A little confused as I was delayed 5 hours on flight to Menorca from Gatwick. Norwegian online chat advised Technical issue. Pilot advised it was replacement plane / crew and staff. Norwegian on Facebook advised it was caused by a knock on effect, but wouldn't elaborate. Bott & Co, seem to think I have a claim, but EUClaim say it's exceptional circumstances. I have submitted a claim, but think I will use resolver to provide more information and give them 2 weeks, and advise I will take to CAA and Solictors if nothing heard. Suggestions welcome?
    • JPears
    • By JPears 11th Sep 18, 4:01 PM
    • 4,193 Posts
    • 1,140 Thanks
    JPears
    resolver won't give you any more information than using the standard letter templates in Vauban's most excellent guide to claiming.
    CAA won't entertain you.
    If you're new. read The FAQ and Vauban's Guide

    The alleged Ringleader.........
    • Froggitt
    • By Froggitt 11th Sep 18, 7:38 PM
    • 5,810 Posts
    • 3,068 Thanks
    Froggitt
    A little confused as I was delayed 5 hours on flight to Menorca from Gatwick. Norwegian online chat advised Technical issue. Pilot advised it was replacement plane / crew and staff. Norwegian on Facebook advised it was caused by a knock on effect, but wouldn't elaborate. Bott & Co, seem to think I have a claim, but EUClaim say it's exceptional circumstances. I have submitted a claim, but think I will use resolver to provide more information and give them 2 weeks, and advise I will take to CAA and Solictors if nothing heard. Suggestions welcome?
    Originally posted by Aurora65
    If something broke on the plane, its not exceptional.

    If Boeing recalled all planes of that type due to something that had broken or might break, that's exceptional.
    illegitimi non carborundum
    • JPears
    • By JPears 11th Sep 18, 8:55 PM
    • 4,193 Posts
    • 1,140 Thanks
    JPears
    Also extraordinary.
    If you're new. read The FAQ and Vauban's Guide

    The alleged Ringleader.........
    • KC Cantiaci
    • By KC Cantiaci 11th Sep 18, 10:13 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    KC Cantiaci
    Norwegian Cancelled Route??
    Hi all

    Not sure if this is the correct place to post this...

    Norwegian have cancelled a route that we were booked on and they state that we can either have a refund or they will book us on a replacement flight with another airline. The problem is that we booked their Premium cabin as the flight is a long 12 hours from Lon to Singapore. Their Premium cabin gives 43”-46” of seat pitch and up to 55” of legroom, ‘premium’ food on the flight, 2 checked bags and access to a pre flight lounge. It’s like a lazy boy seat and we had similar on BA’s old business class before they changed to the fully flat bed... and I preferred it.

    They’re offering a ‘replacement’ flight with another carrier in a Premium Economy cabin which has 38” seat pitch, single checked bag and no lounge access. The biggest issue for us is the seat and I’ve been on Premium Economy before and it’s not much better than economy and certainly not worth the price which is double economy. When I questioned the differences in seat and service, the lady I spoke to went off and researched it and agreed that the difference is significant BUT she’s not permitted to book us on a business class flight. I asked if we could if we paid extra but they couldn’t do that either. So our choice seems to be take the refund or accept premium economy. We have friends travelling who now won’t go as the seat is an issue for them and they won’t/can’t pay major airline business class fare prices. So they’re going to cancel their trip and lose money as they’ve paid a non refundable deposit for the cruise we’re supposed to be going on.

    Anyone know where we stand legally? My argument is we’re not being offered like for like or better. We’re being offered a worse seat/service than before with no recompense or financial adjustment and there seems to be limited flight availability for the time/dates we’re travelling so if we delay, we might be further inconvenienced. Any ideas as to where we stand?
    • Tyzap
    • By Tyzap 11th Sep 18, 11:47 PM
    • 1,641 Posts
    • 715 Thanks
    Tyzap
    Hi all

    Anyone know where we stand legally? My argument is we’re not being offered like for like or better. We’re being offered a worse seat/service than before with no recompense or financial adjustment and there seems to be limited flight availability for the time/dates we’re travelling so if we delay, we might be further inconvenienced. Any ideas as to where we stand?
    Originally posted by KC Cantiaci
    Hi,

    The regs say it should be the same class but doesn't break it down as far as comparing how different airlines products compare. There is provision made for upgrading and downgrading, but nothing specific where the same class differs between airlines.

    For this reason I think you will struggle to find any part of the regulation to support your situation and may have to resort to a civil case if you feel strongly enough.

    I would suggest the best way forwards may be to research which other airline has as close a Premium product to the one you had booked with Norwegian and who also operates on the same route to Singapore. Then negotiate with Premier and ask them to put you on the airline that you would be happy with.

    If you could persuade them to put you into a higher class than you booked they cannot then charge you more. Unfortunately I've never heard of this happening.

    I'm not sure if Singapore Airlines offer a premium class cabin but they do operate the new A350 into LHR which is very highly thought of, plus their service and food are amongst the best available. It may be worth checking it out.

