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    • $nake eye$
    • By $nake eye$ 10th Mar 18, 7:45 PM
    • 361 Posts
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    $nake eye$
    Not on a package, just the standard flight as i had my own accommodation. But was put up for the night with Jet2 holidays in a decent hotel.
    • NoviceAngel
    • By NoviceAngel 10th Mar 18, 8:00 PM
    • 2,034 Posts
    • 608 Thanks
    NoviceAngel
    Not on a package, just the standard flight as i had my own accommodation. But was put up for the night with Jet2 holidays in a decent hotel.
    Originally posted by $nake eye$
    Thank you for that, that’s all very interesting to us, because if you read about my experience in Paris (last couple of pages) we were left to fend for ourselves and denied care.

    I’m glad at least J2 appear to have looked after some passengers.
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    • Tyzap
    • By Tyzap 10th Mar 18, 11:41 PM
    • 1,386 Posts
    • 638 Thanks
    Tyzap
    Hello, I was due to be on a flight from Malaga to Leeds Bradford last week which was cancelled due to snow at LBA. We were given a flight 24hrs later and put up in a hotel, but can I still claim compensation?
    Originally posted by $nake eye$
    This is what Bott & Co think about EC's and bad weather...

    https://www.bottonline.co.uk/flight-delay-compensation/claim-guides/flight-compensation-bad-weather

    So it may be worth using their delay calculator.

    Good luck.
    Please read Vaubans superb guide. To find it Google and then download 'vaubans guide'.
    • NoviceAngel
    • By NoviceAngel 11th Mar 18, 8:08 AM
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    NoviceAngel
    Ive just run my cancelled flights through Botts calculator

    LS316 1/3 Claim 250 Euros
    LS316 2/3 Claim 250 Euros
    LS316 4/3 we need to investigate

    Im not sure why they are saying we could claim for the first two? Am I missing something?
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    • Caz3121
    • By Caz3121 11th Mar 18, 8:17 AM
    • 11,195 Posts
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    Caz3121
    there have been a number of reports about incorrect responses...EUClaim show extraordinary circumstances/no payment for all 3 flights...
    • NoviceAngel
    • By NoviceAngel 11th Mar 18, 8:28 AM
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    NoviceAngel
    there have been a number of reports about incorrect responses...EUClaim show extraordinary circumstances/no payment for all 3 flights...
    Originally posted by Caz3121
    Thanks Caz, I could see Vauban having to amend his guide.

    I was just dreaming of a few hundred Euros, didnt last long though.

    There have been long term discussions on here about knock on weather delays, Mark2spark wrote a piece about them arguing that they do NOT count as an EC because the bad weather didnt directly affect the flight in question. I think thats largely been disregarded now.

    Although Botts still say

    Bad weather must also affect the flight in question in order for airlines to use it as a defence. If your flight was delayed because of the knock-on effects of a different flight being affected by bad weather, your flight should be claimable.

    So their might be some mileage in that for some potential claimants.

    Given all that - does raise the question that relates to my flights. The outward LS315 from Leeds Bradford could not take off because of bad weather. Ok I can agree an EC here for passengers on that flight. However, the flight in question LS316 was NOT affected by snow at CDG and the flight could have been diverted to Man, I personally dont think theres much mileage in that but as Mark2spark would always say, I am not a lawyer.
    Last edited by NoviceAngel; 11-03-2018 at 9:08 AM.
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    • Tyzap
    • By Tyzap 11th Mar 18, 10:23 AM
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    Tyzap
    NoviceAngel,

    I believe that you would have nothing to lose if you were to put your three claims for 261 compensation into the hands of Bott & Co. Then pursue your claim for repayment of costs with J2 yourself.

    You would probably need to talk to Botts flight delay team to explain your unusual triple claim first tho, but as the saying goes, 'nothing ventured, nothing gained'
    Please read Vaubans superb guide. To find it Google and then download 'vaubans guide'.
    • JPears
    • By JPears 11th Mar 18, 10:55 AM
    • 3,683 Posts
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    JPears
    I still don't get the " knock on delay due to weather maybe an EC"
    Reg. 261/2004 is quite clear about this in preamble paragraph 14 -

    "(14) As under the Montreal Convention, obligations on operating air carriers should be limited or excluded in cases where an event has been caused by extraordinary circumstances which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken. Such circumstances may, in particular, occur in cases of political instability, meteorological conditions incompatible with the operation of the flight concerned, security risks, unexpected flight safety shortcomings and strikes that affect the operation of an operating air carrier."
    Two aspects of this paragraph.
    1. "may" the preamble use of may is ambiguous, it doesn't state that weather affecting an aircraft is always in EC, leaving the door open to Bott's interpretation.
    2. The flight concerned. This is not ambiguous. It concerns the flight, not the aircraft concerned, which is how the airlines want to interpret this.
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    • NoviceAngel
    • By NoviceAngel 11th Mar 18, 12:18 PM
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    • 608 Thanks
    NoviceAngel
    NoviceAngel,

    I believe that you would have nothing to lose if you were to put your three claims for 261 compensation into the hands of Bott & Co. Then pursue your claim for repayment of costs with J2 yourself.

    You would probably need to talk to Botts flight delay team to explain your unusual triple claim first tho, but as the saying goes, 'nothing ventured, nothing gained'
    Originally posted by Tyzap
    I think I'll give them a call Monday morning...

