Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • MSE Jenny
    • By MSE Jenny 27th Oct 09, 5:32 PM
    • 1,228Posts
    • 3,559Thanks
    MSE Jenny
    MONEY MORAL DILEMMA. Should Karl let the neighbours use his garden?
    • #1
    • 27th Oct 09, 5:32 PM
    MONEY MORAL DILEMMA. Should Karl let the neighbours use his garden? 27th Oct 09 at 5:32 PM
    Here's this week's hypothetical situation for you to cogitate on:

    Should Karl let the neighbours use his garden?

    Karl's just bought a new ground floor flat with its own private garden. Yet after moving in, he finds that the couple in the flat above are using the garden to hang washing out and occasionally to relax in. They were good friends with the previous owners who were fine with this, and they ask Karl nicely if he wouldn’t mind letting them use it. Should Karl let them keep using the garden?

    Click reply to have your say

    Previous MMDs: View All

    This Forum Tip was included in MoneySavingExpert's weekly email

    Don't miss out on new deals, loopholes, and vouchers

Page 1
    • mrbrightside842
    • By mrbrightside842 27th Oct 09, 5:36 PM
    • 1,239 Posts
    • 1,983 Thanks
    mrbrightside842
    • #2
    • 27th Oct 09, 5:36 PM
    • #2
    • 27th Oct 09, 5:36 PM
    It depends if Karl minds. He's every right to say no, that they cannot use his garden. But if it's no hassle to him and he's not fussed about it, then it wouldn't be worth him saying no.
    • Nessynoo
    • By Nessynoo 27th Oct 09, 5:38 PM
    • 450 Posts
    • 1,056 Thanks
    Nessynoo
    • #3
    • 27th Oct 09, 5:38 PM
    • #3
    • 27th Oct 09, 5:38 PM
    If they are happy to share the upkeep/maintenance/lawnmowing, then yes. Let them share.
    "It's official, MSE's harbouring total fruitcakes"
    >^..^<
  • bigmuffins
    • #4
    • 27th Oct 09, 5:42 PM
    • #4
    • 27th Oct 09, 5:42 PM
    In my view, he should say sorry but no, at the beginning. This is because, although it may not bother him initially, it probably will later on - he will find that they are using the garden/hanging out washing when he wants to use it and will feel awkward in his own garden. Once he has said yes, he won't be able to say no!
    • mrbrightside842
    • By mrbrightside842 27th Oct 09, 5:44 PM
    • 1,239 Posts
    • 1,983 Thanks
    mrbrightside842
    • #5
    • 27th Oct 09, 5:44 PM
    • #5
    • 27th Oct 09, 5:44 PM
    In my view, he should say sorry but no, at the beginning. This is because, although it may not bother him initially, it probably will later on - he will find that they are using the garden/hanging out washing when he wants to use it and will feel awkward in his own garden. Once he has said yes, he won't be able to say no!
    Originally posted by bigmuffins
    That's very true. If he were to say yes, he'd have to set rules at the start, and he probably wouldn't think that far ahead. I don't think it would bother me if they were just nipping out with their washing, as long as they didn't have to get through my flat for it or anything like that, but I wouldn't like them socialising in it or using it for leisure when they fancied.
    • scotsbob
    • By scotsbob 27th Oct 09, 6:18 PM
    • 4,462 Posts
    • 6,958 Thanks
    scotsbob
    • #6
    • 27th Oct 09, 6:18 PM
    • #6
    • 27th Oct 09, 6:18 PM
    He rents it to them if he doesn't mind (might as well have it earning)

    If he does mind, he tells them no.
    • 6022tivo
    • By 6022tivo 27th Oct 09, 11:35 PM
    • 548 Posts
    • 130 Thanks
    6022tivo
    • #7
    • 27th Oct 09, 11:35 PM
    • #7
    • 27th Oct 09, 11:35 PM
    Its a YES as long as they fully maintain it.
  • shuey
    • #8
    • 28th Oct 09, 12:18 AM
    • #8
    • 28th Oct 09, 12:18 AM
    He should seek to maximise his earning potential with least effort. He should draw up a garden lease with specific clauses in it as to:

    - times of useage to determine his / their expected utility
    - required rent (e.g. £5 per week)
    - maintenance of garden - ideally he should maximise his return on investment with least effort but this may have to be negotiated. Also wear and tear on the garden and associated costs need to be taken into account
    - He should look to give them a discount if they pay upfront for the year ie security of garden rent eg, £200 for whole years useage.
    - should think about ancillary issues such as if the garden is constantly in use the building may be less prone to burglars etc
    Last edited by shuey; 28-10-2009 at 12:24 AM.
    • Cloudane
    • By Cloudane 28th Oct 09, 12:26 AM
    • 499 Posts
    • 355 Thanks
    Cloudane
    • #9
    • 28th Oct 09, 12:26 AM
    • #9
    • 28th Oct 09, 12:26 AM
    Difficult one to answer - I'm not Karl! It's really up to him and his personality.