    Good luck.
    Last edited by Tyzap; 12-09-2018 at 9:44 AM. Reason: Spelling
    Please read Vaubans superb guide. To find it Google and then download 'vaubans guide'.
    • jpsartre
    • By jpsartre 12th Sep 18, 8:18 AM
    • 3,497 Posts
    • 2,230 Thanks
    jpsartre
    Anyone know where we stand legally?
    Originally posted by KC Cantiaci

    If they're offering to reroute in the same cabin class on another carrier they've met their obligations.
    • KC Cantiaci
    • By KC Cantiaci 12th Sep 18, 6:02 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    KC Cantiaci
    If they're offering to reroute in the same cabin class on another carrier they've met their obligations.
    Originally posted by jpsartre
    But it’s not the same. Norwegian call it Premium, not Premium Economy. Some critics and commentators liken it to Business Class. To be honest, it’s somewhere in between but I don’t think it’s fair or reasonable to accept a much worse seat with much less room where sleeping is unlikely. It also means less baggage, no lounge and we’re going to have to travel further to Heathrow instead of Gatwick where it’s going to cost us in time and money as even parking at Heathrow is more expensive. It’s not what I paid for. Our friends are cancelling because of it so it’s had a huge effect on our holiday now.

    I spoke to my partners boss today and they were booked on an Upper Class flight with Virgin to Vegas whereby the flight was overbooked. Virgin asked if they would be prepared to travel a day earlier where they would pay for the extra night’s hotel stay and gave them a pair of economy return flights to anywhere in the world as compensation. Yet we’re being offered less than we paid for.
    • Caz3121
    • By Caz3121 12th Sep 18, 7:42 PM
    • 11,447 Posts
    • 7,494 Thanks
    Caz3121
    Yet we’re being offered less than we paid for.
    Originally posted by KC Cantiaci
    you have been offered a full refund so you can get your money back and look to book business class elsewhere or accept the premium and look to upgrade yourself in advance or at the airport
    If you look at the price deltas between economy, premium economy and business on a full service airline you will generally see a delta similar to Norwegians for economy to premium. the difference to Business is often in the £1,000s
    • KC Cantiaci
    • By KC Cantiaci 12th Sep 18, 8:25 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    KC Cantiaci
    you have been offered a full refund so you can get your money back and look to book business class elsewhere or accept the premium and look to upgrade yourself in advance or at the airport
    If you look at the price deltas between economy, premium economy and business on a full service airline you will generally see a delta similar to Norwegians for economy to premium. the difference to Business is often in the £1,000s
    Originally posted by Caz3121
    Yes...to a point. But we picked these flights because of what you get for the price. If it’s down to price and the price of available economy tickets rises to a similar level, should we only accept what the same money buys when availability is reduced? The reality is that the cost of the flights have gone up since we originally booked so if we take the refund and try and get anything similar, we’ll be out of pocket. Even if we choose to go back to economy (as we wouldn’t pay such prices for Premium Economy as in our opinion, it’s not good value for money), we would be paying more for the flight than we would have when we oringinally booked with Norwegian. So we’d still be out of pocket. Plus, as I said, we’d now have to fly from Heathrow so this incurs additional cost and time to us.

    People claim and get compensation for flights delayed by mere hours yet here we are being inconvenienced in multiple ways and whatever way it goes, we’re going to be worse off, yet there is nothing being offered to compensate for this. Compensation is supposed to be a recognition of loss yet here, it’s not being recognised. Norwegian elected to pull the route when there were live bookings attached to it so that should incur a cost for what is a business decision. They could have honoured the bookings and pulled the plug after 9 months before future timetables were announced but didn’t so surely, the least they should offer is the same or better to their affected customers.....certainly not worse.
    • Caz3121
    • By Caz3121 12th Sep 18, 9:44 PM
    • 11,447 Posts
    • 7,494 Thanks
    Caz3121
    Unless you were due to travel in the next 14 days there is no compensation under EU261. My post was to point out the discrepancy in comparing a low cost carrier premium seat with a full service business class seat. I doubt they can be forced to buy you a business class seat on another airline. Have you spoken to your travel insurance to see how they can help with your losses?
    • KC Cantiaci
    • By KC Cantiaci 12th Sep 18, 11:27 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    KC Cantiaci
    Unless you were due to travel in the next 14 days there is no compensation under EU261. My post was to point out the discrepancy in comparing a low cost carrier premium seat with a full service business class seat. I doubt they can be forced to buy you a business class seat on another airline. Have you spoken to your travel insurance to see how they can help with your losses?
    Originally posted by Caz3121
    I do understand.... my frustration is more out of the fact that they clearly aren’t going to stretch to a business class seat so we’re likely to end up with a refund and because of the time that has now elapsed, anything we book is going to cost us more than before. So we are going to be worse off no matter what we do yet Norwegian end up bearing non of the responsibility for the situation we’re in created by their decisions. But I think they should as that’s the very definition of compensation and taking responsibility for their actions.

    I asked them for a re-route via economy and maybe a future credit of premium class flights to somewhere else of our choosing but the assistant said she can’t do that. So I’ve asked for re-route via economy and a balance refund.....and even then, she’s having to ask if this can be done so I’m waiting yet another day to see what the monetary difference will be. My concern with the delays in getting a decision is the fact that we’re now down to only 2 flights with availability..... the alternatives/choices are getting less and less.
    • jpsartre
    • By jpsartre 13th Sep 18, 8:22 AM
    • 3,497 Posts
    • 2,230 Thanks
    jpsartre
    But it’s not the same. Norwegian call it Premium, not Premium Economy. Some critics and commentators liken it to Business Class. To be honest, it’s somewhere in between
    Originally posted by KC Cantiaci

    The actual product may be somewhere between premium economy (on some airlines) and business class but it's sold as an economy cabin and attracts the reduced APD rate (unlike business class seats). I understand the frustration but legally there's not anything you can do as far as I can see.
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