    I did a bit of digging and found the original post from Mark2spark http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.php?p=59429463&postcount=580

    and another few Court cases:
    https://www.flightdelays.co.uk/blog/2015/1395/another-weather-court-victory-for-flight-delays

    https://www.flightdelays.co.uk/blog/2015/1388/another-win-at-court-for-flight-delays

    Cheers

    NoviceAngel
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    • NoviceAngel
    • By NoviceAngel 11th Mar 18, 12:23 PM
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    NoviceAngel
    I still don't get the " knock on delay due to weather maybe an EC"
    Reg. 261/2004 is quite clear about this in preamble paragraph 14 -
    Originally posted by JPears
    You are right, but I don't think it's one I'd feel confident arguing in Court myself, but Tyzap is correct, I could let Botts have a go IF they are willing to take it on, anyone fancy another trip to the Supreme Court
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    • Tyzap
    • By Tyzap 11th Mar 18, 1:41 PM
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    Tyzap
    Originally posted by NoviceAngel
    A couple of good finds there Novice!

    Both decisions came via highly experienced flight delay judges based at Liverpool, who really do understand the regulations.

    Having re read the relevant arguments it seems very clear cut, you are due, I believe, 2x EC261 compensation. I don't think you're final flight on the Sunday would qualify as it was not 3 or more hours late was it? plus all your costs of course.

    No doubt J2 will just 'raise the draw bridge' again
    Please read Vaubans superb guide. To find it Google and then download 'vaubans guide'.
    • NoviceAngel
    • By NoviceAngel 11th Mar 18, 1:59 PM
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    NoviceAngel
    A couple of good finds there Novice!

    Both decisions came via highly experienced flight delay judges based at Liverpool, who really do understand the regulations.

    Having re read the relevant arguments it seems very clear cut, you are due, I believe, 2x EC261 compensation. I don't think you're final flight on the Sunday would qualify as it was not 3 or more hours late was it? plus all your costs of course.

    No doubt J2 will just 'raise the draw bridge' again
    Originally posted by Tyzap
    We did actually have Thursdays, Fridays and finally Sundays flights cancelled, finally returning on the Monday.

    Let’s hope Botts will take it on.
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    • Tyzap
    • By Tyzap 11th Mar 18, 7:30 PM
    • 1,386 Posts
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    Tyzap
    We did actually have Thursdays, Fridays and finally Sundays flights cancelled, finally returning on the Monday.

    Let’s hope Botts will take it on.
    Originally posted by NoviceAngel
    Yes, of course.

    You could be setting a new record here, 3x compensation for essentially the same flight.
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    • NoviceAngel
    • By NoviceAngel 11th Mar 18, 10:54 PM
    • 2,034 Posts
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    NoviceAngel
    Novice, have you emailed CAA with a copy of Jet2's misinformation to patients?
    Originally posted by JPears
    No I hadnt at the time, but now ive sent a nice slow mail letter to Mr Haines, asking him to remind Jet2.com of the law and suggesting that they use their new enterprise powers to ensure they do fully comply with EC261/2004

    I know this thread has been quiet for the last 12 months, I thought I might go back to knitting my Mum a scarf for mothers day, the scarf will wait - sorry Mum xxxx
    Last edited by NoviceAngel; 11-03-2018 at 11:50 PM. Reason: What!!!8217;s all the silly numbers every time you post an apostrophe ?
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    • shottsguy22
    • By shottsguy22 13th Mar 18, 5:24 PM
    • 28 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    shottsguy22
    So after around two weeks today I received a 400 Euro refund and the price of my reserved seat I couldnt use. Only problem is theyve now asked my wife who still travels in her maiden name as she hasnt updated her passport to write confirming she gives her permission for me to claim on her behalf. They did say that as soon as they had this they would issue that cheque as well
    • Tyzap
    • By Tyzap 13th Mar 18, 5:54 PM
    • 1,386 Posts
    • 638 Thanks
    Tyzap
    Great news, well done shottsguy22
    Last edited by Tyzap; 13-03-2018 at 7:35 PM.
    Please read Vaubans superb guide. To find it Google and then download 'vaubans guide'.
    • NoviceAngel
    • By NoviceAngel 13th Mar 18, 7:29 PM
    • 2,034 Posts
    • 608 Thanks
    NoviceAngel
    It is indeed a good result, they are making you work for it, but don’t give up you’re on the winning streak.
    After reading PtL Vaubans Guide , please don't desert us, hang around and help others!

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    • shottsguy22
    • By shottsguy22 13th Mar 18, 8:09 PM
    • 28 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    shottsguy22
    Thanks I’m glad it hasn’t been too much hassle so far
    • jpsartre
    • By jpsartre 14th Mar 18, 8:09 AM
    • 3,162 Posts
    • 2,079 Thanks
    jpsartre
    I still don't get the " knock on delay due to weather maybe an EC"
    Reg. 261/2004 is quite clear about this in preamble paragraph 14 -
    Originally posted by JPears
    What is clear (I think) is that bad weather directly affecting the operation of a flight is extraordinary with respect to that flight. Nothing follows from this about whether cancellations/delays due to knock-on effects from bad weather are also extraordinary.
    Last edited by jpsartre; 14-03-2018 at 8:14 AM.
    • JPears
    • By JPears 14th Mar 18, 8:37 AM
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    • 1,024 Thanks
    JPears
    What is clear (I think) is that bad weather directly affecting the operation of a flight is extraordinary with respect to that flight. Nothing follows from this about whether cancellations/delays due to knock-on effects from bad weather are also extraordinary.
    Originally posted by jpsartre
    With the wording of the regulation, it could even be argued that bad weather is not always a definite EC.
    The regualtion states "may", not is. May is a very ambiguous word..expressing possibility.
    But that may be harsh on the airlines?
    If you're new. read The FAQ and Vauban's Guide

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