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  • FIRST POST
    • MSE Martin
    • By MSE Martin 4th Apr 05, 4:52 PM
    • 8,111Posts
    • 42,248Thanks
    MSE Martin
    Why haven't I written about line rental?
    • #1
    • 4th Apr 05, 4:52 PM
    Why haven't I written about line rental? 4th Apr 05 at 4:52 PM
    I've been e-mailed a lot recently by people saying "did you know you can save on line rental with One.Tel?". Yes BT monthly line rental is 10.50 a month, but now One.Tel offers the same for 9.99 - that's a saving of 6 a year and other big providers are making similar offerings.

    Let me just clarify a few things before I start.

    * Line rental is simply a payment for the line.

    * Call providers can be one of two options. \
    Carrier pre-select, where all your calls are routed through a single provider
    Override providers, where you need dial a prefix number to access the network.

    Now all these elements can be combined using different providers for the ultimate tariff. E.g. the current perfect set up is.

    Line Rental: BT
    Carrier Pre-Select: One.Tel (as its currently offering its free evening and weekend calls package for no monthly fee Read more
    Override Providers: call18866 daytime landline calls
    call1899 for calls to mobiles.

    So why aren't I shouting out - change, switch, move, ditch?

    Due to its monopolistic position BT is forced to allow you to use other providers via its system. Most importantly this includes the UKs cheapest call providers 18866 and 1899 (see UK's cheapest call provider article)

    Yet other landline providers are not. Their landline offerings are an attempt to get you to sign up to their Carrier Pre-Select services, so they get all the revenue from your calls. Not a good thing as overall there are much cheaper ways.

    No surprise then that in their terms and conditions they do state (I'm paraphrasing of course) 'use other people and we may block you or put your line rental up'.

    It has to be said, One.Tel has told me it won't be blocking people, yet in the past its official line and actions have differed.

    So in summary as line rental price savings are relatively small compared to cheapest call providers and the system is still in its infancy - I just wouldn't bother

    Is this a blanket piece of info?

    No. Once there's evidence this isn't a problem, it may well be the way to go in future. This isn't a no, but a not yet.

    PS. What about IT Plus?

    Ok, if you've just asked that you're good. IT Plus is another line rental provider that's been around a long time. It does have much cheaper line rental yet it doesn't allow override providers, and contracts you in for a year. However, the saving on this is so big that for very low call users (a couple of pounds a month) it is worth using.
    Last edited by MSE Martin; 05-04-2005 at 11:35 AM.
    Martin Lewis, Money Saving Expert.
    Please note, answers don't constitute financial advice, it is based on generalised journalistic research. Always ensure any decision is made with regards to your own individual circumstance.

    Don't miss out on urgent MoneySaving, get my weekly e-mail at www.moneysavingexpert.com/tips.

    Debt-Free Wannabee Official Nerd Club: (Honorary) Members number 000
Page 1
  • SteveBeeby
    • #2
    • 6th Apr 05, 5:28 PM
    We do not penalise for no calls
    • #2
    • 6th Apr 05, 5:28 PM
    In reply to your "I just wouldn't bother"

    We at Vitel are a BT wholesale service provider, we do not penalise any of our customers for only using us for line rental.

    We have no minimum call spend or do we state you must use us for calls

    We do offer calls that are not routed over any other network than BT. We do NOT CPS any calls.

    We bill both line rental and calls if used on one detailed simple to understnd bill so you you have one bill to pay rather than one for calls and one for rentals

    Business customers are welcome also

    We are quite prepared to offer a no minimum contract offer to all refferals from "Money Saving Experts" website

    All we ask is that our customers pay by Direct Debit as we have a 3 per month non DD charge.


    Regards
    Steve Beeby
    Steve@Vitel-systems.com
  • heather+tom
    • #3
    • 6th Apr 05, 6:43 PM
    PS. What about IT Plus?
    • #3
    • 6th Apr 05, 6:43 PM
    PS. What about IT Plus?


    ...We would be very CAREFUL considering IT Plus ... in addition to the 1 Year LockIn contract ... they CHARGE

    1) a massive 24.99 GBP Administration fee during SIGN UP

    2) .... Plus ... VAT , of course ...

    very 'sharp' calculated ... :-((

    3) AND YOU have to pay ... the line rental ALWAYS 3 month in ADVANCE !!!.

    We are kind of surprised ... but ... in addition to MARTIN's ... comments .... "YOU have to be a low phone monthly user .... "

    WE believe NO reasonble SAVINGS are achieved ....