    If they seem like reasonable people I'd say yes... never know, we might end up friends. As we don't know each other properly yet I'd probably say "for a beer now and then" - most people I seem to encounter are really nice if you are nice to them, and would probably end up dropping off a whole multipack on a regular basis

    But that's just me. I wouldn't say it's morally wrong to say no, and I doubt they'd hold it against him. Might be more of an ice maker than an ice breaker, but depends how important your privacy is to yourself!
  • stogiebear
    No way.

    Ground floor flats pay a premium for the garden and the thought of looking at someones smalls flapping around out side is repellent. Also - people have a tendency to take advantage - and what starts off as a weekly wash for one neighbor may end up being a daily eyesore when the rest of the block of inhabitants decide to do the same.

    But if you were a nicer person than I am you could simply say - 'sure... use the garden during the day while I am at work ONLY!'

    But even this is expression of community spirit is apt to get abused.

    No - Be firm and friendly from the VERY first day. Be consistent and let all people know what to expect from you. Explain nicely but firmly that you have plans for the garden so they should invest in a dryer.
  • Loyaultimilie
    I wouldn't .......... he might not mind now, but he could do later. He is paying rent on it anyway so why should they get the benefit? Unless he charges them a small rent.
  • weemeanie
    No way
    Karl has paid more to have a garden flat so why should he share? The neighbours are just trying it on. So what if they were friendly with the last eejit who lived there?
  • martinrdg1
    No way
    He should be concerned as in the future when he comes to sell his flat these people may claim to the new owner that they have some right to use the garden because of maybe some stupid law that says if they have been using it for a period of time they acquire certain rights. He could then face a claim from the new buyer etc etc

    My grandad let out a field to a neighbour as a favour and when we came to sell the house and land after he died, the neighbours claimed some such right so we had to sell the house without the land and 20 years later we still receive rent- thats what happens when you try to be nice to people.
  • Cloverleaves
    At the very least, if he is willing to let the neighbours use the garden (I'm afraid I wouldn't want to, but that's just me), he should get a signed agreement that it is just a concession, and can be cancelled at any time (preferably this v. short agreement should be looked over by a lawyer), as post #13 is correct - you want to be very careful you haven't created a legal precedent. I deal with commercial properties (not residential, to be fair), but if you agree that someone can have a right of some kind, rather than a temporary concession, it can come back to bite you.
  • triticale
    Simply no. Privacy is priceless, and written agreements/conditions are just not worth the hassle.
    • geri1965
    • By geri1965 28th Oct 09, 7:32 AM
    • 8,366 Posts
    • 14,004 Thanks
    geri1965
    I think I would say no, in his position. I assume he wants a garden, which is why he chose a garden flat!
  • mumslave
    Only if he minds. I had a ground floor flat with garden, used to let the neighbours kids upstairs come down and play in it. But if he minded then tell them no.

    Sealed Pot Challenge Member 1189
    • toadhall
    • By toadhall 28th Oct 09, 8:00 AM
    • 320 Posts
    • 72 Thanks
    toadhall
    No, if the upstairs people want a garden they should have bought it instead of Karl.
    • dillydilly
    • By dillydilly 28th Oct 09, 8:10 AM
    • 168 Posts
    • 133 Thanks
    dillydilly
    my first reaction was a No, but then remembered we are in a similar position to which our neighbour said yes, and would have been very upset if they hadn't. Not so much a garden, but a communal car park outside our houses where the deeds quote we have a 'right of egress'. It wasn't until we moved in and the neighbour blocked our car that we discovered this meant the right to park temporarily to unload, then move on. Obviously this caused some tension between us, and when they subsequently moved out the new owners scoffed at the mentality and said as far as they were concerned its first come first served - we get on a lot better with them... Compromise - a nice garden is nearly as valuable as neighbours you get on with...
  • dawsar
    I would have to say "No" as Karl bought the flat with the PRIVATE garden. Just because the previous owners had an agreement, doesn't mean that Karl has to honour it. The garden belongs to Karl. If the neighbours want a garden, it is their responsibility to sell up and buy somewhere with a garden. They are taking advantage of Karl and the previous owner .
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

2,202Posts Today

7,360Users online

Martin's Twitter