    IN FACT .... this is a VERY one-sided (customer restricting) and OUTDATED retail customer relationship ... policy ... in Telecommuncations ....NO-One should enter into ... (and not just in the UK ... by the way ..)
    Last edited by heather+tom; 06-04-2005 at 6:46 PM.
  • bbb_uk
    • #4
    • 6th Apr 05, 8:05 PM
    • #4
    • 6th Apr 05, 8:05 PM
    Further to what Heather+Tom said about IT Plus, I've just scanned their terms&conditions (paragraph 1.3) and it turns out that not only are you tied to a 12 month minimum term contract but after this 12 months they then tie you to 12 months minimum term contract again, and again, and again. That is unless your quick after your 12 months you give them notice to cancel otherwise you're tied to another 12 month contract with them.

    In addition to this, Paragraph 10.2 reads, "IT reserves the right to alter its prices from time to time without notifying the customer of such alterations."

    Also, IT Plus line rental only includes what they class as a level 1 fault repair service free. For a more comprehensive fault repair an extra fee per month is payable inc for outside normal office hours repairs. Even their level 1 fault repair service that is free is a standard service and in certain circumstances additional charges may apply. More on their 'care level' (fault repair service) here http://www.itplc.com/Pricing/special.asp. Remember prices on this page are excluding VAT as pointed out by Heather+Tom.

    For further info on their t&c see http://www.itplc.com/companyinfo/itplus_terms.html
  • raeble
    • #5
    • 6th Apr 05, 8:09 PM
    • #5
    • 6th Apr 05, 8:09 PM
    When all's said and done BT really aren't that bad. Yes they have the voicemail system from hell but it's their phone bill so I don't really care, unless I'm calling from work where I have to pay a set up charge for making personal calls.
    • layces
    • By layces 6th Apr 05, 10:32 PM
    • 22 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    layces
    • #6
    • 6th Apr 05, 10:32 PM
    Added Services
    • #6
    • 6th Apr 05, 10:32 PM
    Another reason for not abandoning BT as the line rental provider is that some other companies do not provide all of the additional services like call forwarding, ring back, etc. I was tempted by Toucan at one time but soon changed my mind!
  • Essu
    • #7
    • 7th Apr 05, 8:13 AM
    • #7
    • 7th Apr 05, 8:13 AM
    What about company called Utility Warehouse based in London? They claim to be able to sell cheaper than One.Tel in phone calls and cheaper than anyone else in electricity. Has anyone managed to decipher their pricing schedules to see if this is true? They work on Discount Club basis.
  • mbspuk
    • #8
    • 7th Apr 05, 8:25 AM
    • #8
    • 7th Apr 05, 8:25 AM
    In reply to your "I just wouldn't bother"

    We at Vitel are a BT wholesale service provider, we do not penalise any of our customers for only using us for line rental.

    We have no minimum call spend or do we state you must use us for calls

    We do offer calls that are not routed over any other network than BT. We do NOT CPS any calls.

    We bill both line rental and calls if used on one detailed simple to understnd bill so you you have one bill to pay rather than one for calls and one for rentals

    Business customers are welcome also

    We are quite prepared to offer a no minimum contract offer to all refferals from "Money Saving Experts" website

    All we ask is that our customers pay by Direct Debit as we have a 3 per month non DD charge.


    Regards
    by SteveBeeby

    Steve

    that sounds like a good start to me.

    What do you say Martin?

    Martin
  • DaveO
    • #9
    • 7th Apr 05, 10:01 AM
    • #9
    • 7th Apr 05, 10:01 AM
    I haven't bothered looking into switching from BT for one reason only.

    I was under the impression that to use certain ISP's (including my own - Plus.net) you have to be with BT.

    Have I got that correct?

    Dave
  • ilovefreebies
    For the low cost saving and not being able to use the discount numbers I'll be staying put with BT
    • oldagetraveller
    • By oldagetraveller 7th Apr 05, 10:15 AM
    • 3,176 Posts
    • 1,682 Thanks
    oldagetraveller
    I use Onetel CPS with BT line so can use 18866 etc. However I contacted Onetel and asked specifically about using other services if I opted to use them for line rental. The reply was quite categorical in that I could not use other providers e.g. 18866 when paying them for line rental. Don't see the logic because it must be better for them to receive 9.99/month from me than I continue paying BT for line rental? I also use Onetel for my dial up internet and as a result of this, seriously thinking of changing ISP. So their dogged adherance to rules may lose them all my payments.
  • rappius
    I'm with NTL but use the 'one.tel' box and my problem is that NTL is not offering broadband in my area of North London. My alternative has been to download 'onspeed yesterday but I haven't got to grips with it yet. It's had good reports from they who should know but any advice would be welcome. Also I have been using 'ratebuster' with its annoying yankee voice, but Onetel charges me the first minute at its 4.8p rate and thereafter 1p per minute so it's OK for lengthy calls. I'm going to try 18866 and 1899 for the mobile.
    • Clowance
    • By Clowance 7th Apr 05, 10:49 AM
    • 1,652 Posts
    • 1,136 Thanks
    Clowance
    Stuck with cable - Any suggestions
    Hi,
    In my area we can only get Freeview TV channels via cable, not via transmitter. Therefore we also have NTL cable telephone and hence are forced to have NTL broadband as all other broadbands require a BT line.
    We would like to switch broadband provider but this means having to pay 2 line rentals. Do any money saving experts have a solution for this? Our telephone use is minimal.
  • andy88
    I use Onetel CPS with BT line so can use 18866 etc. However I contacted Onetel and asked specifically about using other services if I opted to use them for line rental. The reply was quite categorical in that I could not use other providers e.g. 18866 when paying them for line rental. Don't see the logic because it must be better for them to receive 9.99/month from me than I continue paying BT for line rental? I also use Onetel for my dial up internet and as a result of this, seriously thinking of changing ISP. So their dogged adherance to rules may lose them all my payments.
    by oldagetraveller
    All the providers that will collect line rental direct presumably have to pay a wholesale rental to BT, so I think you're being a little unfair to Onetel here. Maybe they make 1 or 2 not 10. It's mainly for billing convenience to customers not profit.

    Perhaps in future some of the discount ideas will feed through to line rental. But with blocking of other providers, I doubt that there will be any advantage except for very low users, who will hardly be the most sought-after customers

    I don't think we need to hold our breath waiting for cheaper line rentals, unless something can be done with broadband prices bundled in cheaper
    Last edited by andy88; 07-04-2005 at 11:12 AM.
    • chiny
    • By chiny 7th Apr 05, 12:58 PM
    • 131 Posts
    • 40 Thanks
    chiny
    I use cable (Telewest) for the phone with a rental of 10.50/month including free calls at the weekend. ISTR BT is much more expensive. This does mean I cannot get ADSL but cable broadband has proved very reliable and fast.

    I do keep an eye on Bulldog (non-cable, non-BT contract) which looks good for 12 months of offers if you already have a BT line.

    Chiny
  • SteveBeeby
    I haven't bothered looking into switching from BT for one reason only.

    In reply to "I was under the impression that to use certain ISP's (including my own - Plus.net) you have to be with BT.

    Have I got that correct?

    Dave"

    Dave you would still be with BT as we are a BT wholesale Service Provider
    Steve Beeby
    Steve@Vitel-systems.com
  • April2
    I use cable (Telewest) for the phone with a rental of 10.50/month including free calls at the weekend. ISTR BT is much more expensive.

    Chiny
    by chiny
    BT line rental is also 10.50/month but, surprise, surprise, they don't include any free calls.

    However, most people on here with a BT line will use CPS (OneTel, TalkTalk or whoever) so they get free weekend or free weekend AND evening calls (the latter for 12 months).
  • andy88
    Dave you would still be with BT as we are a BT wholesale Service Provider
    by SteveBeeby
    Steve your site has no mention of prices that I can see
  • Edinburghlass
    What about company called Utility Warehouse based in London? They claim to be able to sell cheaper than One.Tel in phone calls and cheaper than anyone else in electricity. Has anyone managed to decipher their pricing schedules to see if this is true? They work on Discount Club basis.
    by Essu
    Utility Warehouse is TelecomPlus by another name, not got the best of reputations and yes you have to have all your utilities with the company to make any appreciable savings.
    Martin has asked me to tell you that I'm the Board Guide of the Telephones, Reclaim Bank Charges, Silver Savers and Scotland boards which means I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly and I can move and merge threads there. Pease remember, board guides don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com. Board guides don't deal with this. Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.
  • EdCov
    I was a customer of LocalTel (they provided free internet access) if you paid your line rental through them. The problem was that we kept on having the phone ring and there was no one there, it could of been a nuisance caller or it could have been a technical fault, I always suspected the latter.

    I phoned up LocalTel who were responsible for my line, I think I did try BT but when I gave them my number they told me I had to go to my provider. Later I tried to phone my wife and the number did not work, puzzling I thought, I phoned up LocalTel, they had contacted BT and BT had changed our number. No discussion, no nothing, just changed our number without even telling us.

    I am probably wrong, but it almost felt like a punishment from BT. So we had to quickly tell everyone our number had changed, which was a real pain, and of course when we asked them to change the number back because we had not requested it, that was impossible.

    I probably ought to have gone to the regulator and kicked up a fuss, but if you are with another provider on BT, and you have problems you may not get the same service.
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